Any new HNM coming?

[Karbuncle]

I see. Well then you can disregard that.

As its obvious we have similar views on how endgame should end up.

[Cream_Soda]

No, basically what im saying is, gear should reflect skill lvl. In that regard claiming should be hard, and the fights even harder then that. But you come off as all "No competition for anything plz". If SE not gonna make HNM in the traditional sense then make it getting a pop exceedingly difficult idc. Seeing bad players in good gear is sickening to me. Hoping these voidwatch are all hard with time limits or else they depop or rage after X amount of time.

Instead of flaming on me, what would you suggest to the idea of new "HNM"? How would you set it up? Make it all easy so everyone can kill with out strategy and little to no effort? Thats basically what abyssea is now.

That's the thing though, gear only reflects the skill of a GROUP, not of individuals. Do you know how many gimp ridills , and adabeurks I was outdamaing in my brown belt, scorpion harness, republigar (when I first dinged 75 lol) mnk?

Just because they were able to get the HNM items doesn't mean they were good players.

You have the people who play X job and get gear in their HNM for Y job, get on Y job and utterly fail at it, etc.

There were always horrible players w/ good gear. If you're just noticing this at abyssea release, then you must have selective vision.

As far as the second half goes, again, 21-24 hour claim has 0 to do with the difficulty of the NM, so while I have no direct solution, I don't see where 21-24 hour NMs would be the solution, either.

[Mrbeansman]

Why are you still arguing with him it's obvious he doesn't care about hard HNMs just having amazing gear no one else should be allowed to have.

[Orson]

That's the thing though, gear only reflects the skill of a GROUP, not of individuals. Do you know how many gimp ridills , and adabeurks I was outdamaing in my brown belt, scorpion harness, republigar (when I first dinged 75 lol) mnk?

I'd like to add the quality of gear doesn't even necessarily make the group skilled. A lot of LSs are freaking pathetic yet have so many bodies and bots they get the best gear anyways. The fact of the matter is really by the time ToAU was released anyone with a decent sized group could do kings and such.

[Cream_Soda]

I concur, young sir.

[Natenn]

Im saying SE should MAKE IT so gear reflects skill, make another super hard NM in the traditional sense like AV/PW but make it so you don't need 30 ppl to kill, make an NM thats difficult to an alliance, put it in a BC idc. the best suff should be HARD to obtain.

[Mrbeansman]

Im saying SE should MAKE IT so gear reflects skill, make another super hard NM in the traditional sense like AV/PW but make it so you don't need 30 ppl to kill, make an NM thats difficult to an alliance, put it in a BC idc. the best suff should be HARD to obtain.

There is no hard in this. Once you know how a mob ticks it's not hard to find a strategy that works 100% of the time. And before you say anything about AV/PW remember that working strategies where found for those too. Any kind of superiority you want to feel will fade once this happens.

[Anewie]

I wouldn't mind a more superior type of endgame/HNM scene returning but im posting after being in an Abys group with a few very very very terrible players who have the same stuff as me.

Although I don't agree with everything Nat says, I am really missing the old scene. You had five types of players, the players that were great and had great gear, the players that werent that good but cheated/botted so they still got great gear, the players that sucked and were noobish and had terrible gear, and finally the players that were good players but kept getting screwed out of claims for the good stuff.


Orson/Cream/Surreal, I can understand why you guys dont want endgame to return to what it was, thats understandable. You're in the player base that was decently well skilled. I know you're from LTC Orson and that LS was amazing. Thing is, i am personally tired of an endgame where I am equal to a "noob". I guess it makes me look like an asshole but honestly.. I worked hard for my gears, I enjoyed it and the game and I am good at my jobs, average at worst.

If you cannot play your jobs well and work well in team oriented events, or even do things well on you're own, why should your gear be equal to that of a dedicated, hard working, team player? Or even someone who prefers solo/duo play but does their job real well.


Abyssea enourages people to suck/not care and not pay attention. Besides procs (which is lol itself) you're looking at an almost mindless event that is built around spamming. Its actually similiar to camping but camping was a lot of fun if u had the time and patience (kings aside). LTC didnt bot HNMs and they got quit a bit of cerb,khim,tia,di,sw. They even controlled them quite a bit. Camping was mindless but it required dedication, thats an undeniable fact and you couldn't suck. It required a Minmum amount of decent skill. You remember 4hour tiamats? No stuns khims? It does take some skill.

Abyssea? Although its wonderful for casual stuff and offers a ton of stuff, for the more higher quality player, its just a spamfest that offers no real fun besides the 10k Blizzard 5s and 30k wildfires. And u know someone gets those numbers im sure...

