November? really?

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Originally Posted by Laerune

I do not understand why some people are angry towards those that want to unsub, untill the new patch gets released? Its simple, I pay for the content, so when I know that the next two months will have no new content, then I will unsub. Do the developers deserve a holiday, afcourse, like everyone human being does. But does this mean, we should pay subscription fee when nothing is being delivered? The answer for me and others is NO!

Maybe its me, but with the lack of staff members + server memory thingy, makes me think that either SE is saving money or FFXIV is not doing as well as we all thought.

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Lol is this why so many companies customer service dept don't work on weekends or at certain hours they are companies too. Also nice of you to inflate your numbers with 2.5 to 3.0

The complainers are really funny.

"Just have Square let other people work on the patch!"

Because other dev teams at Square have any clue how to work the engine of FF14? Because they have any idea of the current design direction of the actual team. Because they know how to work the millions of lines of code that make the game work as it does.

It's like asking some dude to take over painting the Mona Lisa because Da Vinci is on vacation right now.

"But... but... then they should just hire more people to the team!"

Aye. New people need training. Training new people takes time and causes more delays in making content. They can't just go "hey it's your first day. Make this raid and make it compatible with everything else we programmed." It does not work that way. So even hiring new people will cause delays which people will complain about.

"Then just send half the team on vacation!"


Maybe they did? They said the delay was because the team was on vacation. They did not say that the entire team was on vacation at the same time. Someone had to have worked on all the hotfixes they released. Same with patch 3.01, 3.05, 3.07.

Stop acting as if the entire crew just went to Hawaii to party.

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Originally Posted by Kemas

Sick of hearing the WOW comparisons. This is a new generation mmo with new generation expectations.

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I'm not even sure what that is supposed to mean. Pretty sure it's easier to develop art assets for a game that can run on Windows XP than a game with HD textures that requires relatively newer hardware to run. Especially since they have to make it for different platforms that run with different OSs as well.

Also name me other "new generation" MMOs that have a patch cycle that is lower than 5 months.

It's not a comparison for comparison sake- I'm merely saying that people need to stop equating everything in ffxiv to wow because before hw a lot of these wow comparisons weren't nearly as frequent. That was taken largely out of context as I was trying to highlight the fact that the developers(though more frequent with updates than others) are adding a lot of fluff content rather than optimizing current content. You holding the WoW comparison against me is get another failed attempt of an inexperienced white knight.

Sincerely,

Square Enix supporter for the last 15 years. :)

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Originally Posted by Rakeesh

Also name me other "new generation" MMOs that have a patch cycle that is lower than 5 months.

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Well that's the point isn't it. All other MMO's that have come out couldn't keep up with the demands of their consumers and floundered for it. In fact I would say one reason FFXIV:ARR succeeded where others didn't is because they had an aggressive patch schedule, 3 to 4 month turn around times.

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Originally Posted by Dyvid

Well that's the point isn't it. All other MMO's that have come out couldn't keep up with the demands of their consumers and floundered for it. In fact I would say one reason FFXIV:ARR succeeded where others didn't is because they had an aggressive patch schedule, 3 to 4 month turn around times.

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Precisely this- we don't want SE to screw up the good thing they have going for it. A competitive update schedule with *meaningful* changes. To this day you see WoW players citing the implementation of Twitter integration and fluff content as the reason they came to our game- and as a longgg time subscriber I'd hate to see my game suffer from a potential lack of subscriptions once equally as competitive titles come out this fall/winter.

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Originally Posted by Rakeesh

"But... but... then they should just hire more people to the team!"

Aye. New people need training. Training new people takes time and causes more delays in making content. They can't just go "hey it's your first day. Make this raid and make it compatible with everything else we programmed." It does not work that way. So even hiring new people will cause delays which people will complain about.

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This is such an important concept that people do not understand. You cannot throw money at problems to fix them, especially not in software development. If they were to hire new people, they would have to spend so much time getting them up to speed that it would delay development: if you want tangible evidence of this fact, look no further than World of Warcraft. They hired a bunch of new people during MoP and spent so much time getting them up to speed that it delayed WoD's release significantly.

That's not to say that SE shouldn't consider expanding the development team, but it should happen slowly so that it does not entail drastic delays in the content cycle. In fact, I have a sneaking suspicion that when Yoshi-P talked about "workflow breakdown", he may have been subtly implying that they have hired some new people that caused a change in how development works.

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Originally Posted by LongsunZhao

Why not hire more staff...

