Need Delve weapons to beat delve NMs...

So I have been running very selective pugs on asura... have yet to beat the delve NMs i need. doing ERMD (mostly ERM because the delve wearers no longer need the NMS....) and I CANNOT down any of the mobs... its not out of fail, we are timing out. Just can't put out enough damage. SE needs to fix this shit show or I will be walking away from this game... SMGDH

I will try that then. ty

What I find funny about the "kick under performing players" is almost everyone has issues when your accuracy gets floored during "mob buff time" which people largely love to ignore.

Ah yes, all dd are created equal and have equal zerg potential.

The wave of dnc and blu's destroying delve NMs just boggles the mind.

Well, it would if I saw any.

2hr's also, as they've had for a long time, have much better acc from dex, and right now, every bit of acc matters.

A relic thf will never dd like a relic drk, and it possibly never should, but why is the guy who mained thf less entitled to the kill right now? He may have put equal effort into his job, or more, than the drk, but the drk will outperform him.

And of course, dw'er need to upgrade 2 weapons.

Shy of blm burning Kurma, I can't say I've seen a blm in Delve or Fracture. They're less entitled.

Btw, I main pld, enjoy maining pld, and get more invites than I want, really, but I can recognize poor design when I see it.

The 20 minute limit was a /panic bandaid that excluded a lot of decent players from content they're willing to strive for, but the thf's and bsts won't be getting invites any time soon.

Unless they're willing to pay for it.

Probably if you want all "legit" as you say so, you shouldn't enforce ppl to use 3rd party tools such as parse stuff, that is btw, not legit at all, at least on SE rules agreement. Sorry but windower tool even if it can be appealing and useful is cheating.

And yeah ppl can write a bible about how SE should of implement those features but they haven't (for being lazy, or they don't care at all), ergo, is not legit.

Amazed that a forum administrator hasn't locked those suggestions.

But doesn't mean that players shouldn't try their best to get the gear/wins/weapons required to DD properly. That is hard because ppl don't want to redo wins for others ? Yes is hard. So maybe they should step up and make their own shouts to gather other folks that need those wins as well. Kinda reminds me VW win clears.

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Originally Posted by Grondell

So I have been running very selective pugs on asura... have yet to beat the delve NMs i need. doing ERMD (mostly ERM because the delve wearers no longer need the NMS....) and I CANNOT down any of the mobs... its not out of fail, we are timing out. Just can't put out enough damage. SE needs to fix this shit show or I will be walking away from this game... SMGDH

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lot of people have done it in <20min without delve weapon.
If you don't have REM95+ go get a skirmish weapon.
if you still cant beat em the issue is not your weapon.

T1-3 can be farmed inside (and are easier since no 20min depop)
once you have defeat one nm per area you have acces to all the armor with plasm.
plasm can be farmed on fodder mobs inside, you can even solo farm outside(shard), it's slow but can be done

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

You're missing the point. It's a catch 22. You need to be a "legit DD" to win, but you have to win to become a 'legit DD." The only thing preventing a total-screwover is support classes (WHM, BRD, SCH, COR, SMN) can get away without haivng delve stuff because they aren't as stat dependent.

Thing is, basically anybody with delve gear will stomp all over anyone without it. Even with the less popular DD jobs- the new gear is such a radical transformation that you would easily take one of those jobs with the gear over the most popular job without it.

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I've seen reports of well geared, delve-weapon, ninjas outperforming relic drks and their ilk in non-delve content, because who would bring a ninja to delve.

The elitist air in here. ITS SUFFOCATING ME, GOD DAMNIT! GAHHHH!

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Originally Posted by Wyrmnus

The elitist air in here. ITS SUFFOCATING ME, GOD DAMNIT! GAHHHH!

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Lol, it's ALWAYS been here, only thing that's changed is Adoulin helped it come back out since AFK-ssea was super incredible at hiding it :P

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Originally Posted by hiko

lot of people have done it in <20min without delve weapon.
If you don't have REM95+ go get a skirmish weapon.
if you still cant beat em the issue is not your weapon.

T1-3 can be farmed inside (and are easier since no 20min depop)
once you have defeat one nm per area you have acces to all the armor with plasm.
plasm can be farmed on fodder mobs inside, you can even solo farm outside(shard), it's slow but can be done

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Lol do you even know that about 40~50% of ppl's on each server did not done even VW , and there is not their fault , there not because they are bad players , there not because they lazy players/nobs/etc , there is irl life outside of fkn KB you know . I spended pretty much time to do it also i know . Now what we have here - all right new delve , once again need spend time that you sometimes not even have to get wins/gears that need to be pretty tough to even get inv. in party (*_*) .I know ppl's can say -> lol if u have no pretty much time to FFXI wtf u playin' it bro , answer is short ---> i 20 year play FF series so why shouldnt i !

