Raise the Minimum Requirement for entering Abyssea to Lv70 or 75

[rog]

Your right rog people that were not brain dead didn't use pld at all.

They also subbed war, just fine. /nin was always overrated.

[Chocobits]

Don't know (don't care) but we can always add a third wheel to this "debate" and start another argument about the evils of paying to leech. I'm taking the "pay for exp? screw that" stance. I called it first. Then we can have Tybudx go off-topic, make a mistake, get called out on it, and then have him subsequently try to blame the off-topicness on the other person again while he flails about trying to avoid the mistake. Then watch him throw angry words around to try to cover it up by kicking dirt on it. You know, like a dog hiding a bone that it stole from the kitchen table.

Well I'm done throwing fuel on the "fire", I'll be over there, rolling my eyes (or sleeping, yeah, that sounds good).

I wonder if anyone has caught on yet that I'm not whiteknighting leeches or defendering justice. It would've been more apparent (or transparent?) if the forum police hadn't deleted all my muffin related content from this thread.

A successful troll doesn't allow his arbitrarily decided opponent to realize they've been beaten, so that he can milk the topic for all it is worth. Once the opponent realizes defeat, the troll fails because he won't be fed any more. This thread, however is starting to degenerate into the stuff that even trolls won't even touch. It's been picked clean twice through. I may have to retreat into my cave for the winter. Even trolls hibernate to conserve strength, you know?

[Panthera]

All I read from panthera is: "if you are bad in this game, and don't shout it to everyone, you are a dirty dirty cheater."

and achievements are srs business

I'm quite sure that is all you got out of it.

[Romanova]

I'm quite sure that is all you got out of it.

you're right, I lied. I also learned you are not a doctor.

[Chocobits]

I'm quite sure that is all you got out of it.

See I got so much more out of it than that. I took all the random one-sided analogies and I put them together and I realized you were telling a story.

A story about a man who was going through med school. One of the students he was paired up with stole some of his work and used it in their thesis. They cheated to get their PhD and, embittered, the man dropped out. Not soon afterward, his fiance left him for a man who never went to school and was elevated to a well paying position because his father owned the company.

Exasperated, lonely and filled with raaaaage, he embarked on a quest to go forth and exterminate laziness, corruption, cheating and free rides by utilizing the only venue open to him:

The internet.

[Greatguardian]

I'm quite sure that is all you got out of it.

I'm curious.

How good are you at FFXI? How well do you know the game, and fundamental mechanics? Do you gear swap, and how much? How fast are your reaction times? Do you carry PDT/MDT sets? Do you keep Food, Reraise, Sneak, Invis, and other necessary consumables on your person when you play? What Atmas and Abyssites do you have? How about Mission line accesses? Do your 2-hand melees have a working 5-hit? Do you have any WoE/Empyrean/Magian weapons?

Because, as far as you're concerned, that's all that matters. I might be good at FFXI, or I might be bad as far as you know. Either way it won't affect you one bit unless we are in a group together. And really, if you're picking up people you don't know for a group and aren't ready for them to be utterly useless (or prepared to replace them if they look like they might be), you don't have anyone to blame but yourself. This has been the case since ... forever.

[Panthera]

the smart player will learn a lot more about how to play his job in few days of training on aby NMs (different ones,not brewing) will learn a lot more effithan 3month of stupid xp monsters (even if he sux on the first fight)

Your diction and spelling not withstanding, you think it's a better idea to have someone leech to get to 90 and then throw them at an NM? The reason that it makes more sense to have people learn the basics on an exp monster than a notorious monster is that there's less at stake with the former than the latter. Even first tier or stand alone NMs might drop something someone wants, and no one wants to waste time with slow fight or defeats because someone doesn't know what they're doing because they leeched to get to 90. And furthermore, I'd wager that a leecher "sux" for more than just the first notorious monster you threw him at.

Depending on what you fight, you learn the fundamentals on experience points mobs. Even Imps teach that life-saving cures comes first, using negative status removal spells comes second, and buffing and debuffing after that. It teaches you to stay out of AOE if you're a mage, and other core concepts.

Yes, you are exposed to more different things at end game Abyssea which you must grasp to succeed, but that's exactly why it's a terrible idea to cut your teeth there. You want to learn fundamentals first, and then the various quirks of each NM, and the entire convoluted mechanics of Abyssea second, bit by bit as you go. As an analogy, sure, you could take 23 hours in college, but for most people, it spells disaster. Sometimes, learning less means learning more, and learning more means learning less.

I haven't consider getting a job @75 an accomplishment since colibri burn exist unless it was your first job (you did the lol LBs) a 6 year old could grind xp to 75 ( I know people who lvled some of their job by letting their children play them)

IMO getting another job at 75(now 90) was just a (boring time sink) mean to do content in a different way (not always being the same job) you can get satisfaction getting your lvl75 outside Abyssea , you can even lvl it to 90 outside abyssea if you want (that might be worth being considered an accomplishment)

Between the parenthesis and sentence fragments, I gather from this that you're saying that you don't think it's an accomplishment because it's too easy. But you're taking for granted what challenge there is to be had from exping. Players did die, and entire parties did wipe. This is not possible without the presence of challenge, or it wouldn't happen. That's like saying,"oh, it's completely safe! the sniper not withstanding, of course."

Part of the challenge was precisely the grind aspect, which you again take for granted. If we removed leveling and had poweful characters from the get go, having powerful characters wouldn't mean as much, because they were always that way. Being at the top of the mountain is not the achievement; getting there is. That's why they call it achieving the summit.

I leech in abyssea pt so that i can tell people "Hey, now i can come This job"
I recently leeched my war, few hour after that leech PT I was able to proc all the RED !! we couldn't proc before, we finished empys faster because we got 100% KI.

Yes, cheating to get to 90 means you have a 90 you can play. You're using the "ends justify the means" arguement, saying having a 90 is all that matters, but there are previously explained, broader implications.

[Panthera]

So wait, I leveled WHM on my main the first time, way before TOAU, and now I burned my alts WHM to 90, therafore, im still a cheater and dont know how to play WHM on my mule? Or if I use my mule to get into a shout group and tell people I know how to play WHM, im lying to people?

Yes. You did learn how to play on your first time through, but forgot how to be persistant the second time through. There's much to do in FFXI, all of which takes time, and I'd rather not waste time with people who burn out easily. I am just as concerned with the quality of the player as I am the quality of the character that they play. I would rather trust myself with hard working people than people who take short cuts.

[Panthera]

you're right, I lied. I also learned you are not a doctor.

Didn't say I was.

[Ravenmore]

Again targeting IT++ was what caused 90% or wipes in exp. If you got 2 IT++ beating on your party you would wipe, but 2 VTs no problem. Please also stop acting like there a massive amount of completly new players that have never fought most of the mobs in the game. One of my LSs best whms leach it up about 2 months ago and was as good if not better then every other whm in the LS. Know why hes been playing the role of whm for the past 3 years on rdm. Every job in the game right now can fill many differnt roles. Right now blu is more of a jack of all trades then rdm, in a party I can out heal rdm, out nuke (magical nuke), damn sure can out tank them since SE came out the blue one day and took all of rdms hate tools away. I master all those roles outside of EXP on NMs.