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Because it's not that simple. First the higher-ups need to approve the hiring of new staff and allocate a budget for it. Then they need to post and advertise the opening to get people to apply. Once the applications start rolling in, someone needs to read them all and decide who to call in for interviews, which also involves scheduling said interviews. These interviews usually involve speaking not only with the person in charge of hiring but also with at least a part of the team they'll be working with, as they want to determine whether the applicant will be a good fit with the rest of the team. Jobs like this also tend to have more than one round of interviews, meaning more scheduling and more time that the team needs to take for interviews. Finally, they need to make a decision, which then needs to be approved by the higher-ups. And that's before all of the job training even starts.

The hiring process for a skilled job like this can easily take a month or more. It's not as simple as just "getting more staff."

If we have to wait till nov. does that mean holloween event is going to be pushed back also?

cause I was looking forward to that.

I was going to reply more to this thread but some of the post are so far out in left field that only a gif can sum it up for me.

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com...634013e9d6.gif

remember remember the nth of november

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Originally Posted by Zeonx

If we have to wait till nov. does that mean holloween event is going to be pushed back also?

cause I was looking forward to that.

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I doubt it, they probably already have that pretty much ready to be rolled out.

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Originally Posted by Cendres

I doubt it, they probably already have that pretty much ready to be rolled out.

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It was already pushed out in a previous update, we're just waiting for them to "unlock" it.

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Originally Posted by Colorful

It was already pushed out in a previous update, we're just waiting for them to "unlock" it.

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There was a datamining post on the subreddit if people want to look at it. Obviously wasn't posted here due to their stance on it.

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Originally Posted by Daralii

There was a datamining post on the subreddit if people want to look at it. Obviously wasn't posted here due to their stance on it.

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It was posted here actually, not going to go dig for the thread though. :x

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Originally Posted by Rakeesh

Also name me other "new generation" MMOs that have a patch cycle that is lower than 5 months.

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If you let me answer this: Well there isn`t.

SquareEnix did extremly well during FF XIV 2.x with the content patches. Better than any other MMO currently running. Does HW provide to less content? Well maybe, I can't tell, cause I'm a new Player that still has to get to level 60. But if I look to the number 1 MMO in this Genre World of Warcraft, than I can say, yes, Warcraft has maybe about 2-3x as much content in a new expansion than HW can offer.

BUT, this has a price. Warcraft is well known to not deliver any Content Patches in the last full year before an Expansion goes live. In FF XIV there has been how many Content Patches from June 26th 2014 to June 26th 2015? I think way more than...NONE.

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I think another point for the delay of 3.1 is the datacenter movement of chaos to europe. I'm sure SE didn't want to release a major Patch and work on the Server movement at nearly the same time.

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Originally Posted by Delnoir

I remember that World of Warcraft, during Pandaland, had over A YEAR of the same raid content. Makes everything else seem not so bad by comparison

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isnt even the same thing wow lacks content AT THE END of an expansion , is the expansion to expansion transition the main issue in wow, but yeah it sucks too.

but here we are talking about 3.1 the first big patch of an expansion , the 1 patch helps on balance jobs (that some jobs really need) , and keep the game going , because ppl get to max and get bored rather quickly since the game lacks content , content that will come with patches , and atm outside savage , is 2 experts , and Alex , if u like pvp , u get to play queues , crafting and gathering ? hahaha yeah fun times in HW with DOL/DOH :p

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Originally Posted by Warlyx

isnt even the same thing wow lacks content AT THE END of an expansion , is the expansion to expansion transition the main issue in wow, but yeah it sucks too.

but here we are talking about 3.1 the first big patch of the expansion , when some jobs need that 3.1 patch for balance reasons , when ppl get to max , and get bored , and who can blame them atm outside savage , is 2 experts , and Alex , if u like pvp , u get to play queues , crafting and gathering ? hahaha yeah superfun times in HW.

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At least we're only looking at a few months instead of close to a year, and for a fairly large patch at that.

*cough*6.1*cough*

I'm sure we'd probably be waiting a year or more when FFXIV hits the '6.1' mark. Won't be at that point for long while, though.

Seriously what is up with this thread? Do you guys think the devs are some kind of robots that never sleep? Do you honestly believe that creating new content just happens over night? It takes a very long time to create content for games. An average 60 - 100 playable hour game take 2+ years to create it, seriously just look at how long it took FFXV to finally release a demo.

MMO's are on a different level and there is a lot that goes into making new content especially expansions. Devs can easily put in 60 to 80 hour workweeks and depending on schedules/deadlines they can easily work up 12 to 15 days straight w/out a single day off.

