Please remove COP requirements on reforged relic and AF

[mattkoko]

I would like to bump this thread, as it is still a great suggestion that would greatly benefit the game and newbie players. More than ever, newbie players can use any amount of assistance in order to get them up to speed with everyone else.

Being someone who completed CoP after finding out about this requirement (and being distraught like the OP), I would like to further suggest this change in order to keep more people playing FFXI and improve the game going forward.

This topic, suggestion, and the thoughts within, are as relevant as ever, even after the long time that this thread has been dormant. Many people still feel very strongly about this, and I'm hoping that SE can take a second look and reconsider their position on it.

Why bump this thread when there is already a thread running that is asking the same exact thing. Seems kind of redundant don't you think? I get that this is important to you, but 1 running thread about this topic is more then enough

[Crevox]

Seems kind of redundant don't you think?

This thread is suggesting the potential change. The other topic is about the lack of information that the requirement exists. One is a suggestion to the developer, while the other is a discussion of lacking community resources on the topic.

Quite different topics of discussion.

[Zarchery]

I'd also like to see them remove the Delve NM requirements for buying plasm items from Forri-Porri. I don't like Delve, but I'd really like to have those weapons anyway.

Modify the game to attract new players who hate actually playing it. Sounds like a plan

[Zarchery]

I'll agree with this point once someone can give me a reason that we should require key items from Delve NMs before Forri-Porri will sell equipment but we shouldn't require COP for reforging AF and relic.

The argument is hinged upon basically 1 thing: "We shouldn't have to do this content to get this thing I want because I don't want to do it."

[mattkoko]

This thread is suggesting the potential change. The other topic is about the lack of information that the requirement exists. One is a suggestion to the developer, while the other is a discussion of lacking community resources on the topic.

Quite different topics of discussion.

Although I do agree that one thread was about the lack of information, YOU made the same point in both threads, in which case I will revise my point and say, you are being redundant. And now we have to listen to you whine in both threads. Although Zachery and I don't see eye to eye on everything, I agree with his point on this one. Players like you want to play the game, but when you think about it, you really don't. You basically want to bypass the content to reap the rewards that come from that content. So let me ask you this. If you apply this to other games, even the ones that are not online, basically you want the ultimate weapons and armor but you don't feel like playing any of the story to get to it. I take it this is where you insert gameshark and get all the weapons and armor you want from the beginning of the game?

[Crevox]

in both threads.

I responded to posts made to me and I'm done with that thread. I bumped this one, and you're now you're discussing this with me here, so it seems fine.

Players like you want to play the game, but when you think about it, you really don't. You basically want to bypass the content to reap the rewards that come from that content. So let me ask you this. If you apply this to other games, even the ones that are not online, basically you want the ultimate weapons and armor but you don't feel like playing any of the story to get to it. I take it this is where you insert gameshark and get all the weapons and armor you want from the beginning of the game?

I want to do engaging, tough battle content to earn weapons and armor. I have fought and earned the various pieces of equipment I have from delve and high tier battlefields, and all of that was very fun battle content where I had to work as a party to overcome encounters. There was strategy, execution, planning; I got to play with other people; and I got to enjoy the game's battle system. Even if the gear I desire has a low drop rate, I don't mind doing it over and over again, because it's fun.

None of this is done, at all, in something like CoP, where you run around for hours on end doing fetch quests. There is no difficulty involved in this, no RPG-like battle elements; minimal thought required. I would say half the time you're not even looking at the game, you're reading guides on where to go (are you even playing the game at this point?). This is not fun to me. How can anyone even consider completing this an accomplishment, or consider the reward worthwhile for the task? It is menial and tedious.

This, combined with the fact that it takes very long (hours, days), and it is so core and almost essential to the majority of the jobs in the game, makes this requirement a poor choice, especially since basically every newbie player to the game has to complete this in order to get into end game. It's not even like you're getting the armor for free either, you still need to gather the armor itself and then the materials to upgrade it (which, hey, actually requires you fight things).

I still cannot grasp the complaint that removing the requirement would make it "too easy." Was there even any difficulty to begin with? It is a gigantic time dump and nothing more; there is zero difficulty involved.

[mattkoko]

I responded to posts made to me and I'm done with that thread. I bumped this one, and you're now you're discussing this with me here, so it seems fine.



I want to do engaging, tough battle content to earn weapons and armor. I have fought and earned the various pieces of equipment I have from delve and high tier battlefields, and all of that was very fun battle content where I had to work as a party to overcome encounters. There was strategy, execution, planning; I got to play with other people; and I got to enjoy the game's battle system. Even if the gear I desire has a low drop rate, I don't mind doing it over and over again, because it's fun.

