If RDM and SCH can't have Cure 5, give us Afflatus Misery/Solace

[Daniel_Hatcher]

Im going to put this as simply as I can.

SCH isnt a whm.
SCH isnt a blm.

SCH SHOULDNT get abilities and spells that put it on par or surpasses these jobs.
SCH SHOULD Remain lesser than these two jobs.

Why? Because you can flick back and forth from healer to nuker.

Deal with it.

---

I actually did come up with a method of having it so that SCH and RDM can have cure 5. It involves making it so that every cure spell with WHM will put on a powerful regen effect on the target. Also add more monsters that use doom moves that are unrecoverable with medicine and have it so that cure spells with misery up 100% remove the doom effect.

And there you have it. You get cure 5 and whms still are main healers.

Point is this. You are ALWAYS going to HAVE to be worse at healing than whm. Its not your job to be the best. Its to be the best of what schs can do. (I still think sch shouldnt even exist btw...)

No one denies this. Cure V IS a spell SCH and RDM should get, it's not a question. It's a fact. Up until Cure VI was added RDM was always only one step behind other jobs with no AoE, so not getting Cure V when VI has been added and subjobs gain IV is a joke.

SCH as it stands is an odd one, it's currently on par with BLM for it's single target nukes, yet so very far behind Cure's on WHM. Now I'm not saying I want them to get Cure VI but it's certainly odd to be so far behind on curing but not on nuking.

[Saefinn]

Two or three of them actually but gdi, that's a fucking awesome idea! Sounds a lot like WoW or other MMO but whatever, it would be a very very original concept in FFXI! A HoT that does an initial heal and then goes on, if you want you can "consume" the remaining HoT with a modusveritas-like JA.

Omg I'm in love with this scenario! But it would probably be a bit too far off from current game mechanics. Too bad! Doubt it's gonna happen in the last 95>99 levels :P but that's a shame, it was an awesome idea.

It's definitely appropriate for how the job works. I used to love Regen II in the lower levels (37-50) because it was enough to keep people alive, because it meant I was able keep people's HP up and do other things. I think in a cure bombing situation your healing-helix would be there to enhance your curing, just as in a nuking situation your helices may be useful in enhancing your damage dealing (or dealing damage whilst you save somebody's ass). In other situations, you could throw that healing helix and take advantage of other roles - you may nuke or use elemental-helix spells or throw some enhancements, remove status effects or help with crowd control. Would it be overpowered? The recast of a helix is 37 seconds, so you couldn't spam it onto multiple party members at once, you could helix a tank, but reserve Cure IV for other members. Helices can't be AoE'd either, so you wouldn't be able to work around it. It'd help balance SCH's curing side, appeal to its exclusive set of spells and at the same time, be unique and restrictive enough to allow WHM to be the better healer with its own set of exclusive spells to top. Many reasons why this is a good idea, but we don't want to flatter the poor bloke too much.

[Economizer]

No one denies this. Cure V IS a spell SCH and RDM should get, it's not a question. It's a fact. Up until Cure VI was added RDM was always only one step behind other jobs with no AoE, so not getting Cure V when VI has been added and subjobs gain IV is a joke.

SCH as it stands is an odd one, it's currently on par with BLM for it's single target nukes, yet so very far behind Cure's on WHM. Now I'm not saying I want them to get Cure VI but it's certainly odd to be so far behind on curing but not on nuking.

Seriously, how many times do we have to go over this. Cure VI is not a reason to get a spell, Cure VI is a joke. White Mages would be less offended if you asked for Cure VI, because it sucks.

Imagine if Black Mage had a nuke that costed one hundred more MP to do one hundred more damage. This is pretty much what Cure VI is to a White Mage.

Saying that White Mage having Cure VI is a reason to get a spell, is to show massive, willful ignorance about the way healing works in the game.

Sup.

Can this be the rallying cry of White Mages everywhere, at least in response to people saying that nobody enjoys playing the job?

I like that it fulfills it's purpose really well, but it gives me more buttons to push than other single purpose jobs

Several times I've almost requested to make the job harder to pick up and play, given the amount of people who talk about leveling a White Mage mule, but the more I think about it, perhaps it isn't that White Mage is so easy you can dual box it, but instead that traditional melee jobs are so easy that you can pick up another account and still be able to smack stuff for damage.

[Daniel_Hatcher]

Seriously, how many times do we have to go over this. Cure VI is not a reason to get a spell, Cure VI is a joke. White Mages would be less offended if you asked for Cure VI, because it sucks.

Imagine if Black Mage had a nuke that costed one hundred more MP to do one hundred more damage. This is pretty much what Cure VI is to a White Mage.

Saying that White Mage having Cure VI is a reason to get a spell, is to show massive, willful ignorance about the way healing works in the game.

No it isn't, the fact Cure IV doesn't cut it anymore is the reason the jobs need Cure V.

As for WHM, I've levelled it but paint drying is more entertaining than playing as it. It's a means to an end as opposed to a fun job.