Those devs deserve some much needed time away from the office so they can clear their heads and simply be themselves w/out worries or stress. Stress can kill you it strains the heart and can turn you into a cold hearted bastard. So chillax :cool: and enjoy the game for what it is. :)

I kind of want them to give us two free retainers. Considering two retainers weren't even enough for 2.0, and now we have 3.0 with a lot more stuff. Don't think I can accept to have to pay a additional 5 euro's a month, just so I can store my equipment.

The normal subsciption is already 15 euro's to be able to get in with the veteran rewards and have 8 character slots. Paying 20 euro's a month is a bit overkill even for a FF mmo.

You can't blame the devs for the timing of their annual leave, many companies give limitations on when staff can take holidays. If you're annoyed the venting needs to go towards piss-poor management. When you can't take holiday at a time of your choice because of low staff numbers it does have such a negative impact on your personal life. However, I think it's pretty lame and unprofessional a company would come out and say "oh, you're going to have to wait because all the staff are on holiday".
This information would have been much more appropriate a few months back, this potentially could have led to players possibly taking Heavensward a little slower rather than trying to pursue all of their goals as quickly as possible. We're paying customers, some people are deluded and think they're much more than that, we're not part of some big SE family. We're just numbers to them, nothing more, and no amount of fan-fest, or QA with the producer is going to change that.

Another part of me doesn't believe staff holiday isn't the reason for this at all . For all we know there could be problems we haven't heard. I think perhaps they have had to take a step back and look at why people are not playing as much as they used to. I'd much prefer them to take their time with updates and give us stuff that is fun and adventurous rather than having hours of filler. I might be wrong there, probably am, it's just a possibility.

Let me get one thing straight, I do not have anything against them taking vacation.

However, I highly doubt that the WHOLE DEV TEAM took vacation at the same time for over a month. Add to that that Japanese have a very high working moral. I really doubt the whole team up and left. While I believe they had vacation (in waves most likely), I think they are simply behind with the patch and since saying that would mean admitting they didn't plan properly, vacation will be a viable excuse that will find acceptance everywhere.

That being said, I rather they take a bit more time and make it a good patch. And please, please, for whoever's sake, DROP PS3 SUPPORT and let this game go to the next stage. You snooze, you loose. Get a PS4 or a PC if you want to keep playing (no, I am not ignorant of the financial investment. I have a low/mid range wage and I still could get a good machine to play FFXIV).

How is it my problem if they need to train more people? Did they decide to take a break just last week? Have they never thought about it?

I don't need excuses, I need the content I provided the money to create at the rate it's always been. I pay the sub on time, you' better deliver on time as well. If your employees going on vacation delays your content by 2 months you are cheap and incompetent. It's not some unforseeable cause that you couldn't have dealt with in time. Figure it out like any othet company does. It's embarassing.

We are talking about SE, not some new company that's just started and absolutely can't invest more time and money that it already is.

Coincidentally, they took vacation on Silver Week maybe? (It's japanese national holiday)

Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silver_Week

I don't know a FC member told us about Ninja changes, sounds good to me.
Also i tend to agree, i appreciate all the work SE put into HW and it was fun but many of us now login less and are kind of bored. PVP is keeping us going for now, lol
And they more then deserved a break

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Originally Posted by Chessala

Let me get one thing straight, I do not have anything against them taking vacation.

However, I highly doubt that the WHOLE DEV TEAM took vacation at the same time for over a month. Add to that that Japanese have a very high working moral. I really doubt the whole team up and left. While I believe they had vacation (in waves most likely), I think they are simply behind with the patch and since saying that would mean admitting they didn't plan properly, vacation will be a viable excuse that will find acceptance everywhere.

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I think the Chaos datacenter transfer stuff probably took time away from development too.

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Originally Posted by Moqi

How is it my problem if they need to train more people? Did they decide to take a break just last week? Have they never thought about it?

I don't need excuses, I need the content I provided the money to create at the rate it's always been. I pay the sub on time, you' better deliver on time as well. If your employees going on vacation delays your content by 2 months you are cheap and incompetent. It's not some unforseeable cause that you couldn't have dealt with in time. Figure it out like any othet company does. It's embarassing.

We are talking about SE, not some new company that's just started and absolutely can't invest more time and money that it already is.

