Implications of Social-Construct terms of "Humanity" and "Beast"

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Originally Posted by Vyrerus

You're getting a little heavy handed here. Jandor's just trying to say and reinforce that there are differences, and that's why the use of the term beastman has spread around. As well as why the beastmen refer to the spoken races as stuff like, "Shorewalker" "Uplander" "Walking Ones" etc. As much as there is an othering by the Spoken races, the beastmen often other the spoken as well. The beastmen themselves acknowledge their differences, and they are quite proud of themselves in a lot of cases (particularly where their differences allow them advantages, such as inborn flight or breathing underwater).

Also, don't forget that even learned people like Sharlayans, who are technically not Eorzean, even use the term beastmen. Look further still to the Auspice questline in Stormblood. A kojin takes on the role of Genbu and eventually becomes a spiritually inclined Adamantoise. Despite what the devs say, there are differences.

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Not exactly. The Sharlayans were part of the Eorzean alliance till they left it recently, and they're descendants of Eorzean colonists that were brought over to the island by Nyunkrepf Nyunkrepfsyn 1,500 years ago. The term was first created in Ul-dah as a socio-political term to persecute those they despised(amaljaa among others). The term is never used in Norvrandt for example(the First), or in the case with Lupins who are not considered as such by the locals except by the Garleans. The Hrothgar for example look just as beastly as the Lupin, but they're not considered as beasts for obvious political reasons which the latter story of FFXIV began to show that the people of Eorzea began to change their attitudes of them. Even this guy that written this wish to throw this term as useless.
https://i.redd.it/86g4mkeg00v21.jpg

fyi, Sharlayan is part of Eorzea in it's geographical location.
https://finalfantasy.fandom.com/wiki/Eorzea

The term is also used in the continent of Ilsabard as well. It doesn't diminish the idea that these terms were created by the Ulda'ans which spread all over the continent which the Garleans took that as well. The differences in physiology is apparent, but then again, so do the beastmen with each other as well. It's basically a continuum really rather than stricly this or that. Hyur look the most human obviously with the rest going in a direction from human looking to beast looking. In other words, the fact that these terms are not used in the Far East(except for Garleans and etc), or not at all in the First speaks volumes.

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Originally Posted by Strongfat900

fyi, Sharlayan is part of Eorzea in it's geographical location.
https://finalfantasy.fandom.com/wiki/Eorzea

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Sharlayan, the island place we go to in the north that is labelled as "Old Sharlayan" in our teleport menu, is not part of Eorzea.

Sharlayan, the colony place in the Dravanian Hinterlands that was abandoned fifteen years ago, is part of Eorzea.

Both are called "Sharlayan" by everyone, including people from (Old) Sharlayan and from Eorzea. When told that this causes much confusion, people from both Sharlayans went "that sounds like a you problem". If forced, they call the Dravanian Sharlayan "Emporium". (We only learn of this in Endwalker while browsing the Noumenon, so it could be something the lore team came up with offhand.)

Every time Sharlayan is referred to as one of the "city-states of Eorzea", they mean the Dravanian colony.

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Originally Posted by YianKutku

Sharlayan, the island place we go to in the north that is labelled as "Old Sharlayan" in our teleport menu, is not part of Eorzea.

Sharlayan, the colony place in the Dravanian Hinterlands that was abandoned fifteen years ago, is part of Eorzea.

Both are called "Sharlayan" by everyone, including people from (Old) Sharlayan and from Eorzea. When told that this causes much confusion, people from both Sharlayans went "that sounds like a you problem". If forced, they call the Dravanian Sharlayan "Emporium". (We only learn of this in Endwalker while browsing the Noumenon, so it could be something the lore team came up with offhand.)

Every time Sharlayan is referred to as one of the "city-states of Eorzea", they mean the Dravanian colony.

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True, but regardless, the term, beastmen, was created by the Ul-daans which was spread by the denizens of Eorzea as well as the Garleans. Y'shtola was born and raised in the colony of Sharlayan, and uses the term early in the game which the term becomes less and less used, and the reconciliation between the two began to take shape. Not to mention that the term was never used in the Far East or in the First.

