Dragoons: A Rotation Reborn

If they just took Feint off gcd we could weave it in like leg sweep..make it useful..bit of extra deeps + utility

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RachaelMarie22

If they just took Feint off gcd we could weave it in like leg sweep..make it useful..bit of extra deeps + utility

---

Lol ikr? Feint being off-GCD itself would be amazing if it does work on bosses. Slowing down cast times would make dodging much more easier and it will have the some worth as Dragon Kick's -10% INT debuff.

I think Feint's current 20 second duration on first use is a bit generous for that type of debuff - 5 seconds would be sufficient to slow down an AoE or reduce the heat on a tank long enough for healers to catch up while making sure that we're not constantly recasting it to keep mobs slowed (as we already have a lot of other DPS-related stuff to weave inbetween GCD moves).

I really don't want the job to be simplified by removing Power Surge and Ring of Thorns - the job should be complicated and rewarding to play, not a seven-skill mashfest like BLMs can be in some situations. I do agree that RoT and Doomspike cover each other's areas of usefulness a bit too well, but removing one of them completely seems excessive.

I've been trying to work on my dragoon dps on a dummy when bored lately and I find myself struggling on tp before invigorate is back up. Is that normal? I hit the first invigorate at 460 tp and only have skill speed from liberator and astrum chest I believe

Also if any controller players could share their cross bar set up Id like to get ideas how I could maybe change mine. I have a problem switching between cross bars easily >.<

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Gh0st_Pr0digy

I've been trying to work on my dragoon dps on a dummy when bored lately and I find myself struggling on tp before invigorate is back up. Is that normal? I hit the first invigorate at 460 tp and only have skill speed from liberator and astrum chest I believe

Also if any controller players could share their cross bar set up Id like to get ideas how I could maybe change mine. I have a problem switching between cross bars easily >.<

---

I can hit second invigorate @ 360 skillspeed without being TP starved.

Hmm maybe I'm thinking of the third and not second, curse my terrible memory. Will have to check after work

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Daweism

I can hit second invigorate @ 360 skillspeed without being TP starved.

---

But he/she's working with 414 Skill Speed minimum. Different ballgame.

And yes, that is completely normal. You'd only encounter that issue on Dummys.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Gh0st_Pr0digy

Also if any controller players could share their cross bar set up Id like to get ideas how I could maybe change mine. I have a problem switching between cross bars easily >.<

---

Would be easier if I had pics handy, but the general idea I use is to have actions on the face buttons and off-GCDs on the d-pad buttons. I find doing it this way makes it easier to move for positionals/dodge AoEs while executing actions.

Main bar (Hotbar #2)

Left side (L2)

Square - Heavy Thrust
X - Impulse Drive
Circle - Disembowel
Triangle - Chaos Thrust
Left - Spineshatter
Down - Internal Release
Right - Blood for Blood
Up - Life Surge

Right Side (R2)

Square - True Thrust
X - Vorpal Thrust
Circle - Full Thrust
Triangle - Jump
Left - Power Surge
Down - Mercy Stroke
Right - Phlebotomize
Up - Leg Sweep

Expanded Hotbar (R2 + L2 and L2 + R2)

Square - Heavy Thrust
X - Ring of Thorns
Circle - Doomspike
Triangle - Dragonfire
Left - macro for Bloodbath, foresight, second wind, keen flurry, etc
Down - Invigorate
Right - Limit Break (on the L2 + R2 side Elusive Jump)
Up - Mantra (L2 + R2 side potions)
(I just copy both sides so it doesn't really matter which trigger I pull first it's same basic moves)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Gh0st_Pr0digy

I've been trying to work on my dragoon dps on a dummy when bored lately and I find myself struggling on tp before invigorate is back up. Is that normal? I hit the first invigorate at 460 tp and only have skill speed from liberator and astrum chest I believe

Also if any controller players could share their cross bar set up Id like to get ideas how I could maybe change mine. I have a problem switching between cross bars easily >.<

---

ya I can't hit second invigorate with 46x skillspeed

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Gh0st_Pr0digy

I've been trying to work on my dragoon dps on a dummy when bored lately and I find myself struggling on tp before invigorate is back up. Is that normal? I hit the first invigorate at 460 tp and only have skill speed from liberator and astrum chest I believe

