Thoughts on the FFXI Job Adjustment Manifesto

[Siiri]

I don't have to have scholar to post on it. I see it every day. As knowledgeable as you are, Sasaraixx, I am sure you read Kaeko's blogs at 75 where he writes that sch made black mage basically obsolete. A lot of us don't like SE going down that path again.

We bring a scholar to voidwatch, the only real event left in the game. We always brought them to einherjar, limbus, dyna, etc I don't see scholars being left behind in events except abyssea. As for that, welcome to the other 12 jobs left behind by abyssea. I don't see these other jobs abyssea didn't want being buffed.

As for Cure V, I think red mage could get it right now and it wouldn't really affect white mage. I think scholar getting Cure V would cripple white mage.

[Sotek]

I don't have to have scholar to post on it. I see it every day. As knowledgeable as you are, Sasaraixx, I am sure you read Kaeko's blogs at 75 where he writes that sch made black mage basically obsolete. A lot of us don't like SE going down that path again.

Why does everyone always use that blog post as ammunition against Scholar getting buffs?

Kaeko said Scholar basically made Black Mage obsolete but Black Mage never became obsolete and was never replaced by Scholar, quoting that statement holds absolutely no weight whatsoever. The only time Scholar ever replaced anything was White Mage in merit parties, except that was Red Mage since Scholar completely lacked Haste back then. Fuck, Scholar only replaced Black Mage in the sense of MP efficiency and that's something that practically doesn't even matter in the game anymore. Shorter fights, more Refresh gear, higher tiers of Refresh and gear that enhances the effect; MP efficiency is dead.

[Sasaraixx]

Sotek pretty much said it all. Back when there was actually a situation where it SCH was the better nuker, absolutely nothing in the game changed. After all of the buffs BLM has gotten directly and indirectly over the last 20 levels, you can't make that argument with any real sincerity.

And after this adjustment, assuming nothing else changes, there is no reason to bring SCH to Voidwatch. Your LS may bring SCH to VW b/c no one has any other jobs to go as or because your LS leader is nice and lets people go whatever job they want. None of that changes the fact that there really is no need to do so and that your group would probably be better of if those SCHs came as another job. Ein was the one event SCH had some unique utility. That has changed since the level cap increase. Dynamis and Limbus? Seriously?

And I do think you need to play the job to make some of the statements you are trying to. You don't seem to have any real grasp on what these changes are actually doing for the job overall.

[Siiri]

Well what events are YOU talking about where scholar isn't wanted if you think dyna and limbus are lol. I specifically said at 75 when they were real events they came, who cares what people come now. There is 1 event left in the game, voidwatch. Actually I am the ls officer who sets up parties and selects jobs, and I bring a scholar because I think it offers unique abilites, and it does have procs. At this stage of the game I try to let people bring the jobs they want, while helping the group. With 18 people there is a lot of room for flexibility, and scholar is a nice hybrid, I just don't think it should over power the main jobs like it used to do to black mage.

I guess the new high kindred crest battles etc could be called new events. I usually set up those as well, and if its a 6 person one I always bring 2 mages, why wouldn't sch come?

[Sotek]

Oh you're still playing the game with 18 people. This explains everything.

Other than that, do you not read?! Scholar never overpowered Black Mage. Fuck, aren't you the one who complained at us for asking for Storm IIs because the "only good Scholar you knew" bet he could out damage you, didn't share Hailstorm and you still out damage him? I could go find the exact post and replies you never dared respond to if you like. Either stop talking through your ass or leave, your choice.
I'd start ignoring your contributions to the Scholar forums completely, but the way you fly over the massive holes in your logic is just too amazing to leave alone.

There is absolutely no issue with Scholar getting adjustments. It needs adjustments. This is hardly the treatment Samurai got where a perfectly fine job received buff after buff. Other jobs may need adjustments - and more so - as well, but the order SE has done such things has never made sense. If you think a job should have adjustments more than Scholar, go to their forum and complain about it there where they might actually be picked up. Complaining about it here does nothing but give us more reason to post reasons why Scholar needs buffs and suggestions for them, I'd imagine the reason we're getting more adjustments is because we consistently post decent constructive ideas, while something like the Red Mage forum can't even reach a consensus over meleeing and en spells. Giving us reason to flood this place with more posts for Scholar adjustments is counter productive to whatever it is you want to achieve.

[Siiri]

No, the only event we do with 18 is vw. Because no one even has end game link shells anymore, and we have a lot of people who want to come. I have an emperyeon ws static and a +2 gear static with just a few people, although more than recommended because we have a great group of friends who like to hang out on skype etc and just have fun.

It doesn't matter personal player vs player, this was MATH that Kaeko laid out. You bet Kaeko or a really good scholar would obsolete a good black mage at 75. There are spreadsheets out there for DD that you plug in the gear, job, etc and it tells you the math on what is the best job. Same with sch, Kaeko laid out the FACTS, not personal opinions or variations in player's gear/skill/attention span.

[Neisan_Quetz]

Yea, and his math as at 75 for single target nuking. If you haven't noticed, the cap is 95 now.

Outside of VW you don't need a large LS for anything.

[Siiri]

Yea, and his math as at 75 for single target nuking. If you haven't noticed, the cap is 95 now.

Outside of VW you don't need a large LS for anything.

I was speaking at 75 when I spoke of black mage vs. scholar., and said I didn't want to go back to that point in time. Also, I specifically said the only large event done anymore is Voidwatch. So we agree on these points.

[Neisan_Quetz]

In response to the 6 man 2 mages why not Sch - Why would you bring Sch over Blm at 95 (other mage being Whm)?

[Sotek]

You know a lot of Rapture theorists laid out maths and facts, too. Still doesn't change the fact that it didn't happen. Complaining at Scholar overpowering Black Mage at Lv.75 when it never happened is idiotic.

Do you want to know why it never happened? Because maths and facts don't fucking matter in real time. MP efficiency doesn't fucking matter. Ever. Plenty of HNMs typically involved tactics where you don't constantly nuke (Wyrms for example), leaving plenty of time to rest and thus damage becomes more important, Magic Bursts too. Then you have things like JoL where -aga are pretty important for dealing with adds. Granted those tactics aren't set in stone and have plenty of variation, but they were common place and the only way one job will render another job obsolete is if it replaces it in a common place situation. Scholar did not make Black Mage obsolete. Ever.