Please Reconsider MSQ Changes

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Originally Posted by linay

That wouldn't stop people kicking those who don't want to skip. In fact, it would make them want to kick more because they would want a party that go at their pace to help them.

With the way it is now, those who want to go ahead can start on the fight and those who wait patiently can join in if the fight has not concluded.

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With the way it is now, nobody should be going ahead, and can rightfully be reported for doing so.

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Originally Posted by Liam_Harper

This is true and unfortunately what people didn't realize.

Castrum and Prae are big epic storyline dungeons for new players. The whole reason the roulette exists is to help the new players get a group and the reason they offer so many tomes is to reward players for helping out the new guys.

Unfortunately what happened was players saw it as a daily exp boost they were entitled to and kicked, ignored or left behind the newbies the entire thing was designed for, before snatching the "thanks for helping the new guy" reward and walking off. It's sad that Enix saw no choice but to literally force players to let the newbies enjoy their dungeon, but you can absolutely blame the players who said "we can kick who we like, it doesn't break ToS, difference in playstyle, watch it in the inn". Just because something isn't bannable, it doesn't mean it's fine. It created an issue that eventually required the devs to take measures and they did. There's a lesson to be learned here.

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The true nature of a person shows when there are no tangible repercussions for their actions.

I haven't read the entire thread, and I'm not going to cuz it's really long. But I wanted to briefly put in my own experience with this before cut scenes were unskipable.

I remember having a really bad time in these MSQ ques because the first time I was there I was so engrossed with the story and wanted to watch everything as it was basically a finale for the ARR storyline. I remember coming out of the cutscenes and no one was around. I didn't know where to go. No one was responding via party chat when I asked what was going on and where everyone was. I was literally lost. Though I didn't know what was going on at the time, eventually the party would get to the next progression area and a new cutscene would play for me. I ended up watching all of the cut scenes without even fighting any of the bosses.

Needless to say my immersion was completely destroyed. I was so shocked that I went to the general FFXIV discord at the time (don't know if it was some unofficial or official one) to ask about it. And the respond from them was just "Tough man. Watch the cutscenes in the inn." Which wasn't even really a real response to my particular issue. I SAW all the cutscenes. My issue was that what was supposed to be a finale to the story that I was really into was destroyed by conflicting interests of players just wanting to get through the instance ASAP and not caring about some newbies immersion.

So to be honest, and I absolutely KNOW I'm in the minority here, but I appreciate the changed forced cutscene viewing (with greater rewards), for the sake of those new people who are legit into this really quirky game. That being said, I do agree the best option would be to make those two quests run with NPC's instead of players. But until that time, I think the change is better overall than what it used to be.

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Originally Posted by IntrovertAnt

I haven't read the entire thread, and I'm not going to cuz it's really long. But I wanted to briefly put in my own experience with this before cut scenes were unskipable.

I remember having a really bad time in these MSQ ques because the first time I was there I was so engrossed with the story and wanted to watch everything as it was basically a finale for the ARR storyline. I remember coming out of the cutscenes and no one was around. I didn't know where to go. No one was responding via party chat when I asked what was going on and where everyone was. I was literally lost. Though I didn't know what was going on at the time, eventually the party would get to the next progression area and a new cutscene would play for me. I ended up watching all of the cut scenes without even fighting any of the bosses.

Needless to say my immersion was completely destroyed. I was so shocked that I went to the general FFXIV discord at the time (don't know if it was some unofficial or official one) to ask about it. And the respond from them was just "Tough man. Watch the cutscenes in the inn." Which wasn't even really a real response to my particular issue. I SAW all the cutscenes. My issue was that what was supposed to be a finale to the story that I was really into was destroyed by conflicting interests of players just wanting to get through the instance ASAP and not caring about some newbies immersion.

So to be honest, and I absolutely KNOW I'm in the minority here, but I appreciate the changed forced cutscene viewing (with greater rewards), for the sake of those new people who are legit into this really quirky game. That being said, I do agree the best option would be to make those two quests run with NPC's instead of players. But until that time, I think the change is better overall than what it used to be.

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I agree, it's a change for the best.