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Originally Posted by Vladislav

Lol do you even know that about 40~50% of ppl's on each server did not done even VW , and there is not their fault , there not because they are bad players , there not because they lazy players/nobs/etc , there is irl life outside of fkn KB you know . I spended pretty much time to do it also i know . Now what we have here - all right new delve , once again need spend time that you sometimes not even have to get wins/gears that need to be pretty tough to even get inv. in party (*_*) .I know ppl's can say -> lol if u have no pretty much time to FFXI wtf u playin' it bro , answer is short ---> i 20 year play FF series so why shouldnt i !

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Did you know 99.2% of statistics are made up on the spot?

Also, people should have, and most could have, gotten in on voidwatch while it was going. They liked to cry about RME only shouts, but there were so many jobs that were less demanding, and not all shouts were RME only, especially city clears.

A great many people that didn't do voidwatch didn't do it because they were lazy, procrastinating, or severely antisocial. I started playing blu entirely because there's no gear demand for blu to get into voidwatch. Have capped skill, have spells, profit.

There were even numerous times a blu would send me a tell "I don't have all x spells, I can't learn X for some reason, would you do it" so I traded an element.".

Greetings,

Please note that the use of a parser violates the Terms of Service. As such, telling players to use them on the forum is a violation of the Forum rules, and we ask that you please refrain from doing so to to avoid account action.

Thank you,
GM Bublex

^ This kind of made me lol.

Good to know i guess. Though it does confuuzle me how checking your damage is on the same level of "Banworthy" As Fishbotting or Windower, both which offer clear advantages... Parses just sum up your chat log damage, something anyone in fifth grade with reading could do given hours of time :|, Its like banning calculators D:.

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Originally Posted by Karbuncle

Good to know i guess. Though it does confuuzle me how checking your damage is on the same level of "Banworthy" As Fishbotting or Windower, both which offer clear advantages... Parses just sum up your chat log damage, something anyone in fifth grade with reading could do given hours of time :|, Its like banning calculators D:.

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Probably has more to do with FFXI parsers hooking into FFXI itself to my knowledge, that make them violate the ToS. If it was a completely stand-alone application, like FRAPS or anti-virus are, they'd probably have less problems with it.



As for Delve NMs, wouldn't kill them to bump the timer up to 30 min at least.

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Originally Posted by OmnysValefor

I've seen reports of well geared, delve-weapon, ninjas outperforming relic drks and their ilk in non-delve content, because who would bring a ninja to delve.

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people who don't realize that anyone with one of these weapons will eviscerate just about anything. There are HTH weapons with a base damage 5 times higher than what was typical before the expansion (the largest increase among weapon types, though i acknowledge this doesn't factor your pre-weapon base damage). Whether you're a MNK or a PUP, you're going to stomp all over any DD without a delve weapon.

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Originally Posted by GM Bulbex

Greetings,

Please note that the use of a parser violates the Terms of Service. As such, telling players to use them on the forum is a violation of the Forum rules, and we ask that you please refrain from doing so to to avoid account action.

Thank you,
GM Bublex

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Then you should kindly consider providing your players such a feature, such that they don't have to risk their accounts just to calculate how much damage they're doing, something they shouldn't have to break the rules to find out.

honestly, things like parser and recount ONLY breed elitism. I've NEVER seen a parser/recount user who didn't end up being some elitist jackass. its already bad enough that people think relic, empy, or mythic weapons are REQUIRED for low end content like VW, NNI, etc. if SE allowed things like parser, the problem would only spiral so far out of control it could never be fixed. yes, there are legitimate uses for those kinds of things, but the abusers far outnumber the users.

being required to have gear from specific content in order to do that content is retarded, circular logic, and in my opinion, anyone who shouts to form groups that require this shouldn't be allowed to play. you're only hurting the playerbase as a whole. I get it, people don't like dying, or failing to kill an nm, or clear a missin, or whatever. but guess what? all those strategies you cling to like leeches to skin were created by people who had the balls to take a few deaths, wait on weakness timers (I don't like weakness personally, but that's not the point), and try, try, try again.

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honestly, things like parser and recount ONLY breed elitism. I've NEVER seen a parser/recount user who didn't end up being some elitist jackass.

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This is really an unfair stereotype. There's a difference between wanting to know these things and being an elitist. It becomes more difficult to improve yourself if you don't know what your weak points are or you don't know just how much of a difference this or that stat on gear makes. It's about making informed decisions.

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Originally Posted by Doctrine

yes, there are legitimate uses for those kinds of things, but the abusers far outnumber the users.

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Sorry, you're quite wrong in this regard.
The "Elitists" that abuse the parses for ego stroking are the minority of the bunch, by a huge amount.
Unfortunatey they are the most vocal, but as our local friendly neighbourhood GM Bublex has said, parsing is illegal.
If they openly talk about it you are free to call for a GM on them.

