Understanding Puppetmaster Development

[Bhujerba]

Agree +3, you said what in my mind exactly...

its just pathetic, overpowered jobs walking around like nothing, but pup getting slightly powered and everythung break lose at SE , !!!!OMG SLIGHTLY OVERPOWERED PUP IS SIGHTED! THE GAME WELL BE DOOMED ......LIKE FF14!!!
so they dont want to nerf/continue to buff overpowered jobs because they are widely used but ok with nerfing/not fixing less used job?
it's catch 22 we are stuck, unless everyone and there mother start playing pup we might get buffed and remain desirable forever!...but since we arent that good/not offering as much as other jobs this makes us undesirable and ppl will not play the job therefore we get nerfed because not too many are playing the job so no worries about pissing off tons of ppl, and get nerfed more.

in Rag after the merge 4421 ppl at jp prime time, 45 of them were 90 pups thats 0.98% of the total population. everyone knows you need a "real" job to actually play the game and test the new stuff, and then when everything is easy/discovered you can throw a bone to the LOL jobs. god forbid we become "real" one day...

[Cyranda]

I can't say I was expecting my post to get the kind of attention that it did, and I'm glad to see some people feel the way I do. Sense of community and all.

However, the postings in other threads are probably more likely to make other people try to draw ludicrous comparisons (such as MY JOB HAS IT WORSE, which is completely beside the point. People who "have it worse" shouldn't be uncaring about other people who also aren't terribly well off) or make them act like someone has committed sacrilege against the sacred forum dynasty of ages past (you know, as opposed to just ignoring it or silently reporting it), and so it might be better for one's sanity not to post it elsewhere, despite the fact that the effort is well received!

[Shibayama]

I think one of the issues with this forum is that people think that they're posting ideas that square enix's dev team is reading and will take into consideration which as of right now, does not seem to be the case. From the responses we've gotten so far its been along the lines of "Well you'll be happy to know that we have something planned for that!" or "Wow what a great idea! Unfortunately it doesn't meet up with the dev teams schedule/way of doing things, so it's not happening - sorry!" There doesn't seem to be any indication that the dev team trusts the playerbase to knows what works and what doesn't.

Of course, you cant go giving everybody what they think is best, but I think with Pup there needs to be a special exceptions made. I am not a pup but I know serveral people who are very passionate about the job and I can say with no doubts that the pup community is by far the most dedicated and informed groups in regards to what works and what does not work in regards to the way the job functions. I think at this point, the dev team *should* be paying more attention to you guys instead of just going ahead with whatever updates they seem to think pup needs - particularly when it comes to the technical aspects of the job. Sure, I'm certain nobody complained when the H2H skill was increased of Deux ex was added, but it seems like SE is completely baffled by the attachment/manuever/Automaton AI system and how they all work together. It seems a shame that they're adding attachments and weaponskills that don't really benefit the job by giving such minimal boosts and at worst, are completely counter intuitive to how the job plays.

As far as burts goes, I feel your pain. I'm sure that it was a mistake to begin with, and that an extra 0 was added by a clumsy coder but still, it seems exceptionally lame that SE seems to have a habit of carelessness with pup that tricks you guys into thinking that you're finally getting your chance to shine. I remember when the last set of automaton weaponskills were added there was a fiasco where pups were doing 3k+ damage with some attachment and Magic Mortar to big NM's and it was quickly denounced as an error and fixed. From what I've heard from my friends and posters the new weaponskills don't even seem that usable so it makes me wonder just who is testing these things and how they're checking to see how they work when used by an actual player.

[Lushipur]

As far as burts goes, I feel your pain. I'm sure that it was a mistake to begin with, and that an extra 0 was added by a clumsy coder but still, it seems exceptionally lame that SE seems to have a habit of carelessness with pup that tricks you guys into thinking that you're finally getting your chance to shine. I remember when the last set of automaton weaponskills were added there was a fiasco where pups were doing 3k+ damage with some attachment and Magic Mortar to big NM's and it was quickly denounced as an error and fixed. From what I've heard from my friends and posters the new weaponskills don't even seem that usable so it makes me wonder just who is testing these things and how they're checking to see how they work when used by an actual player.

one things is: patch go up, see big number form ws, SE calls maint. and the ws get fixed;
other is: patch go up, see big number from weapon, 3-4 months passes, SE release new patch and the weapon get fixed;

3-4 months are a long enough time to call somethings not a code error but a reality...

yes, there was the earthquake but i doubt was that to stop the nerf in the first time...

[Mizuharu]

So just to summarize, the following things are what PUP has been short-ended on...
1) Asuran Fists. We're the ONLY other job that MAINS Hand-to-Hand weapons and this is a Blue stagger WS. You honestly can't give us this?

