Yoshi P / Dev Team: FAVOR System - Please Fix This BROKEN System

I think the adjustment will provide a bit of an initial boost at least since some gatherers will want to try gathering the favor items and selling them for high prices since it's easier now. I'm seeing some more listings on my server now, but prices are still high. If sales are slow however, they might not be as eager to spend their gatherer tokens.

Another thing to consider though is that a number of gatherers will soon have enough tokens to exchange for their i180 chest piece and primary tool, the most important pieces of gear. I can see some of them using additional tokens to exchange for favors if they believe that they can capitalize on high prices. The faster drop rate should increase the supply on favor items much quicker than before.

I also think time is probably an issue for some players since I could never spend over 11 hours a week gathering favor items myself. The number of red scrips weren't even a problem for me since I could never reach my weekly upper limit on favor items.

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Originally Posted by Sibyll

This current change will increase favor materials on the market. How do you know for a fact the problem was the yield per favor and not the yield per time that was discouraging people from doing these?

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Forgive me as I just woke up, but wasnt that exactly what I wrote?

There are 3 groups of people who would sell favor materials on the mb.

-Those that want to farm them for gil from the start.
-Those more interested in gearing up first, then selling them.
-Crafters who farm their own and sell their leftovers.

Favor yield per time was what discouraged those gatherers looking to make gil.
This change makes it so more of them (or any, really) will farm them for gil.


However, favors still come from red scrips meaning that those who first wanted to gear up still have to do so. The favor change won't make them farm materials and sell them on the mb.


The third group, whose biggest problem was always the limit to the materials they could obtain is a bit of an odd one. Some will now farm the favors, others still wont.
However since they are doing this to obtain materials for themselves, you wont see many more favors materials from their actions, however you will see more finished items, or refined materials.


Overall, with the favor change you will see more materials on the mb.
Something to the benefit of everyone, including those that already spend all of their own favor materials.

However for a crafter, the real limitation is still the limit on refined materials, and subsequently the limit on finished items.


That said, as prices drop I'm sure availability of materials will drop again as well. Keep in mind most people will not be very interested into favors. And those that are can only farm so many of them per week.
Right now supply is relatively high for both favor and refined materials because everyone has been saving tokens for a month.

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Originally Posted by Ranzan

I'm really not seeing how that translates to more on the market board. Cause my server they are waaaaay to much gil atm.

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Less time consuming means you are more likely to attract people interested to farm them at all. However as you say, it does not increase the maximum supply of materials on the market which is still limited with a weekly cap.

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Originally Posted by Thrustie

The problem with your argument in this scenario is that the ONLY reason currently to get the gear early is to be ready for the next set of recipes. So what have I gained from my favor participation thus far? Nothing.

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You still made the choice to do it knowing it would be easier later. If you didn't enjoy it or at least feel the head start was worth it, you can only blame yourself for assuming you'd get a reward that was never promised nor implied. It's like complaining about buying a game the week before the big Steam holiday sale. You know the sale happens every year, it's not 'unfair' when it does. You even benefit from more people to play with.

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Originally Posted by Sibyll

You mean like this?

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Yes, which is why it would have been fair for them to increase yield, reduce RNG, or any number of other potential fixes. Ideally they could give even more detailed info ahead of time, but I'll take what I can get.

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Originally Posted by Aeyis

Well thats not true. You could have made and sold items for considerably more then I'm sure they now sell for. So saying you did not gain anything from this isn't quite right. On top of that, having more items on the market benefits you as well.

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The only way I could have sold anything is at the cost of my own progression. And that's assuming I could have even sold anything had I wanted to considering how limited the market is. There's been a grand total of zero 2 star pieces sold on Adamantoise last I checked.

It does not benefit me as I am still gated by my red scrips. As I said before, I could quite easily use all my red crafting tokens weekly with the mats I farm if I bought the HQ mats now and again.