And yes, the *new* Sharlayan was founded by Nyunkrepf Nyunkrepfsyn due to his prediction of the sixth umbrel calamity which he took many people into his ark to the lands that became the Eorzean Sharlayan.

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Originally Posted by Strongfat900

And yes, the *new* Sharlayan was founded by Nyunkrepf Nyunkrepfsyn due to his prediction of the sixth umbrel calamity which he took many people into his ark to the lands that became the Eorzean Sharlayan.

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Nyunkrepf didn't make New Sharlayan, he made Actual Sharlayan. He made Nyunkrepf's Hope, sailed to Eorzea to save as much of its people as he could (which I think must've been mostly Nymians but that's my vibe), and then teleported that ship out of danger, which marooned it in Gyr Abania.

From there, they journeyed up north on foot, through Abalathia's Spine and picking up people on the way, until they hit the Dravanian hinterlands, at which point he went 'okay, here's the plan: SECOND BOAT' which they use to sail to what is now Actual Sharlayan. It's possible that New Sharlayan was founded there in remembrance of his journey, but Nyunkrepf didn't build anything there except a way to get away from there.

hydaelyns history is surprisingly in-depth if you're willing to look at a few outside sources.

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Originally Posted by Cleretic

Nyunkrepf didn't make New Sharlayan, he made Actual Sharlayan. He made Nyunkrepf's Hope, sailed to Eorzea to save as much of its people as he could (which I think must've been mostly Nymians but that's my vibe), and then teleported that ship out of danger, which marooned it in Gyr Abania.

From there, they journeyed up north on foot, through Abalathia's Spine and picking up people on the way, until they hit the Dravanian hinterlands, at which point he went 'okay, here's the plan: SECOND BOAT' which they use to sail to what is now Actual Sharlayan. It's possible that New Sharlayan was founded there in remembrance of his journey, but Nyunkrepf didn't build anything there except a way to get away from there.

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Huh, thought he was the one who founded the colony. Sadly, I never played the early 1.0 build of the game to know such info. Anyway, my point still stands in regards to the topic at hand.

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Originally Posted by Strongfat900

Huh, thought he was the one who founded the colony. Sadly, I never played the early 1.0 build of the game to know such info. Anyway, my point still stands in regards to the topic at hand.

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Actually, most of that information came from the Encyclopedia Eorzea volume 1, with some extra info gluing things together from the sightseeing log.

If you don't own the Encyclopedia, it's the backbone for a lot of Gamer Escape's wiki pages, so checking there is a pretty comfy first stop.

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Originally Posted by Cleretic

Actually, most of that information came from the Encyclopedia Eorzea volume 1, with some extra info gluing things together from the sightseeing log.

If you don't own the Encyclopedia, it's the backbone for a lot of Gamer Escape's wiki pages, so checking there is a pretty comfy first stop.

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Oh. Yeah, the same encyclopedia also stated that the term, beast, is a meaningless term that should be abandoned which the editor even called the "beastmen" as simply men as well.
https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...encyclopaedia/

I believe the Japanese uses a term that more closely translate as "barbarian" - which is the exact same term Garleans use to refer to Eorzeans. I always thought that made a little more sense that "beast tribe" when it comes to excluding people the Hrothgar from the definition.

Can't quote the exact live letter or whatever, but I want to say YoshiP wanted to change the term or abandon its use in future expansions since using it with the Dwarves of the First who are obviously not "beast" men. I also want to say it was to allow for alternative uses of the beast tribe daily mechanic, such as using it with the Arkasodara which may not necessarily deal exclusively with the Matanga of Thavnair, but the entire village with humans/auri. Or alternatively something like the Omega who are certainly neither "Beasts" nor "men".

Don't know if that is actually the plan with the Arkasodara, but again, I want to say it was to give more freedom to the devs on where or how to deploy dailies.