Also if any controller players could share their cross bar set up Id like to get ideas how I could maybe change mine. I have a problem switching between cross bars easily >.<

---

Do you have the shared hot cross bar option? Ill take a pic of my controller set-up I use. I use a PS3 controller on ma PC. With my setup I have access to 32 slots which is more then enouff to to access all your skills and then some.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Gh0st_Pr0digy

I've been trying to work on my dragoon dps on a dummy when bored lately and I find myself struggling on tp before invigorate is back up. Is that normal? I hit the first invigorate at 460 tp and only have skill speed from liberator and astrum chest I believe

Also if any controller players could share their cross bar set up Id like to get ideas how I could maybe change mine. I have a problem switching between cross bars easily >.<

---

I had 44x skill speed once upon a time (Liberator + HA pants, wooooo). The goal is to hit Invigorate as soon as you drop to 440 TP (450 can be awesome if you know exactly what you're doing, but 430 is too late). For best results, get a BLM-like spider-sense to time it with the TP regeneration ticks so that you get the full 60 TP out of that.

Testing this at 464 skill speed, I can just barely be riding the ticks a few GCDs before the second Invigorate. If you're lucky, things will still slow down enough that you're mashing the skill waiting for the regen, but not so slow that the rotation gets misaligned.

This is my cross hotbar setup, although I have switched PPP and Piercing Talon after putting these screenshots together (oh, and I leveled monk, too, so now Mantra occupies where Foresight used to be). The difference you will find from most controller DRGs is that I put cooldowns next to the GCDs they come after in the opener; it makes the execution very simple, I think.

Also, I use expanded controls so that I access set 2 with LT->RT and RT->LT. This is fairly handy when using the STR potion, for instance.

Did 508 skill speed setup yesterday, it was about 2 seconds shy of being able to do 3 thrust rotations without the dots falling off. It was melded i100 pvp gear @ i103 with i100 weapon. 430 DPS with party and food buffs.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Daweism

Did 508 skill speed setup yesterday, it was about 2 seconds shy of being able to do 3 thrust rotations without the dots falling off. It was melded i100 pvp gear @ i103 with i100 weapon. 430 DPS with party and food buffs.

---

Doesn't surprise me. Over time the more skill speed Dragoons get the more the optimal rotation is going to change.

i just looked and i have 414 skillspeed(currently looking to get the crafted chest piece)

Also i currently use one cross bar and the expanded one which lets me fit basically everything except keen flurry and AoE without switching bars, im just thinking towards the expansion with new abilities how im gonna fit them in/on my bar since switching cross bars in combat isnt something i find that flows smoothly for me but im also not used to doing

I actually didn't find the expanded (L1+R1) bars until very recently, so I've been placing all cross-class and job skills on a second bar. I'm used to it and it's all muscle memory, so it works well for me. I'm going to experiment with the expanded bars from now on though as it'll mean less room for misclicks and give me more easily accessible hotbar space when the level cap is increased and we get ~5 new skills.

I keep my skills in the order they were placed on the bar whilst levelling up, starting with True Thrust on the far right. It's perhaps not the most click-efficient way of accessing all my skill, but again - it's muscle memory at this point and I feel I'd just give myself unnecessary problems if I changed it now.

Gawd I hope these drg buffs are phenomenal.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Leonus

Gawd I hope these drg buffs are phenomenal.

---

Well, probably wouldn't get too excited.

Ninja nerfs are just..

Aeolian Edge and Shadow Fang cost up by 10TP to 60 and 70.
Poisons increase physical damage only.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by HulveinBlitz

Well, probably wouldn't get too excited.

Ninja nerfs are just..

Aeolian Edge and Shadow Fang cost up by 10TP to 60 and 70.
Poisons increase physical damage only.

---

Well, there wasn't really any need to nerf ninja into the ground, the just need to buff drg into the sky.

They specifically stated Ninja was only doing slightly more damage than they'd intended, anyone expecting a massive nerf was an idiot.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tilgung

They specifically stated Ninja was only doing slightly more damage than they'd intended

---

Exactly. Not sure why there was mass hysteria that ninja would suddenly get abandoned lol.