This is a really flimsy argument coming from someone who took a month to sell one offhand.

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Originally Posted by seorin

You still made the choice to do it knowing it would be easier later. If you didn't enjoy it or at least feel the head start was worth it, you can only blame yourself for assuming you'd get a reward that was never promised nor implied. It's like complaining about buying a game the week before the big Steam holiday sale. You know the sale happens every year, it's not 'unfair' when it does. You even benefit from more people to play with.

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When I started favors 5 weeks ago I had no idea they would be made easier so that's a pretty big leap. I have no one to blame for anything since they didn't increase the yield? I elected to continue to do them the last 2 weeks after the announcement adjustments would be made because I was fairly confident they would recognize that increasing the yield would be unfair and unnecessary.

Haha it's NOTHING like the comparison you just made! They're not even remotely similar! Considering they didn't even announce it until 2 weeks ago and furthermore DIDN'T increase the yield, obviously it's not at all like the certainty of your big steam sale. Wow what a stretch.

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Originally Posted by Thrustie

When I started favors 5 weeks ago I had no idea they would be made easier so that's a pretty big leap.

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If you believed it would stay exactly as it was forever, then there's not much point in having a discussion. In a month or 3.2 or 3.5 or 4.0 it'll be much easier or just replaced outright. It's a matter of when not if. The only benefit to doing it now is your head start. You get it first. You can sell for the most. If you don't care about being first and don't capitalize on the opportunity it affords you, it's not "unfair" when your work goes to waste because you wasted it yourself.

I never stated I expected it to remain this way forever. I expect it to mostly stay status quo until the carrot is introduced: 3 star recipes. I have no problem with content eventually getting nerfed as it becomes dated. The problem is I'm not "first" to anything right now. There's nothing worth crafting at this point other than crafting gear. It appears they're pushing us to prepare for whenever the next crafting patch hits. If I'm wrong and the only reward in this patch is to craft 2 star gear nobody wants then you're correct, I'm wasting my window to be first. If I'm correct though, and this patch is more about progression, if they had increased the yield everyone who banked tokens would have leap frogged me and it would have compromised my ability to be first when new recipes are introduced. That would have been frustrating for me and rendered my last few weeks as, not only a waste of time, but also a detriment to my overall progression.

It's like if they suddenly nerfed Alex Savage, doubled the chests and at the same time told everyone that every Savage floor they hadn't cleared for the past 5 weeks was banked. Now all the groups who hadn't progressed as far (or at all) could quickly catch the front runners AND surpass them because they have banked runs and double the chests. Sure eventually this may happen down the road. But introducing it before the reward is even realized would be pretty unfortunate for those who were at the leading edge.

^thats exactly why i said increasing the yield would have been unfair. I dont mind if everyone can do it easier now, its just that people who did all favors before the patch would be behind despite having farmed 3 times longer. I dont know why people want a higher yield anyway, we get enough mats to use all our crafter tokens.

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Originally Posted by Thrustie

I have no problem with content eventually getting nerfed

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Nerfing it later is fine, but nerfing it now isn't? What determines where to draw the line? It's unrealistic (and selfish) to expect SE to wait until you personally feel you've been rewarded enough.

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Originally Posted by Thrustie

If I'm correct though, and this patch is more about progression...

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You're guessing what will happen and then getting upset if your fantasy doesn't come true. That's what I meant by, "you can only blame yourself for assuming you'd get a reward that was never promised." It's silly to expect SE to follow a plan that only exists in your imagination.

Also, people need to stop trying to compare raiding and crafting. They're too different for meaningful comparison.

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Originally Posted by Alexiell

I dont know why people want a higher yield anyway, we get enough mats to use all our crafter tokens.

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I can't speak for anyone else, but I agree that increasing yield would be a bad fix. I do want a meaningful fix, though. I'd love to see them move favors to blue scrip. Then put some of the two star crafting mats on the law vendor and we'd actually have a fairly functional system.