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did they sign a contract where they stated to deliver you a patch every 3 months? i dont think so, be grateful about anything which is coming in future or just unsub if you dont like it

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Originally Posted by ServerCollaps

did they sign a contract where they stated to deliver you a patch every 3 months? i dont think so, be grateful about anything which is coming in future or just unsub if you dont like it

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The biggest problem with the community, people that make these statements.
It's still possible to like the game and be critical of it, you don't have to White Knight all the time.
Ever figure that people voicing concerns and such maybe want the game to be improved?
The Yoshi-P lovefest continues because he can do no wrong it seems.

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Originally Posted by Kedo

Ever figure that people voicing concerns and such maybe want the game to be improved?

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I'm Not saying this is you but it is what I see from observation.

The biggest issue we have with people expressing their concerns is they do it with a attitude that gets them mostly overlooked.
when you act negatively and present yourself as a childish entitled brat that will happen.
if you want to be taken seriously here on the forums you need to stay positive and not retaliate to flames and personal insults.

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Originally Posted by Wildsprite

I'm Not saying this is you but it is what I see from observation.

The biggest issue we have with people expressing their concerns is they do it with a attitude that gets them mostly overlooked.
when you act negatively and present yourself as a childish entitled brat that will happen.

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I get it, there are some jerks about it, however I can't stand how any criticism gets dismissed, and the "UNSUB" argument. Come on!

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Originally Posted by ServerCollaps

did they sign a contract where they stated to deliver you a patch every 3 months? i dont think so, be grateful about anything which is coming in future or just unsub if you dont like it

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http://www.siliconera.com/wordpress/...to3_thumb2.jpg

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Originally Posted by Moqi

I pay the sub on time, you' better deliver on time as well.

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you are paying the sub for the servers and the people who keep them running. all content patches are in the game and now the expansion included. you don't need to pay monthly, you can take a break for a year and still get all content patches as long as you bought havensward.

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Originally Posted by Kedo

I get it, there are some jerks about it, however I can't stand how any criticism gets dismissed, and the "UNSUB" argument. Come on!

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yes those people really need to stop too. sadly they won't as long as the community team allows it.

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Originally Posted by Kemas

You holding the WoW comparison against me is get another failed attempt of an inexperienced white knight.

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I... what? Dude, if being logical and down to earth is 'white knighting' I don't know what to say. It's a patch that got delayed by a month or a week. Who cares. It's not that long a time frame.

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Sincerely,

Square Enix supporter for the last 15 years. :)

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Good for you...? O_o

I played my first Squaresoft game 20 years ago. Do I get a price for that now?

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Originally Posted by Moqi

I don't need excuses, I need the content I provided the money to create at the rate it's always been. I pay the sub on time, you' better deliver on time as well. If your employees going on vacation delays your content by 2 months you are cheap and incompetent. It's not some unforseeable cause that you couldn't have dealt with in time. Figure it out like any othet company does. It's embarassing.

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The other companies that give you patches every 6 months to a year because they treat their devs like something similar to humans?

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We are talking about SE, not some new company that's just started and absolutely can't invest more time and money that it already is.

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World of Warcraft. Biggest MMO on the planet. 10 years of experience. At their height of popularity with 10-12 million subscribers released patches every 5 months (at best) and 6-7 months more common.

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Originally Posted by Kedo

The biggest problem with the community, people that make these statements.
It's still possible to like the game and be critical of it, you don't have to White Knight all the time.

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I'm sorry. But what else can you say to people that threaten to leave the game because a patch got delayed by an unknown time frame. If you have to complain about something trivial such as this on the forums... I just don't know. There is a difference between legit criticism and attention seeking whining.

PSA: Complaining about a patch being slightly late is the latter.

How about actually focusing on what it offers? And if that is positive or negative.

And this is why I only sub by the month since 2.5 rather than going 3~6 months bundle route

I can understand the frustration for those who bought subs months in advance as soon as they got the expansion; they're effectively paying for a service that they're not using especially since unsubbing is really not an option for them for a few more months

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I'm sorry. But what else can you say to people that threaten to leave the game because a patch got delayed by an unknown time frame.

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Back in MxO, we had a saying for people that did this.

"You'll be back."

And evidently, they were. Same can be said here to all those that are crying and saying they want to leave. They'll be back. Those that actually were going to leave, would more than likely not make a hissy fit and threaten, and instead opt to let money talk, and unsub.

I've just unsubbed from the game, the first time my sub has lapsed since starting in 2.0 beta. I won't pretend my opinion or sub is any more valuable than the next player's, but it was a disappointing decision to come to. I'm one of the "midcore endgame players" if you had to put a label on it, but really, I'm just a player. I dabbled in crafting, raiding, tried out each role in the trinity, participated in various side quests and seasonal events, and experienced much of the PVE the game has to offer. I've always just played the way I want to play since the start.

