5.08 Patch Notes up

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Originally Posted by ChaoticCrimson

Thing is, you had to weave a lot as a SMN in StB too. It's not really any busier now than it was then. The "busy-ness" is not really the issue with SMN, at least not in and of itself.

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There's a lot more weaving now. in SB we weaved Fester, Bane, Pain Flare, Enkindle, Trance, and that's basically all. Now we get have pet skills that we have to manually weave into as well, 2 per minute. we also pretty much HAVE to weave Lucid Dreaming in now as well. Rarely had MP issues before. in SB we spammed Ruin 3 like 90% of the time and pet was mostly on auto after the opener.

How busy the job is IS an issue because it's pushed a lot of people away from the job. It's not the main issue though. The main point when people mention how busy it is, is just that we work a lot harder than other jobs and don't get rewarded for it. Some people argue difficulty of a job shouldn't matter, but it really should. People should be rewarded for how hard their job is to play, with DPS scaled with the difficulty of said job. Difficulty should be balanced against utility and such. Right now it seems they only look at "utility" and w/e job the devs like at the moment (always BLM lol)

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Originally Posted by dinnertime

If that were true, people wouldn't be complaining about the job's busy-ness now, would they? Yes, it's not the *big* issue, but it definitely contributes to how terrible SMN is to play right now.

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Chalk me up in the minority, then, because I like how SMN plays right now, and I've been doing the Carbuncle Shuffle since the first October of ARR.

I also enjoy driving fast cars with manual transmissions. I like the enjoyment of cranking out perfectly-timed gear shifts... and I enjoy the satisfaction of a run of perfect keypress / mouseclick sequences. Elegant weapons... for a more civilized age.

:D :D :D

My only real gripe about SMN is losing Titan-Egi as a genuine Tank type. That's making me work too much in open-world hunting ;)

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Originally Posted by Renato

I like the changes to SAM outside of Kaeshi: Higanbana which I never use. Honestly, I'm waiting to see what kind of changes they make to Shoha which is completely useless.

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Probably will be Like monks chakra but each midaire or something gives us a stack

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Originally Posted by Duskane

https://media.discordapp.net/attachm...940&height=586

not sure if 100% and tell me if its wrong but SAM being worst melee DPS is big oof

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Using FFlogs as a basis isn't scientific at all. FFLogs has no control group. The perceived meta classes will be played more by the top cut of players and receive more stacked buffs exaggerating any difference that may exist in either direction. Or, what is more likely, there may just happen to be by chance more worse players/groups with certain roles than others. There is litterally no control. It's just random logs posted by a small % of the playerbase. This is no basis for Square to make any adjustments over. Square needs to look at very specific test instances where every player is of equal relative skill and look at each class with the same exact number of external buffs being applied to them. Anything less than that is not accurate at all, and even that has room for error.

I'm happy to see Ninjas were adjusted. But, I'm trying to understand what the impact of the Summoner changes are. Do the changes simplify its rotation without increasing its damage or is it actually a buff?

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Originally Posted by CatStarPrime

Chalk me up in the minority, then, because I like how SMN plays right now, and I've been doing the Carbuncle Shuffle since the first October of ARR.

I also enjoy driving fast cars with manual transmissions. I like the enjoyment of cranking out perfectly-timed gear shifts... and I enjoy the satisfaction of a run of perfect keypress / mouseclick sequences. Elegant weapons... for a more civilized age.

:D :D :D

My only real gripe about SMN is losing Titan-Egi as a genuine Tank type. That's making me work too much in open-world hunting ;)

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It's totally okay to like the new SMN, but I just can't accept it for the various design flaws it has now. I got used to playing it and it's not as bad as I thought, and it's not as bad as people make it out to be, but playing it still causes a lot of frustration and has a lot of meaningless effort involved which is yes, a feeling a lot of players share.

For reference I've been a SMN since ARR, loved HW and 4.1 SB SMN and I think 5.0 is the worst one.

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Originally Posted by Renato

I like the changes to SAM outside of Kaeshi: Higanbana which I never use. Honestly, I'm waiting to see what kind of changes they make to Shoha which is completely useless.

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Kaeshi Higanbana is useless, it will only be good if you can stack it and if tsubame is a 30sec CD.

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Originally Posted by Yandere-chan

Using FFlogs as a basis isn't scientific at all. FFLogs has no control group. The perceived meta classes will be played more by the top cut of players and receive more stacked buffs exaggerating any difference that may exist in either direction. Or, what is more likely, there may just happen to be by chance more worse players/groups with certain roles than others. There is litterally no control. It's just random logs posted by a small % of the playerbase. This is no basis for Square to make any adjustments over. Square needs to look at very specific test instances where every player is of equal relative skill and look at each class with the same exact number of external buffs being applied to them. Anything less than that is not accurate at all, and even that has room for error.

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FFlogs counts raid buffs as part of the DPS of the job giving the buffs rather than the one receiving them now. In effect all jobs in that list are under the same circumstances.

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Originally Posted by Kacho_Nacho

I'm happy to see Ninjas were adjusted. But, I'm trying to understand what the impact of the Summoner changes are. Do the changes simplify its rotation without increasing its damage or is it actually a buff?

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From what I understand you get less punished if you let your dots fall off now. I would say the damage is about the same. they just shuffled things around from having full potency when dots are ticking to hving full potency regardless if the target has dots up or not.

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Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

While this is fair, there are still jobs suffering that the developers have made zero mention of adjusting, or that they seem to think are "fine". RDM and the physical ranged come to mind here. The Devs haven't made any mentions about the latter (despite them being on the cusp of exclusion right now due to how weak they are), and RDM is being taxed far too heavily for its Verraise utility. More so than it was in SB. But they seem to think this is "fine".

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Exactly this^