You won't know about 95% of the people that legitimately parses as they use it for their personal improvement and noone elses.
They won't even let you know that they parse unless you ask them directly and even then most of us will deny it.
The few legitimate that do approach you will always do this for your your benefit and in the most subtle of ways.

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Originally Posted by Doctrine

honestly, things like parser and recount ONLY breed elitism.

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What makes a person an elitist? Does someone who strives to be the best at what they do count? What about someone who prefers playing with other people who also strive to be the best, but is still willing to play with people who don't know what /acmd leader does? Or are you just stereotyping everyone who encourages skillful play as those few a-holes who think that if you suck at one aspect of FFXI, you suck at every aspect of life?

Yes, there are a-holes out there. Yes, we all have our preferences towards who we play with. You are no exception. There are people you exclude yourself from playing with because they rub you the wrong way.

If you want nothing more than to win, why would you accept someone who is level 30? If you want nothing more than to have fun and enjoy the company of your party members, why would you accept someone who can't say 7 words without insulting someone? I play for the reasons I play. My reasons are no less legitimate than yours. The means I use to seek my end are no less legitimate than yours. We are both human, elitist or not.

Parsers do not breed elitism. Successfully prevent anything from parsing anything, and we'll still have just as many elitists as we've always had. It might prevent an elitist from noticing how much you're holding everyone else back, but it doesn't change their nature. They'll still do everything they can to notice who is the weakest link.

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Originally Posted by Doctrine

its already bad enough that people think relic, empy, or mythic weapons are REQUIRED for low end content like VW, NNI, etc. if SE allowed things like parser, the problem would only spiral so far out of control it could never be fixed.

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Thats actually completely wrong. As it has been stated before, if you do not know someone you can not know if they suck, requiring a powerful weapon or one which is harder to obtain lowers your chances at getting one of these people. By parsing you can find people who are good at a job even though it may not be common or it may be a lower grade weapon. My RDM for instance has out DDed quite a few Ukon WARs and the like in VW and such, but its not only because I'm a good RDM, they are bad at their job as well. By parsing people can determine who is a good player and who is not pulling their weight in a party, and thus it actually helps eliminate the problem you bring up, which is the RMED problem.

Basically, the reason why RMED shouts exist are because people who are being shouted for are often are unknown, and if you are not known its impossible to tell what level of player you are, if doing something that is actually hard, then you could be picking up a terrible player which could cost you a fight. On that same note, with things like parsing you can tell in a fight how well someone does, if someone can do well with an AH weapon you know that person is skilled enough to be worth bringing with or without them having a RMED weapon. I hope this makes sense.

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Originally Posted by Karbuncle

Its like banning calculators D:

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In all honesty I think if they could they would remove the info on how the math works in game from the wiki sites like BG and FFXIclopedia because this alone shows them basically banning us for getting more knowledge about how we perform in battle.

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Originally Posted by Demon6324236

In all honesty I think if they could they would remove the info on how the math works in game from the wiki sites like BG and FFXIclopedia because this alone shows them basically banning us for getting more knowledge about how we perform in battle.

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I actually tried to find where parsers violate the ToS, and the best thing I could find was:

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2.5 Data Mining. You may not intercept, mine or otherwise collect information from the Game using unauthorized third party software.

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So apparantly those text files which accumulate on your disk's harddrive are illegal to use any third party software to collect information regarding them. But if it's not done by software, it should be perfectly fine, yeah? Or if the software used is not third-party, it should be ok. Which is why I've hired a team of super-nerds to repeatedly copy the text files which comprise my chat log and use calculators and paper to "parse" how much damage I, and my party members do during fights. I then store all this "parsed" data in a binder I keep in the hutch above my desk. It's a good thing I don't use software to do that though or I'd be violating the ToS.

technically, reading those text files with Notepad could be construed as using "third party software." of course, I'm being a cynical devils advocate jerk by saying that (and I don't agree with it either :p )

They don't enforce the rule much simply because they know it would ban a pretty measureable chunk of their playerbase.

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Originally Posted by Yinnyth

I actually tried to find where parsers violate the ToS, and the best thing I could find was:



So apparantly those text files which accumulate on your disk's harddrive are illegal to use any third party software to collect information regarding them. But if it's not done by software, it should be perfectly fine, yeah? Or if the software used is not third-party, it should be ok. Which is why I've hired a team of super-nerds to repeatedly copy the text files which comprise my chat log and use calculators and paper to "parse" how much damage I, and my party members do during fights. I then store all this "parsed" data in a binder I keep in the hutch above my desk. It's a good thing I don't use software to do that though or I'd be violating the ToS.