Now, I could see SE maybe allowing for skipping if you form a full 8 man premade for them with no random people, but barring that, this is the lesser of two evils.

The ideal solution I think, would be to rework these two 8 man dungeons into solo instances with a trial fight for Ultima Weapon and Lahabrea at the end, but as that would take a lot of time and money, the current status quo works a good enough solution without redoing the whole thing.

An easy fix would be a vote system during the first cutscene.

Everyone gets to vote on watching them or skipping. If one person voted to watch, it remains how it is.

Voting would be anonymous.

Abandon option disabled since it's only those 2 dungeons.

Anyone that leaves is subject to the leaver queue penalty. The intent would be to discourage people harassing one person enough to leave to bypass the penalty.

At this point everyone going into those dungeons would expect the cutscenes, but would be plesently surprised if they get the skip.

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Originally Posted by Typhoria

An easy fix would be a vote system during the first cutscene.

Everyone gets to vote on watching them or skipping. If one person voted to watch, it remains how it is.

Voting would be anonymous.

Abandon option disabled since it's only those 2 dungeons.

Anyone that leaves is subject to the leaver queue penalty. The intent would be to discourage people harassing one person enough to leave to bypass the penalty.

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Its only an easy fix if the system is able to handle voting and playing alternate versions of cutscenes - and I don't think it is.

Then they also need to be able to selectively disable the vote abandon and/or kick (another thing that may not be possible).

And the final result.... the people who don't want to be there just disconnect form the game, preventing reinforcements, and they can't even be kicked.

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Originally Posted by Typhoria

At this point everyone going into those dungeons would expect the cutscenes, but would be plesently surprised if they get the skip.

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That's how it could have always worked - except people had to voluntarily wait, and didn't, which is what led to the enforced cutscenes in the first place.

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Originally Posted by Lissyl

It might be difficult to justify a 'difference in playstyle' when no actual playing is allowed. 'Being new' is not a style, it's a state of being.

As a player who hasn't quite hit these two yet, y'all make me very nervous.

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Don't be nervous, what you see here on the forums is merely an overreaction of a very minor portion of the comunity.

I run those everyday for tomes/leveling alt classes, and I can't even remember last time I saw anyone being rude to newcomers. It's usually a quiet run, with one or another player complaining about cutscenes, wich usually gets ignored or teased.

You have nothing to worry about man, just do it! :D

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Originally Posted by Typhoria

An easy fix would be a vote system during the first cutscene.

Everyone gets to vote on watching them or skipping. If one person voted to watch, it remains how it is.

Voting would be anonymous.

Abandon option disabled since it's only those 2 dungeons.

Anyone that leaves is subject to the leaver queue penalty. The intent would be to discourage people harassing one person enough to leave to bypass the penalty.

At this point everyone going into those dungeons would expect the cutscenes, but would be plesently surprised if they get the skip.

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Vote may be anonymous, but it's really easy to spot the new player on his first time tho. It will be the one with less than 4kish hp in case of DPS or less than 6kish in case of tank. Even if it isn't, you bet everyone would think it is and that poor player would suffer the retaliation.

The simple fix would be if there is a new guy bonus it locks it into view cutscene mode if there isn't one then cs should be skip automatically that would be the best method however if the cs are skipped the reward should be lowered including exp

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Originally Posted by Typhoria

An easy fix would be a vote system during the first cutscene.

Everyone gets to vote on watching them or skipping. If one person voted to watch, it remains how it is.

Voting would be anonymous.

Abandon option disabled since it's only those 2 dungeons.

Anyone that leaves is subject to the leaver queue penalty. The intent would be to discourage people harassing one person enough to leave to bypass the penalty.

At this point everyone going into those dungeons would expect the cutscenes, but would be plesently surprised if they get the skip.

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And if you get the version without cutscenes you will of course get less than half of the standard rewards.

This is the thing I do not think most people complaining about the cutscenes get - the only reason why the MSQ roulette gives such good rewards is as compensation for the runs taking such a long time. Make the runs quicker, and the rewards will be lowered.

Agreed for me and most of my fc its a case of if we don't need exp then the reward is not worth the hour it takes however that said shadowbringers gonna be making us do that msq roulette again