None of this is done, at all, in something like CoP, where you run around for hours on end doing fetch quests. There is no difficulty involved in this, no RPG-like battle elements; minimal thought required. I would say half the time you're not even looking at the game, you're reading guides on where to go (are you even playing the game at this point?). This is not fun to me. How can anyone even consider completing this an accomplishment, or consider the reward worthwhile for the task? It is menial and tedious.

This, combined with the fact that it takes very long (hours, days), and it is so core and almost essential to the majority of the jobs in the game, makes this requirement a poor choice, especially since basically every newbie player to the game has to complete this in order to get into end game.

Alright sure, let's just start everyone at level 99 with all jobs while we are at it. See the thing is, they need to spend their time and resources on what you are asking. It is already made soloable. Further, there are HP warps to save even more legwork. So basically you want them to spend their time and resources so you don't have to. And by the end of it all, after countless posts and arguing over days in this forum, you could be done with CoP by now. Instead you would rather come here and whine about it. Every game you play, even the ones you love that could even be your favorite probable has certain pieces of story and content that you would rather not do. But you do it anyway to get the reward in the end. Or maybe you don't do it. But either way, the content is there and the reward is there. If you don't want to do it. If you don't think the reward is worth doing it, then that is your problem, not the developers.

[Zarchery]

I want to do engaging, tough battle content to earn weapons and armor. I have fought and earned the various pieces of equipment I have from delve and high tier battlefields, and all of that was very fun battle content where I had to work as a party to overcome encounters. There was strategy, execution, planning; I got to play with other people; and I got to enjoy the game's battle system. Even if the gear I desire has a low drop rate, I don't mind doing it over and over again, because it's fun.

It's all about what you want and you're so arrogant you believe that is justification. I'm against this because you haven't given a reason to be for it.

I want a Chaac Belt (Treasure Hunter +1). But I don't want to fight Cailimh (Marjami Delve boss). Personally, I just shrug and accept that I don't get to have Chaac Belt. If I had your sense of entitlement, I'd make big long screeds about how unfair it is that I have to fight Cailimh. But I'm more mature than you.

[Balloon]

I mean for the most part I agree that it's not that big of a requirement, but I certainly think it could be tied to something a little more relevant.

As it stands some of the best gear for ilvl 119 is tied to the completion of early level 75 content.

Having it maybe tied to completing an easy/normal high level battlefield makes a little bit of sense, just have the ilvl weapon guy deal with it.

But no 117 or higher player is gonna have much of an issue with CoP, some might have issue soloing VE fights.

You kind of have to do CoP anyway for Rajas, and it could be argued that it at least incentivises people to do CoP, which did have a decent story despite its sometimes fillery length.

For me though, I do find it odd that some of the best gear is gated behind some of the oldest content, especially when the ties between the two are trivial.

[Crevox]

Alright sure, let's just start everyone at level 99 with all jobs while we are at it. See the thing is, they need to spend their time and resources on what you are asking. It is already made soloable. Further, there are HP warps to save even more legwork. So basically you want them to spend their time and resources so you don't have to. And by the end of it all, after countless posts and arguing over days in this forum, you could be done with CoP by now. Instead you would rather come here and whine about it. Every game you play, even the ones you love that could even be your favorite probable has certain pieces of story and content that you would rather not do. But you do it anyway to get the reward in the end. Or maybe you don't do it. But either way, the content is there and the reward is there. If you don't want to do it. If you don't think the reward is worth doing it, then that is your problem, not the developers.

No, let's not give everyone level 99 jobs. Why does this always turn into a giant exaggeration?

And no, it's not just about me. I'm in game, in multiple newbie LS, all day long, and there are many people that have this problem. People quit the game over this. The suggestion is to change it so the requirement is not needed, because it would greatly benefit the game if this specific requirement wasn't there, and increase player attachment rate.

Why are you and everyone else so against change, even if it's positive, or turn it into some over exaggeration? Also, yes, this is all, obviously, an opinion; my opinion, also shared by others. You have your opinion, and I have mine, but why must you and other people continue to call my opinion "dumb" while I am trying to respect and understand yours? Most of the time there isn't even any explanation from people on why it shouldn't be changed, just "do it because that's how it is" or resorting to insults.

It's not even a matter of selfishness, because I already did it. I just think, along with many other people, that it would be a positive change for the game. Even if the requirement was changed to something else that would be fine too, if it means you'll stop telling me I want everything handed to me for free. Sticking the Oboro requirement on it seems like a good idea, because it helps to encourage new players to get started on high level content.