Just been talking to EMX actually, turns out I actually had his updated sheets all along. The only difference between my copy and the one he recently sent me was his had the updated weights calculated. When 2.45 comes along, I'll update his spreadsheets and recalculate the weights and then rework the BiS sets.

I'm also gunna use his sheet as a base and attempt to build a NIN sim to calculate their weights.

Also, I laughed at everyone crying about NIN nerfs. SE wouldn't completely wreck a class. He even mentioned in a live letter or an interview in 2.0 that he'd rather bring all jobs up to the strength of the more powerful ones and slightly rebalance others, rather than so major nerfs.

EDIT:

What are the accuracy caps for T10-T13?

I came across another DRG in a Satasha HM who claimed Heavy Thrust dropped his DPS by 20% and therefore he never used it. Is there some bizarre misinformation going around? Have I found LOL DRG's king?

There are a surprising number of people who think "flank" means "back", or that "using" a skill means spamming it without rhyme or reason. Either of those will definitely drop your DPS like a brick.

(Oh boy, I sure can't wait to see all those tanks who'll think it's okay to move all over the place just because we'll be getting Heavy Thrust from the wrong side!)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dervy

What are the accuracy caps for T10-T13?

---

Flank Accuracy
10 : 491
11: 505
12: 525(?)
13: 536 (my lowest recorded without any misses)

Frontal from ->> http://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/commen...thing_coil_19/
10: 515
11: 527
12: 548
13: 558

Anyone else notice the spear class eyesore drawn idle motion?
http://i222.photobucket.com/albums/d...psefe83830.png

None of the other polearm types do this. I'd just use those, but spears are the best looking lancer weapons! ;-;

Tomorrow can't come any sooner! The wait is killing me!

Possibly a semi-moot point come tomorrow, but how do some of you DRGs do T11 in final phase? Finally got around to having the (dis)pleasure of going DRG on my alt character FCoB. I basically do HT > P > 123 > 123 for a large portion of the left/right binds, and ID combo > P > 123 > 123 at the rear for group + tank. Any tricks, or do you basically just have to hope you never get tethered?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sleigh

Possibly a semi-moot point come tomorrow, but how do some of you DRGs do T11 in final phase? Finally got around to having the (dis)pleasure of going DRG on my alt character FCoB. I basically do HT > P > 123 > 123 for a large portion of the left/right binds, and ID combo > P > 123 > 123 at the rear for group + tank. Any tricks, or do you basically just have to hope you never get tethered?

---

I'v been in t11 for some kills by now, and basically I'm doing as you'v said. If I'm forced to be in boss flank, I'll keep HT up. Same logic for ID combo. As your party get confortable with the machanics, depending wich tether scenario and strategy, you can risk a little movement to hit flank/back. But I found it too risky (get in the middle of and unavoidable Nerve Gas or get stacks for beeing far/close your tether partner/other tether group) for the bennefits, since you'll only be able to do that once in a while and it won't "fix your rotation" at all.


I'm just resigned with the idea that my DPS will drop if I get the theter and I'll probably end up killing everyone if I try to move. Hope it wont be a major problem by tomorow :D

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sleigh

Possibly a semi-moot point come tomorrow, but how do some of you DRGs do T11 in final phase? Finally got around to having the (dis)pleasure of going DRG on my alt character FCoB. I basically do HT > P > 123 > 123 for a large portion of the left/right binds, and ID combo > P > 123 > 123 at the rear for group + tank. Any tricks, or do you basically just have to hope you never get tethered?

---

well basically when i get tethered with the nin in my group i tell him to hang around the back right foot of boss if its tank/dps if its dps/dps/healer/dps we chill at the back left foot of the boss. I have no problem with HT or ID/DIS/CT combos , u just gottah have that synergy with your other melee your tethered to :)

You are allowed to split up far enough so that missiles don't hit both of you; that's enough room for both you and your partner to get positionals in as long as both of you hover close to the border. That said, I haven't been doing that because... trust issues (and my group heals through those missiles anyway). H P TTT TTT / IDC P TTT TTT is more or less what I've been doing if I don't see an opening.