That's really the only thing to it. Hard? Easy doesnt even compare. It is x1000 easier than anything FFXI has ever experienced in its entire lifespam and disencourages everything the game was built around.

Think about the future. I doubt any new expansions/add ons are coming. I'm sorry but I would have rather the game stayed at the point it was. At least had Longevity and alternate methods for non campers. Odin was easier to get access too than Nidhogg, and thats a fact. The only items people missed out on really were khim,tia,di,sw items and most of it wasnt even needed. Luxury items and gil only, sup. The people that chose to spend hours upon hours camping didnt benefit outside having gil for relics and hauteclair/gaiters. Hauteclair always sucked once mythic ws came out, if u werent using joyeues u failed at life and gaiters were not needed one bit. I sold mine, twice.

HNM camping offered a luxury of items and gil, thats it. Now luxury shouldnt be exclusive to camping and spending hours searcing for a mob, I agree with that but luxury SHOULD come from more dedication, more effort. If SE implemented measure that made botting/cheating on world spawns 100% ineffective, do you really think all the hnm world spawn shells would have giveen up? No, they would have just kept it tighter and kept trying. That player base did cause a lot of drama but they were dedicated to the game and the scene because they enjoyed camping. Did some just wanna block others? Yes but that is not the majority, honestly. Most were just so into camped and enjoyed it,or just wanted some king gear.

If someone told me they just wanted to block xx from getting such and such I would be like, wtf? If you enjoy camping, great. If you want the gear and wanna work for it, awesome but block someone just to be superior? That's really pathetic and i honestly never knew anyone like that in my scenes.

There should be some luxury content available to players who are talented, dedicated players. Everyone should get a chance at the same stuff but the game shouldnt limit content to those who aren't willing to be dedicated do well on their jobs or EVEN have the free time. If people enjoy camping, I think SE shouldnt hold back on adding such content because another player, who doesnt want to put forth the effort and time, wont get a chance at it.

The same applies for non camps. Abyssea should continue. It just needs to end as the highest quality of endgame content, and the new content should offer some some more elite quality entertainment that keeps the player base engaged and dedicated. Content that requires focus, team work and or high skill level for duo/solo a bit of luck(to make things interesting)and is fair. I do not think the unfair part of long world spawns was because of the timer. It was unfair because of the cheaters.


Theres nothing wrong with wanting to be a superior player if you're good and dedicated and I'm not ashamed to admit it. I did however just get out of an abys party where this SMN in 5/5 af3 telling me how avatar hate REALLY WORKS in a pet party. I bet you can probably guess who died? Yeah, no. I want higher quality content available to the better player. Learning how game mechanics work to better how you play (i said play.. not cheat) should be rewarded and although that reward should be available to any player, it should REQUIRE more effort/time/skill on their behalf!

btw, Camps didnt require skill. It was just a rush and a lot of fun. Anticipating pop and rushing/searching. It was awesome for a bit when you had the time. But lol@ skill to kill that stuff.

You know, everyone should just do what they want to do with their game. Stop being inconsiderate jerks, and stop being whiney lil babies. If you want gear and enjoy the process, go for it. Don't cheat or block others... And if you don't have the time, will power or means to do something in game, do stuff you can do. Don't cry about how you can't do such and such because you don't have the means. That's not really anyones problem and shouldnt effect someone elses activities. The same applies to cheaters.

[Orson]

Im saying SE should MAKE IT so gear reflects skill, make another super hard NM in the traditional sense like AV/PW but make it so you don't need 30 ppl to kill, make an NM thats difficult to an alliance, put it in a BC idc. the best suff should be HARD to obtain.

Both AV and PW weren't hard. They were just plain broken. Aside from that it's obvious that you do understand difficulty has no correlation to whether a HNM is popped or free spawn. That said it boils down too 2 things luck and free time. If that's the case I'm not sure how you can argue that only the best players will get the best gear with that system.

That said though I'd like to point out SE is adjusting kings to make them more accessible. I'm guessing they're are beginning to realize that it's a tiny minority of people that like the king's system.

@Ane
I still like the idea of working as good sized team and I will admit at times chasing down NMs and claiming could be fun. The problem was that frustrating elements just out weighed the fun.

[Karbuncle]

There is no hard in this. Once you know how a mob ticks it's not hard to find a strategy that works 100% of the time. And before you say anything about AV/PW remember that working strategies where found for those too. Any kind of superiority you want to feel will fade once this happens.

We found out how to kill AV the "right" way and not BW(before nerf) / PD Zerging? Or were you just talking about BW / PD Zerging.

Genuinely curious if i missed the right way >.>; I know it was found how to lock 2hours eventually, Least i recall reading it. I used to keep up on it so much it coulda been a dream.