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It's not against the rules to parse files generated by FFXI, it's against the rules to discuss and suggest to use software OTHER then SE approved software for ANY purpose including parsing logs. You could get banned for discussing how to use the Calculator found with your Windows OS to calculate haste values, if they were to get really strict with it. Or just banned for the lulz, because a GM can ban you if he's having a bad day and you snatched that last stack of sushi from the AH. (Probably could get that reversed, but it'll still be weeks of trying to contact SE support and being told to contact an ingame GM who tells you to contact SE support.)

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

technically, reading those text files with Notepad could be construed as using "third party software." of course, I'm being a cynical devils advocate jerk by saying that (and I don't agree with it either :p )

They don't enforce the rule much simply because they know it would ban a pretty measureable chunk of their playerbase.

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Well really, the internet is accessed via third party software, so depending on how far you take it, reading anything on the internet related to the game is breaking the ToS isn't it? So that would be just about every person who has played this game since its release as I am sure there are only a few people ever to play this without some sort of way to get on a wiki.

I was going to crack a joke about them banning me for being on the Official Forums or FFXIAH checking prices/bazaars, but figured i'd try to keep it less sarcastic... Glad you went there for me D:

I think it's doable, with the right members, that being said, Iwagami urged elite players to "give everyone a chance", doing so will cause a fail, usually. I've seen Tax'et despawn at 1% on a third try. My suggestion is extend the time limit to 45 minutes, an additional 25 minutes should be more than enough time to allow non-elites, such as myself, to get their KIs, since I am only lucky enough to get into Fracture farming parties because, and only because, I have a complete TH setup on THF. Until I can get my KI, my DRK isn't welcome in a fracture because Hoarfrost isn't good enough, and I haven't completed neither Apocalypse nor Ragnarok yet.

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Originally Posted by Kojo

I think it's doable, with the right members, that being said, Iwagami urged elite players to "give everyone a chance", doing so will cause a fail, usually. I've seen Tax'et despawn at 1% on a third try. My suggestion is extend the time limit to 45 minutes, an additional 25 minutes should be more than enough time to allow non-elites, such as myself, to get their KIs, since I am only lucky enough to get into Fracture farming parties because, and only because, I have a complete TH setup on THF. Until I can get my KI, my DRK isn't welcome in a fracture because Hoarfrost isn't good enough, and I haven't completed neither Apocalypse nor Ragnarok yet.

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Or, give the person popping two options: the current 20-minute timer (with a huge bayld bonus attached), or that 45-minute timer. I would be okay with seeing this.

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Originally Posted by Kojo

I think it's doable, with the right members, that being said, Iwagami urged elite players to "give everyone a chance", doing so will cause a fail, usually. I've seen Tax'et despawn at 1% on a third try. My suggestion is extend the time limit to 45 minutes, an additional 25 minutes should be more than enough time to allow non-elites, such as myself, to get their KIs, since I am only lucky enough to get into Fracture farming parties because, and only because, I have a complete TH setup on THF. Until I can get my KI, my DRK isn't welcome in a fracture because Hoarfrost isn't good enough, and I haven't completed neither Apocalypse nor Ragnarok yet.

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I got all my KIs on Phoenix in the first week, but they weren't all killed on the first try though, some where some weren't.

Often you would get someone who most likely abyssea burned their job don't even have cap combat skills sitting there missing the mob. If someone actually cares about their 1 job this stuff is beat able without any sort of relics/empyreans.

It is a problem in a sense people like myself who already have most of the delve weapons have no reason to join a NM kill run because its less points. Really only worthwhile to join farm runs. If I know someone doing NMs and they want me to join then I will but wouldn't join random shout. FFXI seemed to of had this problem since its creation if you don't get on the gravy train in the first week its always way harder to get it done after.

To fix the problem NMs should give more points then you would get in a farm run to get people to join them.

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Originally Posted by Zumi

I got all my KIs on Phoenix in the first week, but they weren't all killed on the first try though, some where some weren't.

Often you would get someone who most likely abyssea burned their job don't even have cap combat skills sitting there missing the mob. If someone actually cares about their 1 job this stuff is beat able without any sort of relics/empyreans.

It is a problem in a sense people like myself who already have most of the delve weapons have no reason to join a NM kill run because its less points. Really only worthwhile to join farm runs. If I know someone doing NMs and they want me to join then I will but wouldn't join random shout. FFXI seemed to of had this problem since its creation if you don't get on the gravy train in the first week its always way harder to get it done after.

To fix the problem NMs should give more points then you would get in a farm run to get people to join them.

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I was on THF, capped Dagger, Evasion, etc, but not merited... Which is why I wanted to go DRK, I think Hoarfrost with capped and merited GS skill with Sushi and STR/DEX merits would contribute more, damage wise, than THF with Oynos/Twilight.