Rieves MPK fest

too many times i see Ochain PLDs using dagger AoE WS while fighting in rieves, its ok as long as they have hate but when they dont and wake up all the sleeping mobs who have hate on someone else they die in 2 seconds flat, i fight in rieves as a BLU and use AoE damage+stun followed right away by sleepga, this is of course ruined by people who run in carelessly and aoe ws

Warn them that you'll call a GM for MPKing, if they continue to do it call a GM...

I hope eventually they'll add a WoE-style Auto-RR to Reives. The confrontation areas are so tight and the mobs often numerous enough when they start doing AOEs one after another it's tough for all but the most durable of us to stay upright.

he's probably just trying to get hate to supertank.

a good paladin can hold every mob in a rieve with no support, freeing everyone else to mess up the root.


so it's unlikely that it's malicious, in fact he's prolly just trying to help. the lack of coordination is what's fucking you.

He has every right to AoE the mobs as you do, sorry about your luck. You might want to try focusing on fewer mobs if this becomes an issue.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Doombringer

a good paladin can hold every mob in a rieve with no support, freeing everyone else to mess up the root.

---

While his intents may indeed not be remotely malicious, This stategy needs to burn >:I

By just raping the roots and having a PLD hold the enemies... Battles end quicker, Less Exp/Bayld for everyone, so on... Nobody wins :X.

Sorry, I mention this when people bring it up, I don't agree nor disagree with the OP, Simply that This strategy should be beaten and left for dead lol

(P.S I Know you're not advocating or even the pioneer of this strategy, Simply pointing out that its a bad one lol)

There are many different strategies to get through a Rieve, But there are also many different given situations as to why to get through a Rieve.

Situation 1.) To get through the Rieve by killing the Root to get to the other side. (Just like the chicken did.) PLD is great for this, preferably an Ochain PLD.

Situation 2.) To not kill the root at the Rieve and just farm mobs for their bayld. (The mobs do re spawn.) Sleeping is great for this.

Situation 3.) To Kill the Root, Nest and or the mobs while under sneak and invisible. (Stalkers R U.) Mostly any Pet jobs are good at this.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Karbuncle

While his intents may indeed not be remotely malicious, This stategy needs to burn >:I

By just raping the roots and having a PLD hold the enemies... Battles end quicker, Less Exp/Bayld for everyone, so on... Nobody wins :X.

Sorry, I mention this when people bring it up, I don't agree nor disagree with the OP, Simply that This strategy should be beaten and left for dead lol

(P.S I Know you're not advocating or even the pioneer of this strategy, Simply pointing out that its a bad one lol)

---

yah it ain't my baby, go nuts, kick it down the stairs.

just pointing out that the guy prolly doesn't deserve to be GM'ed about it.


but for what it's worth, there's nothing stopping us from picking off the pallys mobs one at a time instead of focusing on the root. we're all complicit when a rieve ends in minutes.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Clou777

too many times i see Ochain PLDs using dagger AoE WS while fighting in rieves, its ok as long as they have hate but when they dont and wake up all the sleeping mobs who have hate on someone else they die in 2 seconds flat, i fight in rieves as a BLU and use AoE damage+stun followed right away by sleepga, this is of course ruined by people who run in carelessly and aoe ws

---

At least he didn't bring all the mobs on top of everyone who's weakened and die >.> Like I've seen a lot of people doing, specifically whms and a few pld, which then just gets everyone killed lol

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Obysuca

At least he didn't bring all the mobs on top of everyone who's weakened and die >.> Like I've seen a lot of people doing, specifically whms and a few pld, which then just gets everyone killed lol

---

I've had so many experiences with this so far. It's extremely frustrating. I can handle my own mobs that I take on, but other people get in over their heads, then die, then the mobs come after other people. Either learn how to handle it or stop being greedy tool satchels!

Then dont run in and get hate on every single mob? i usually dont attemp it unless i know there is enough ppl around to win it for sure, otherwise its just everyone wiping over and over

REIVE

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sfchakan

I've had so many experiences with this so far. It's extremely frustrating. I can handle my own mobs that I take on, but other people get in over their heads, then die, then the mobs come after other people. Either learn how to handle it or stop being greedy tool satchels!

---

I try my best to watch out for the weak links and help them. I get bayld one way or another, and we all benefit if we all stay alive.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Sfchakan

I've had so many experiences with this so far. It's extremely frustrating. I can handle my own mobs that I take on, but other people get in over their heads, then die, then the mobs come after other people. Either learn how to handle it or stop being greedy tool satchels!

---

How about the dude who thinks he can raise and ends up aggroing everything, causing everyone to die or leave the reive? That's the best lol

Oh how many times have I seen blus mess up my pull after I get all the mobs on me. If they sleep mobs I am tanking they can die cause I won't do anything after that just attack the hive or root.