The good news is that if you're worried about enrage, it's not necessary to sneak in all your positionals while tethered, even with an i110 group. The real trick is sneaking them in while Nerve Gas is on top of the position you need.

With the coming buff, however, it appears that letting me do proper DPS will be an even tougher sell than it was before. Welp, at least it's a good problem to have.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sleigh

Possibly a semi-moot point come tomorrow, but how do some of you DRGs do T11 in final phase? Finally got around to having the (dis)pleasure of going DRG on my alt character FCoB. I basically do HT > P > 123 > 123 for a large portion of the left/right binds, and ID combo > P > 123 > 123 at the rear for group + tank. Any tricks, or do you basically just have to hope you never get tethered?

---

We have an assigned spot to deal with. My raid's DPS setup is 2 melees 2 ranged so it's easier to determine chains since if a melee gets 1 it means it will tether another melee, ya know? We marked left as A and right as C because the tethers are literally red and green so you go to whatever color you get. Not getting your positionals / full rotation going sucks but remember that low DPS is better than 2 dead DPS!

you can still hit every positional while tethered if your other melee works with you.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by rickyguo

you can still hit every positional while tethered if your other melee works with you.

---

This.

We do them as per usual. Just gotta communicate, and you'll find you can do them just fine. It's always nice when the boss does the perfect turn at the perfect moment though. :D

So question about jumps, specifically Spineshatter and Dragonfire Dive. Do you tend to use them as soon as they are available to weave in between your attacks or to save them for situations when you need to close the gap or get knocked back or something? I imagine this might depend on the fight as well, but is there a general rule of thumb?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RaizeGraymalkin

So question about jumps, specifically Spineshatter and Dragonfire Dive. Do you tend to use them as soon as they are available to weave in between your attacks or to save them for situations when you need to close the gap or get knocked back or something? I imagine this might depend on the fight as well, but is there a general rule of thumb?

---

Generally, most people usually just weave them in.

Weave them in, but if there's a mechanic where you'd need to "jump" from A to B safely, then you'd always want to save Spineshatter Drive as it is the weaker skill.

I personally prefer to save DFD for burst rotations.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RaizeGraymalkin

So question about jumps, specifically Spineshatter and Dragonfire Dive. Do you tend to use them as soon as they are available to weave in between your attacks or to save them for situations when you need to close the gap or get knocked back or something? I imagine this might depend on the fight as well, but is there a general rule of thumb?

---

I weave them in unless it's a fight where I know I'm going to be using them as gap closers to get from the boss to an add quickly, such as Garuda EX or Levi EX, or a fight like Ifrit HM where you want to be careful not to use stuns.

patch notes with dragoon buffs


http://queerty-prodweb.s3.amazonaws..../04/yaaaas.gif

PRAISE THE TWELVE! OUR TIME HAS COME!

All math calculated in i135 gear

Rotation PPS
Pre-2.45 PPS: 137.9
Post-2.45 PPS: 147
PPS Increase: 9.1

Crit Adjusted PPS:
Pre-2.45 PPS: 160.419
Post-2.45 PPS: 169.744
PPS Increase: 9.325

Pre-2.45 Jump PPS: 6.25
Post2.45 Jump PPS: 8.333

Rotation DPS:
Pre-2.45 DPS: 520
Post-2.45 DPS: 546

We're still out DPS'd by the monk, but only by 18 DPS. Monks rotation at i135 is around 570. Remember, this does not include BFB, DFD, Life Surge etc. This is nothing more than the raw base rotation. If you include BFB/Jumps, the DPS difference will be much, much closer (10ish)

EDIT: Changed a word not to give false meaning.

Also, regarding stat-weights. The changes are in the thousandth decimal, literally makes no impact on gear.

Previously calculated:
WD 9.355
STR 1.000
DET 0.329
CRT 0.234
SS 0.194

Post-2.45
WD: 9.349
STR: 1.000
DET: 0.327
CRT: 0.233
SS: 0.198

EDIT 2: Just realised I overcalculated the DPS gain pre-2.45 by 6, oops :P