I'd never really become bored with the game, until 3.0 released. Were my expectations too high? Maybe they were, I expected a couple mix-ups from the 2.0 formula, maybe a fresh concept for the treadmilling conventions. Instead, I found all of 2.X's conventions layered on top of 3.0's new content. This had a cheapening effect on the content, the treadmill, and the rewards from the treadmill, leaving me with a powerful sensation of same-ness, despite the fact that I was playing and gearing a brand new class to the game.

It's hard to quantify exactly what turns me off. Having played since beta and following the schedule that endgame releases have had since then, it should be no surprise that there is a "new" form of alternate currency, a small selection of max level dungeons, a couple big primal battles, and a singular raid. As it turns out, this pool of content, designed for the "endgame" player, my bread and butter content, interested me so little that I'd stopped logging in day after day. I acknowledge the amount of content in 3.0, it's not insignificant, but the content that I actually wanted to invest myself in had so little draw that it made me hesitant to invest time in other areas of the game that already interested me less than endgame content.

I bear no ill will towards the game at all, or those that continue to enjoy it. However, with the content that I should ideally enjoy stretched thin, and stretched even thinner into next month, I'm finding I'll be better poised to enjoy the strong influx of new games around the holiday season. I don't enjoy having to take a break, I've invested myself into my character, the world, FC friends, but I enjoy logging in even less. I hope a future patch will address some of the issues I have with the game. It's really a shame that my playstyle conflicts with the current state of the game, but it is what it is. No amount of complaining or ranting will magically change that, the way I play the game simply doesn't satisfy me right now. I don't begrudge SE for taking a vacation from the game, I only hope they come back with fresh minds, new ideas, and make Eorzea a home worth coming back to.

Well, it will say after reading only a few pages of this thread...good community cross section with regards to the time and content.

I am a casual gamer, and a sub-par casual raider. I am a RW solo breadwinner, so the weekends is when I get my gameplay on in a serious sense of the term.

I personally like that it will be November mainly due to the fact that after getting the MSL taken care of, I jumped ship from dungeons/tome mining for gear to work on my FC airship, which is still not done since I didn't give crafting enough attention during the 2.x line and yes, really paying for it now with the Airship. Also, it is taking a long grind for me since my FC which had 22 active members starting 2.0 content lost most of them to the dps reflections of players during raid chat more than other games coming out. Due to this, I am the only active player left in my FC, but we do have a total of 4 players who are online during a sub month.

With that said, I can understand where those who are hardcore, or even have the time to play long periods of time everyday would be burned out on the current content. To you who fit this mold, I congratulate you on having everything to lvl 60, all the gears, and Alex Normal and Salvage cleared, and I would guess even have the FC workshop cleared of prototypes and creations. I will say I envy you and wish I had the time you do have to dedicate to what is a great game.

I would however, also ask that you do remember that we were told before launch what we would see for the 3.x roll out. No, we weren't told it would take 5 months, but we knew that there would be a slower than normal roll out of content for the 3.x series starting out. Please keep that in mind when you comment on the SE Dev Team taking a vacation and the 5 months.

So, since it isn't coming till November, I will probably save the airship for after 3.1 content and go grind for the tomes needed for the gear to move forward.

See ya'll in 3.1.

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Originally Posted by Senliten

Back in MxO, we had a saying for people that did this.

"You'll be back."

And evidently, they were. Same can be said here to all those that are crying and saying they want to leave. They'll be back. Those that actually were going to leave, would more than likely not make a hissy fit and threaten, and instead opt to let money talk, and unsub.

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Pretty much this. People talk the talk, but few walk the walk.

It really is only an additional month. I am not worked up over it, especially since a lot of games are coming out in October (Dragon Quest Heroes, Legend of Legacy, Tales of Zesteria, AC: Syndicate).

The amount of content put into 3.0 was not the issue. Technically there is a lot to do. It is the quality of said content I come into question. Average players don't like Savage Coil and everything else is face roll easy to the point they are bored with it now. In turn also some have less motivation to do other content or level other jobs. Right now you either go very casual or hardcore, there is no middle ground.

You can put two or three things only in a game and make them last a long time if made well.

Also, yes developers do need a vacation. Just like you need one from your job once to twice a year. It is just one month over the intended schedule, and they did say first 10 days of November. If you are truly bored with the game, entertain yourself with another game. Unsubscribe if you want to not pay for just October.