Teamwork:
(noun)
1. We either do this my way, or you can die a flaming death and I'll laugh.
2. One member performs a task they are specialized towards and reaps the majority of the rewards while the rest of the members tackle the most boring and unrewarding task.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zumi

Oh how many times have I seen blus mess up my pull after I get all the mobs on me. If they sleep mobs I am tanking they can die cause I won't do anything after that just attack the hive or root.

---

You should be a poster boy for KY, Cause you're a huge d*ck.

On a serious note, Whats the point of letting someone die cause they're trying to help? Did you tell them "Hey, Don't sleep my mobs, I can handle it, You take out the nest or assist my target okay?", Or do you just watch them die because they had the balls to try and help you do a Reive?

Sometimes people are just trying to help, not laughing as you as they maliciously steal your mobs by sleeping them. As a BLU, in most every situation, They're generally sleepers in Reive parties, He probably just goes in and does what he knows as his general job... If you ask him not to sleep your mobs and he ignores you, then you can ignore his screams as the bees murder him... But to just let them die without a word for no other reason then they're trying to do the same thing you are... Get exp/Bayld... That just plain ... well i have no other way to say it, thats the kind of behavior that makes Reives unpleasant for everyone.

The event is based around Team Work, if you dont want him sleeping your mobs, tell him. on the other note, Use a Dagger... Theres this really cool Weaponskill called Aeolion Edge that solves your Enmity and Sleeping issues if a BLU is Dream-flowering >_>

It's the same problem WoE initially had with zone wide aggro. Once SE fixed that the event actually become fun. So same thing here, SE needs to remove the battle field wide auto-aggro the monsters get.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zagen

Warn them that you'll call a GM for MPKing, if they continue to do it call a GM...

---

"Reives are functioning as intended, this is not a bug, this is by design."

I don't see GMs able to do much in this situation.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by saevel

It's the same problem WoE initially had with zone wide aggro. Once SE fixed that the event actually become fun. So same thing here, SE needs to remove the battle field wide auto-aggro the monsters get.

---

It is very sad that after ToAU, WoTG and Abyssea add ons, this team still learns ZERO when it comes to creating this type of events. It's almost we got a bunch of juniors who pretty much disregard what works and did not works and want to do things their way, and end up really bad and now we have to deal with the aftermath so to speak.....

Don't we have a test server to test stuff like this before it gets released? Did they just not want to "spoil" the new content for the new expansion or did they just not want to hurt sales?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kojo

"Reives are functioning as intended, this is not a bug, this is by design."

I don't see GMs able to do much in this situation.

---

How does that affect:

Player 1 sleeps a monster.
Player 2 wakes that monster without doing enough damage to lock hate.
Player 1 now gets hit by said monster.

This is an obvious definition of MPK from the 75 days...

Reives working as intended has nothing to do with players being stupid. If you see a BLU with a bunch of monsters looking at them and not attacking it should be obvious they are slept.

Because, yes, those players are doing that on purpose.

As stated by multiple people, nothing you can do here. Be mindful of what others are doing and try to keep your own bacon out of the fryer.

I can promise you we don't do that to mess you up. When I wake mobs, I do it with Divine Emblem and Banishga II, which is essentially AoE Provoke. Then I follow up with Sentinel so I can line everything up nicely and hold it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zagen

How does that affect:

Player 1 sleeps a monster.
Player 2 wakes that monster without doing enough damage to lock hate.
Player 1 now gets hit by said monster.

This is an obvious definition of MPK from the 75 days...

Reives working as intended has nothing to do with players being stupid. If you see a BLU with a bunch of monsters looking at them and not attacking it should be obvious they are slept.

---

MPKs are intended, depends on context, really. Unless Player 2 woke mob without taking hate with the intention of killing Player 1, a GM will do nothing as he runs the risk or accusing and issuing a warning flag to a player who did nothing wrong besides not pulling hate. This could only be called an "MPK" by similarity, in that one player indirectly kills another. A GM won't (or atleast shouldn't) ban, issue warnings, or usually even contact a player on assumption alone, it usually just ends in them telling you that they will investigate, then they do and if they can't find proof, they do nothing.

Sorry, I just don't think you have a case. But I do agree that the shared aggro should be taken out.

This may have changed in recent times, but GMs are a little bit restricted for what they can do regarding grief tactics. Or maybe GMs just hated my LS and used it as an excuse. But there was this time we were fighting Vrtra and a competing endgame LS caught wind of us going to fight it. They didn't even want to try killing Vrtra, they just wanted to make sure we failed. So everytime someone got charmed, the other LS would kill our charmed member. This slowed us down substantially, and we contacted a GM and watched him watch the situation. The GM refused to punish anyone in the other LS because killing charmed people was not considered griefing by SE. And this was back before you didn't lose exp if you get killed while charmed.

So even when grief is clearly intended, even when it's stated in /shout by the griefers that they're there to make sure you fail, SE will only dole out punishment if it meets their stringent griefing criteria. Though this was many years ago.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zagen

How does that affect:

Player 1 sleeps a monster.
Player 2 wakes that monster without doing enough damage to lock hate.
Player 1 now gets hit by said monster.

