So when does SE plan to credit our accounts for the multiple ongoing service issues?

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Originally Posted by Elspath

a escape goat

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lol

/10chars

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Originally Posted by winsock

Who cares? Setting the ToU stuff aside, the ethical thing to do would be to compensate people in some way. It's a common practice and the ToU doesnt prevent SE from compensating people.

If you cant get your mind of the ToU and I join in on playing lawyer, the line i snipped would be the one i would contest. You are only speculating that SE is delivering quality and connectivity to the very best of their abilities. I would speculate that they are delivering the quality and connectivity that they can within the game's budget, which is a very different thing.

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The thing is that you have no idea how SE had set up the delivery and connectivity. You do not know who is the customer of the ISP. Is the customer of the ISP the server company, SE, or a third party?

Do you know which of the entity are responsible for the access circuits, the routers, device maintenance, etc.?

As someone who specializes in customization within a large telecommunications and internet company, I see few ways how SE "set up" the connectivity:

-SE/Server Company manages the routers to the servers and owns the maintenance of those routers. SE sets up their own firewalls. The ISP only provides transport (meaning the line) and access circuits to the routers. If the customer of the ISP is the Server Company, than SE has no control over connectivity whatsoever.
-The ISP manages the routers to the servers and owns the maintenance of those routers. This also allows the ISP to establish firewalls. ISP also provides the transport and access circuits as well. It doesn't matter is SE or the server company are the customer of the ISP or each other at this level.
-ISP manages the routers, but maintenance is owned by SE or the server company. ISP can establish firewalls. ISP also provides the transport and access circuits as well. It doesn't matter is SE or the server company are the customer of the ISP or each other at this level.

We also don't know the makeup of the site:
-is it a single threaded circuit sites?
-is it a dual threaded circuit site with no failover? Failover bascially meaning that is a circuit goes down, the other circuit will take over or take on the extra load from the downed circuit.
-is it dual threaded circuit site with failover?

Seeing that the DDOS attacks are not even taking down anything, just making life rough for gamers, I can guarantee that the server company or SE is not even getting a credit from the ISP unless they have a custom service level agreement that allows that to happen.

Expecting SE to provide us a credit, even ethically, is laughable from how I am seeing this.

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Originally Posted by winsock

Who cares? Setting the ToU stuff aside, the ethical thing to do would be to compensate people in some way. It's a common practice and the ToU doesnt prevent SE from compensating people.

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SE is not the one doing the attacks, SE is on the receiving end of it. They are as much a victim of the attacks as you are. Since when is it ethical to make a victim compensate another victim for something they have no control over?

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Originally Posted by winsock

If you cant get your mind of the ToU and I join in on playing lawyer, the line i snipped would be the one i would contest. You are only speculating that SE is delivering quality and connectivity to the very best of their abilities. I would speculate that they are delivering the quality and connectivity that they can within the game's budget, which is a very different thing.

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You'd make a bad lawyer if you did this. Their ability to deliver service is directly tied to their budget, your statement makes no sense. You also have no knowledge about hard they are or are not working to deliver quality service; you chose to believe they aren't doing their best despite it being in their best interest to do so and despite the fact that they've said so and the evidence all pointing to them doing so. There is no amount of money in the world that will make a company immune to a DDOS attack. You can mitigate its effects but you can't stop it and with the exponential growth of the Internet of Things and non existant security on those devices, the scale of the attacks is significantly outpacing the ability to mitigate through more capacity or faster hardware or more efficient software.

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Originally Posted by Elspath

I don't believe for a instant Squares excuse that evil hackers are the problems and the reason for all are problems. Its a escape goat and a easy excuse for there cheep servers.

As for when square will do anything about it? Well guess what! Buy the new FF(random number here) the next new Great MMO with all new server tech that will never fail! (tell it does)

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Except that lots of users have traceroutes with evidence that the problem is delay and packet loss within NTT's network. If you bothered to read these forums before jumping to conclusions, you'd know that DDoS attacks are already well proven as the cause of these problems. People who have no idea what is going on and are too lazy to do a little basic research should not be allowed to post their crazy networking theories on the internet.

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Originally Posted by winsock

Who cares? Setting the ToU stuff aside, the ethical thing to do would be to compensate people in some way. It's a common practice and the ToU doesnt prevent SE from compensating people.

If you cant get your mind of the ToU and I join in on playing lawyer, the line i snipped would be the one i would contest. You are only speculating that SE is delivering quality and connectivity to the very best of their abilities. I would speculate that they are delivering the quality and connectivity that they can within the game's budget, which is a very different thing.

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Someone give this baby a mega-ranger already. It's clear he has been the spoiled, entitled type and won't shut up until he gets his toy.

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Originally Posted by winsock

You are only speculating that SE is delivering quality and connectivity to the very best of their abilities. I would speculate that they are delivering the quality and connectivity that they can within the game's budget, which is a very different thing.

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It... really isnt.

Like it or not, the game has a set budget to stay within, and if they were to exceed that, I have no doubt that the upper management at SE would be having some very serious talks about how to either increase the monetization, or shut down the game.

SE delivering quality and connectivity to the best of their ability is infact "to the best of their ability and budget"
Trying to argue otherwise just seems like you're arguing semantics.

And while the ToS doesnt prevent them from compensating people, it absolutely gives them no legal reason to do it, as you already agreed to the clause within it.

I'd also like to ask in what world does it make sense to demand the victim to cough up compensation for being a victim.

To those complaining that Squeenix should give them something please go here and learn how the internet works.

Stop demanding to be compensated for something that is not even Squeenix's fault. No one has to give you anything. Get over yourselves.

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Originally Posted by Alien_Gamer

SE is not the one doing the attacks, SE is on the receiving end of it. They are as much a victim of the attacks as you are. Since when is it ethical to make a victim compensate another victim for something they have no control over?

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Equifax would be a good recent example. They didn't hack themselves.

Also, we are compensating SE, ie 1 victim compensating another.

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Originally Posted by winsock

Equifax would be a good recent example. They didn't hack themselves.

Also, we are compensating SE, ie 1 victim compensating another.

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Terrible comparison. Equifax is a “victim”, but the breach is largely the result of incompetence among other things. Plus they were targeted directly.

Our ongoing connection issues are caused by someone attacking a third party outside of SE’s control so there really isn’t anything they can do about it. We’re literally caught in the middle of a fight between the ISPs that just so happen to serve SE and whatever berk decided to DDoS them.

If anyone owes you compensation it would be the ISPs being attacked, but you seem desperate to blame SE no matter what anyone says so I don’t even know why I’m bothering.

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Originally Posted by winsock

Equifax would be a good recent example. They didn't hack themselves.

Also, we are compensating SE, ie 1 victim compensating another.

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You...should probably stop, its clear you don't know what you're talking about. No equifax didn't hack themselves, they got hacked but what made it such a big deal is Equifax is the company that IS SUPPOSED TO KEEP YOUR DATA SECURE and they didn't. Equifax failed in their duty to protect your data by having lax server security therefore they were not doing their job when peoples data got stolen, IE it was their fault. In this instance SE isn't even being attacked themselves, its the ISP that is being attacked. The two situations are so different your attempt to link them is almost comical.


Also we are not compensating SE. We are paying them for a service, access to their game and SE has given it to us. SE has met the duty that we pay them for.
That the ISP is unable to carry your signal is a completely different issue. You should be taking up your complaint with the the people running the attack, not trying to get something for nothing from SE.