2) WHM AI (I don't need a Poisona at <50% HP. I need a Cure.)

3) New Weapon Skills. I did try out String Shredder. And then I deactivated my Valoredge and prayed Armor Shatterer would be better. And then I deactivated THAT frame... I'll still use the frames due to me setting melee Atmas in Abyssea... But I'll stick to Bone Crusher and Armor Piercer/Daze(if I really need that stun)

4) The new attachments. You do realize that, when we Deactivate an Automaton, it's MP goes to full. Even if it 1% left, it'll go right back up to 100%. And Activate resets if the Automaton is deactivated with 100% HP. So what's the point of that Ice attachment? What was it called? ... I don't even want to bother looking it up since I know I'm not going to use it. And the counter attachment? You said when you released PUP that it was a pet job like BST but that it TANKS instead of the PET tanking. Why would we let something that can't receive cures from outside sources tank when we have better Evasion than it... Sure, Valoredge does have a nice HP pool... But the only things it's got to cure it is Repair and Cannibal Blade (Outside of abyssea. And, like the OP said, who takes PUP to anything that matters? EXP parties? The Automaton sure as hell isn't going to pull hate with the damage it currently puts out.)

I'm just baffled by the fact that you make these forums to get opinions from the players but things like this happen. Then again, this has been happening since PUP was released... These forums is more for face than it is for actual use.

[Cyranda]

Here's to hoping the new adjustments will be good!

[Dfoley]

No offense but these posts get old fast.

Burts was broken, its now fixed, and its back to pups needing Verethragna or Rev Fists if they want to be high end, and stringing pummel if they want to be just above average.

If you look at all past examples, 99% of the time they leave things in for 3 months and just patch it at the next update. If it were 100 tp/tic it would have been fixed over night, but as is it was 30 seconds for a ws with no melee, which wasnt terribly , but was obviously broken.

I feel bad for all you bandwagon pups who only started playing when burts were noticed to be broken.

[Lazus]

No offense but these posts get old fast.

Burts was broken, its now fixed, and its back to pups needing Verethragna or Rev Fists if they want to be high end, and stringing pummel if they want to be just above average.

If you look at all past examples, 99% of the time they leave things in for 3 months and just patch it at the next update. If it were 100 tp/tic it would have been fixed over night, but as is it was 30 seconds for a ws with no melee, which wasnt terribly , but was obviously broken.

I feel bad for all you bandwagon pups who only started playing when burts were noticed to be broken.

agreed, think the pup community should complain the stuff that actually broke oe need adjustments, like A.I.

[Cyranda]

Burts was broken, its now fixed, and its back to pups needing Verethragna or Rev Fists if they want to be high end, and stringing pummel if they want to be just above average.

If you look at all past examples, 99% of the time they leave things in for 3 months and just patch it at the next update. If it were 100 tp/tic it would have been fixed over night, but as is it was 30 seconds for a ws with no melee, which wasnt terribly , but was obviously broken.

I feel bad for all you bandwagon pups who only started playing when burts were noticed to be broken.

It sounds like you didn't read the whole post, nor understand it, since the post wasn't simply about the change to Burats. That's too bad.

No offense but...

lol. If there's ever something that indicates someone is going to be offensive, this is it...

bandwagon pups

See?

[Dfoley]

Herein lies my confusion. Why did Square-Enix think it was necessary to nerf Burattinaios to the ground such that it is now worthless compared to just about any other weapon given the circumstances above? The ONLY thing it is useful for with 1 TP/tick is equipping when you’ve first entered a zone and are running to where the fighting will take place, and even then, you’ll probably end up with a whopping 50ish TP. You can’t switch into it between fights unless you want to lose the master’s TP and, quite frankly, the master’s WS are better than the automatons, so that would be ill advised.

Was having less than 1% of the population be slightly overpowered (and that is arguable) really that big of a deal? I mean, we’ve seen notes from the developers/forum moderators saying other updates “take too much time” or “we don’t have the resources,” yet they had time, desire and resources to change a value that hardly mattered to anyone. Did they really want to make a job that is already much maligned and/or misunderstood that much worse so that, what, even more people wouldn’t want to play it, or even fewer would want to take it with them to events? It boggles my mind.

I read the whole post, but honestly nothing you said wasnt said by others already, and some of which were confirmed bugs and are being fixed (attachments and ws) so /pat on the back for putting it in one place x2?

And as far as "no offense" and "bandwagon pup"... trust me my 'offensive' responce would have gotten my post nuked with how sick i get of these posts