This is an obvious definition of MPK from the 75 days...

Reives working as intended has nothing to do with players being stupid. If you see a BLU with a bunch of monsters looking at them and not attacking it should be obvious they are slept.

---

Unless they're waking mobs with Diaga, then laughing as you die, then it's not an MPK. Big difference between someone waking mobs with very little hate intentionally, and waking mobs trying to pull hate, but failing.

The one MPK that really grips my sh1t, is when you sit at a lair reive waiting for more people to join, maybe just soloing 1 or 2 mobs, and some d*ck runs straight through it, training all the mobs to you then leaves the area... this should cause instant K.O. to the player that did it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Babekeke

The one MPK that really grips my sh1t, is when you sit at a lair reive waiting for more people to join, maybe just soloing 1 or 2 mobs, and some d*ck runs straight through it, training all the mobs to you then leaves the area... this should cause instant K.O. to the player that did it.

---

This is the single most annoying thing about doing Lairs, soloing them on BST is easy but having to avoid the train of mobs people pull to me as idiots, thats much harder because most of them are sound, so I have to find a nice spot with nothing around to even have a chance of surviving it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Babekeke

Unless they're waking mobs with Diaga, then laughing as you die, then it's not an MPK. Big difference between someone waking mobs with very little hate intentionally, and waking mobs trying to pull hate, but failing.

The one MPK that really grips my sh1t, is when you sit at a lair reive waiting for more people to join, maybe just soloing 1 or 2 mobs, and some d*ck runs straight through it, training all the mobs to you then leaves the area... this should cause instant K.O. to the player that did it.

---

What I like to do if I'm not down to do a reive is I run in, then run back out the direction I came, lose my tag, then run through, no aggro, no problems, no MPK.

Nothing stopping you from /assisting a PLD and killing the mob he is engaged with while super tanking the rest. This is actually beneficial for everyone. If the PLD can survive all the agro, and you can't - then don't get hate genius. Don't blame PLDs who can super tank for your failure to understand your job's limits and game design. This isn't abyssea where you have infinite MP and Atmas to make up for your lack of understanding and skill.

If a PLD diaga's/banshiga's all the mobs it is to super tank. Don't cast aoes or use horde lullaby (dumb brds) and then complain when 10 mobs falcon PAWNCH you in the face.

I'm sorry the content is broken, but I doubt the PLD has any bad intentions, he's prob just trying to keep the hate on all mobs.

It's the devs fault for designing content this way.

it should be obvious that you shouldnt AOE damage in rieves because someone somewhere is very likey to have hate, and its like saying "hey mobs! i'll wake you up so you can go and kick someone elses ass!" Sleepga's are fine but pure AoE damage simply screws everyone up. just happened to me again, everyone was doing fine with a nice clean fight until someone runs in a spams Aeolian Edge, wakes everything up and rabbits just ran wild killing about 10 people resulting in a wipe.

Don't want 5 mobs to be woken up and start beating on you? Then don't Sleep them.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Crusader81

I'm sorry the content is broken, but I doubt the PLD has any bad intentions, he's prob just trying to keep the hate on all mobs.

It's the devs fault for designing content this way.

---

Can't blame the Devs for Idiots being idiots lol. While that might not apply to the person in question, the message itself is clear. Can't blame the creator for the way people adapt his product outside of its intentions.

Creator of Whip Cream ain't going to jail for that whole.. fiasco... i mean.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Karbuncle

I'll never blame the Devs for assholes being assholes. this might not apply to this exact situation, but the message itself is sound. Just because theres a set way to abuse something, doesn't mean its the creators fault its being abused.

---

I agree that you can't blame the developers for people being an assholes - even if those said peoples are doing it without knowing the consequences. But you do need to blame the developer for designing reives that badly, and the atrocious enmity adjustment that currently wreaking havoc everywhere.

I have to admit, it is funny to see dead bodies everywhere. It's like when back in Campaign someone pulled the NM to a clusterfuck of people whacking one mob to death and BAM, dead bodies everywhere.

They really do need to fix this shared hate, ridiculous AOE, add reraise for everyone, 15 seconds warning, bigger reives area and safety zones for weakened people to rest. And just fix SoA overall. Right now it is the worst expansion to date after WoTG, and seems a lot agree on this. I mean, gosh, I never thought they could and would be able to top WoTG, but they outdid themselves this time and created the impossible lol.

It's like a bunch of juniors and interns decided to make a name for themselves, ditch what works so well in Abyssea and ToAU, and look at the worst expansion WoTG and wondering..hmm how can we do worse than this one. And DING, SoA was born!! Yes tons of some good ideas there, but boy, did they just flame out on execution. I would rather this be released in Fall 2013 with far more meaty contents and thorough testing than it currently is.

I'm hoping they do a lot of fixes in the upcoming version update... Or a lot sooner :|

Yeah, if anything, Square's done a great job of quickly patching some of the Reive issues.