Monster aggro

I'm not certain if this issue has been brought up by anyone, but I would love to have an explanation for the reason why, at Lv75, about 22-24 levels above a monster meant it stopped attacking me when I walked by, but now at Lv90, monsters over 30 levels below me will still attack me. I know we need to maintain some of them staying easy pray so we still have options for the Magian Trials, but what I would like to know is, can we expect these creatures to continue to attack us even when we're level 99? Will I ever be able to walk through Kuftal Tunnel and be ignored by the Robber Crabs?

I know this is somewhat minor, but I was wondering if this was intentional or if maybe, since the cap was initially expected to hold at Lv75, the aggro conditions of these monsters was never adjusted to act in the same way as everything else with a level check. It's partially a curiosity and partially something I'd like to see possibly changed in the future (with the next level cap increase perhaps).

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Originally Posted by LeaderofAtlantis

I know this is somewhat minor, but I was wondering if this was intentional or if maybe, since the cap was initially expected to hold at Lv75, the aggro conditions of these monsters was never adjusted to act in the same way as everything else with a level check.

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As of late, this has been my belief exactly. And like you, I'm also rather annoyed at the fact that these so much lower level mobs still aggro.

Robber crabs are supposed to have a max level of 63. At 27 levels above them I wouldn't expect to be aggro'd. I recall just as well at 75 that level 48 mobs sure didn't aggro me. A great example of this are the Big Claw crabs in Sea Serpent Grotto (the ones that spawn near the Ghasts on the way to Norg), which have a max level of 48. They stopped aggro'ing even before level 75.

If SE plans to leave these mobs as EP to allow them to be options for magian trials at least let them be set as the easy prey type that don't aggro.

Anything that would match EP to a 75 will be EP to a 90+, and as such they can still aggro you. One thing I've noticed though some EP/DC mobs will leave you alone if your stats are considerably higher than theirs, at the same time there are mobs that will attack no matter what. I think there are some kinds of hidden behavioral patterens to monsters SE never let us in on, because I can have over 600 attack with a H2H weapon and be left alone, but swap to a club or stave that gives lower attack and I'll get aggro.

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Originally Posted by Swords

...I can have over 600 attack with a H2H weapon and be left alone, but swap to a club or stave that gives lower attack and I'll get aggro.

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Monster aggro is directly tied to your combat skill of the weapon in your main hand. Weaker skill = higher check level.

lawlwut

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Uh.. so are you saying if I go rdm/nin with a staff equipped (= 0 staff skill), it means what? I'm gonna get aggro left, right and center? Too weak mobs will suddenly check as decent challenge or something?..

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Originally Posted by thefinalrune

Monster aggro is directly tied to your combat skill of the weapon in your main hand. Weaker skill = higher check level.

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No. Just, no. /check results are affected by combat skill, but not aggro.

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Originally Posted by thefinalrune

Monster aggro is directly tied to your combat skill of the weapon in your main hand. Weaker skill = higher check level.

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Monster aggro is based on your level in comparison to the level of the mob. The only thing that combat skill on the weapon does is determine what the mob will check to you as far as their evasion and defense.

One thing, not fully related to this topic but the other day I was aggro'd by a Too Weak to be Worthwhile Fierce Smilodon while running through Vunkerl [S]. Does this happen with any other non-NM enemy type and is this normal behavior for these enemies?

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Originally Posted by Charismatic

One thing, not fully related to this topic but the other day I was aggro'd by a Too Weak to be Worthwhile Fierce Smilodon while running through Vunkerl [S]. Does this happen with any other non-NM enemy type and is this normal behavior for these enemies?

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As far as I know, it only happens when you heal in front of them. Did you heal near the Smilodon? If you are level 90 and heal in front of a Goblin near Bastok in the present, they'll attack you for example.

The only "Too Weak" monster that attacks no matter what are the Detectors in Ve'Lugannon Palace and Defenders in the Shrine of Ru'Avitau. They are aggressive to sound. I can't think of any others off the top of my head.

I grow very tired of having to use sneak and invis on mobs that I can kill in a blink of an eye. Half the fun being level capped imho is running through areas without aggro. It's freedom. I ain't liking the aggro when there shouldn't be any. If this were real life I doubt very seriously a level 63 goblin is going to charge my level 90 warrior at first sight. It will very likely quietly tip toe away from me as to not be noticed so that someday it can ding 64. It didn't reach level 63 because of stupidity, after all.

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Originally Posted by LeaderofAtlantis

As far as I know, it only happens when you heal in front of them. Did you heal near the Smilodon? If you are level 90 and heal in front of a Goblin near Bastok in the present, they'll attack you for example.

The only "Too Weak" monster that attacks no matter what are the Detectors in Ve'Lugannon Palace and Defenders in the Shrine of Ru'Avitau. They are aggressive to sound. I can't think of any others off the top of my head.

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Actually, no. But what I can say about it is having looked up the enemy's level just now... it's in the right range to aggro and actually shouldn't have been too weak in the first place (but I can assure you it did con too weak and also did not yield experience points). These things are levels 67-70, very odd for there to have been a Too Weak one in the first place.
Now I'm curious if that level range is correct on the wiki or if there's some stranger things going on.