[Reaux]

We don't want to be the best. We want our jobs to do what they were intended to do. One of the roles of RDM and SCH is to heal - not to heal as well as a WHM, but to be able to fill the role if a WHM isn't available. Now it's a necessity for many NMs to bring a WHM (this is excluding procs, because WHM has the upper hand even then, light procs). For every other job type there's a choice - if you need a tank you might choose a THF or a NIN, for Melee damage you might choose a WAR or a DRK, for enhancing you might choose a BRD or COR, for ranged attack you might choose a COR or RNG, for nuking you might choose a SCH or a BLM, for healing, you choose a WHM unless the NM is weak enough, then you've got a choice.


I also love SCH exclusive content, so as a solution I like Leon's idea because it's very much within the nature of SCH. His suggestion appeals to my play style from lower levels.

This is all incorrect and has less to do with jobs capabilities and the dev team and more to do with the playerbase. SCH and RDM are not made to replace WHM if it isnt there. They are not healers. They are hybrids with RDM having more melee/enfeeble focus and SCH being more casting focused. SCH has decently capable nukes and can increase their accuracy with abilities, less mp cost, and some fast cast. Yes I know someone earlier mentioned how they hate books used as a reason but that is your unique ability, learn to use it more effectively and you can make up for "short comings" RDM just has never been allowed to melee...ever it is the only job that can have room to really complain, especially with the decision to give it high enhancing skill and not giving it unique buffs or AoE pro/shell.

If you need a tank you do not pick THF unless the mob is easy and does mostly physical attacks, if it nukes a THF is dead. It does not have the shadows or higher INT of NIN to block those and cannot enfeeble or use /DNC the same way to survive. WAR has the ability to use MANY weapon types and off tank, playerbase won't allow that. DRK's have just stopped using their magic completely and have the advantage to SC and MB....something people just rarely do anymore, it can also enfeeble and absorb attributes but doesn't, again playerbase fault.

When I start seeing more SCH's use their books and helix spells to boost their skills then maybe I can understand the want for more, but few do. However I agree with the idea of RDM getting more unique and AoE buffs or a buff/heal and giving SCH a super heal helix cool thing instead of Cure V.

[Ank]

No it isn't, the fact Cure IV doesn't cut it anymore is the reason the jobs need Cure V.

The fact that rdm and sch's highest cure is subbable /whm now and /rdm in the future is somewhat indicative of how outdated it is. Maybe we "aren't healers" but 44/51 levels without an upgrade is pretty amazing.

Cure v, healing helix, whatever, can't speak for how rdm's think but I'm sure most sch would be happy with anything as long as it lets them cast while waiting on cure4 recast.

As for misery/solace. That's silly, you're silly.

[Saefinn]

If it's less to do with the dev team then why was Cure IV available to RDM and SCH before Abyssea? In allowing RDM and SCH to use Cure IV when Cure IV was powerful enough for a main healer they've made RDM and SCH healers and healers who can be used when a WHM is not available. The player base will take what's available to them and make use of it. It's not the primary role of a RDM or SCH, granted, but it is 'a' role. With Abyssea Cure IV is less useful and RDM and SCH are in need of an update if they're going to remain true to their previous capabilties. Don't get me wrong, SCH is still a fantastic healer and people I team up with me probably think it's odd that I think SCH needs work in its healing department.

But personally, I love embracing a job's exclusivity and what makes them special rather than borrow too much from another job, hence I prefer the healing helix and enhancing cure ideas over being given Cure V.


But:

When I start seeing more SCH's use their books and helix spells to boost their skills then maybe I can understand the want for more, but few do.

This surprises me. I can't live without my stratagems (or books) and helix spells are great and can be used in a number of situations - as a companion for nukes, to deal additional damage without gaining a lot of hate whilst you spend your timing enhancing and healing and even to keep claim on an NM, but also kite them - SCH/RDM is great for kiting when a tank is dead or charmed - you're wearing the mob down, keep claim without having to directly damage the enemy.

Mind you, I've never teamed up with another SCH, even when using my other level 90 jobs, so I don't know how other people are playing the job.

[Zatias]

Cure 4 sucks now. Cure 5 please.

Really though, WHM is the only viable healer now. Anything else yanks hate all over the place or just can't cure for enough. Wouldn't a supporting RDM with Cure V help when the WHM is incapacitated?

No, that would take the WHM's job away, wouldn't it.

It's not like WHM has huge cure potency, low casting times, cureskin, potent barspells, and mp return pants. Cure V is the only thing that's keeping them the main healer.

RDM and SCH will remain neglected, to say the least.

[Malamasala]

Really though, WHM is the only viable healer now. Anything else yanks hate all over the place or just can't cure for enough.

Or has ridiculous timers. (PUP, SMN, DNC) Though I bet if a DNC could spam their highest waltz, it would pull more hate than any other spell.

[Leonlionheart]

INB4 they raise the level of Cure IV to 50 for WHM to "fix" this problem.