Think about it, if all these EPs were checking as TW, no one would be able to do magian trials at level 90 without level sync :p.

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Originally Posted by Charismatic

Actually, no. But what I can say about it is having looked up the enemy's level just now... it's in the right range to aggro and actually shouldn't have been too weak in the first place (but I can assure you it did con too weak and also did not yield experience points). These things are levels 67-70, very odd for there to have been a Too Weak one in the first place.
Now I'm curious if that level range is correct on the wiki or if there's some stranger things going on.

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You know what, a couple times now, there has been an Orcish Dreadnought in The Monastic Cavern where I've never seen one spawn before. I've been playing this game for 7+ years now and I have been through that place more times than I can count and NEVER had I seen it where I saw it - in the east tunnel at around G-8/9, south of the small open spot where the 2 tunnels meet up again and there's an Orcish Champion (which has always been there). The Dreadnought isn't always there, but the first time I went there and it was, I didn't notice it until I heard the grunt noise the Orces make upon aggro and I thought "I'm level 90, what the heck is able to aggro me in this tunnel... oh there it is."

Being around for 7 years, this wouldn't have been unheard of back in the early years of the game because monsters didn't used to despawn once the people who aggroed them initially died or warped or whatever. They'd stop, turn around and slowly walk back to their spawn point which would leave them to aggro anyone in their wake (sorry if you remember this time, just inform the newer players). I have, now fond, but then not so fond, memories of massive trains of bats or even skeletons being brought to the Garlaige Citadel's zone and then all of it wiping out parties. There used to be 3 or 4 parties that would be on the first steps just inside gaining experience and every last one of them had to zone themselves or risk being crushed by the returning monsters. I also remember this being used by a higher level DRG back when I was still taking my first job, THF, to Lv75 and in Yhoator Jungle. This individual decided to pull a Tonberry all the way to the Yuhtunga Jungle zone (which, with the distance from the first Tonberry to that zone line, he did it intentionally I think).

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Originally Posted by Vlorsutes

Monster aggro is based on your level in comparison to the level of the mob. The only thing that combat skill on the weapon does is determine what the mob will check to you as far as their evasion and defense.

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Evasion and defense check results are based on your attack and accuracy. Weapon skill adds 1 attack and 1 accuracy up till 200 skill after which is adds 1 attack and .9 accuracy. The accuracy and evasion results when checking a monster do not make any distinction between accuracy and attack from weapon skill and accuracy and attack from other sources.

Robber Crabs biting your ankles at level 90 getting you down?

We spoke to the development team about this and they are planning on making adjustments. Due to the fact that each area will need to be addressed individually, the cost will be a bit high and they have decided to take care of this in the future through multiple phases of implementation.

If this kind of thing is to be addressed across the board, my only worry is that it will involve tweaks to the monster difficulty formula post-75, thereby making it harder to find monsters for Magian Trials. Personally I'd much rather casts sneak and invisible on myself to avoid these minor annoyances than dispose of the possibility of keeping monsters EP post-75 to be used with Magians.

I hope the solution is more Abyssea. So all those robber crabs go TW until you kill them, then they come back as T and chase you down.

Robber Crabs biting your ankles at level 90 getting you down?

My BLM says "Step your game up."

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Originally Posted by Seyomeyo

If this kind of thing is to be addressed across the board, my only worry is that it will involve tweaks to the monster difficulty formula post-75, thereby making it harder to find monsters for Magian Trials. Personally I'd much rather casts sneak and invisible on myself to avoid these minor annoyances than dispose of the possibility of keeping monsters EP post-75 to be used with Magians.

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I see no reason all of those monsters couldn't stay EP and still not aggro. I've encountered plenty of EP aggressive mobs that didn't so much as look at me when I passed them. I don't mind EP mobs and their aggro until they start aggroing when they shouldn't. So it would be a shame that the trade off here might be too weak mobs. Though I admit, it would be amusing to finally see TWs in cape.

Come to think of it, I wouldn't mind Eps being changed to TW like they technically should be and for magian trials to work a bit differently. Kinda like inflicting you with a level cap during your trial killing. But I don't have to be a dev to already know how much of a chore it'd be to go back and change things up that much.

Too weak mobs can be fixed to work with trials simply by modifying the exp system to give at least 1 exp for too weak mobs at least level 50. If a mob is level 50 or higher no matter what it rates it should give at least 1 exp to each player. The work SE is doing seems to be one of those complex over thought out systems. Reverting the old system while maintaining the exp boost and giving a base +1 to +5 exp bonus for level 50+ would've solved the issue completely.

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Originally Posted by Camate

Robber Crabs biting your ankles at level 90 getting you down?

We spoke to the development team about this and they are planning on making adjustments. Due to the fact that each area will need to be addressed individually, the cost will be a bit high and they have decided to take care of this in the future through multiple phases of implementation.

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simple fix, just make it so EPs don't aggro