At this point in time most people are either building mythics or using alex as another source of income. Salvage as it is now is an easy solo and there is no reason why it shouldnt not allow us to do so at this point. Dev team please consider this and make Salvage solo accessable.
Make Salvage soloable please....
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11-04-2012, 11:37 AMDeathroseMake Salvage soloable please....
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11-04-2012, 12:39 PMTsukino_Kaji
They would probably have to change the TAU system as a whole.
Just get 2 mules like a normal person. -
11-04-2012, 01:20 PMDemon6324236You make it sound like thats a bad thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tsukino_Kaji
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11-04-2012, 02:10 PMLuvbunny
It would be great to make this as a minimum 2 person instead of 3. But yeah, solo would be even better. I doubt they will even do anything to it. Most of the old contents are pretty much dead for them, and they never really do what we asked them to do anyway, if it does not fit into their plans, it will not be done, no matter how strong we voiced our opinion here. You see so many threads asking for adjustment on existing contents but pretty much being ignored. Voidwatch is probably one example where they somewhat listened to what we asked for and actually did implement the suggestion.
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11-04-2012, 02:41 PMDemon6324236Twisted, didn't do what we asked.Quote:
Originally Posted by Luvbunny
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11-04-2012, 03:16 PMHashmalum
This has been asked for before and they outright said "no". You see, the dev team would rather that the Salvage zones sit empty than experience even a slight chance of crowding.
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11-05-2012, 03:16 AMLuvbunnyThey didn't change the drop rate and make the gears available to the loot pool. But they add the weakening item, and you can convert into cell to trade and put in AH. As much as I wish they will do exactly what we asked for, I don't think that will happen, if it does not fit their grand master plan of stringing us along to play forever, it is not going to happen lol.Quote:
Originally Posted by Demon6324236
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11-05-2012, 03:31 AMKincard
As much as they will feed you some dumb line about how the entry "cost" of salvage is supposed to be 3 remnants permits, everyone knows that's untrue because people have been getting around that even back at 75 cap. After all, if that was the actual reason, it doesn't make sense that they've been letting us enter with less than 3 with warping for about 5 years. The real reason is because they refuse to upgrade their servers and keep Salvage/Nyzul on a reservation basis, where there's a max of something like 3 groups in there at a time. Changing so that it's possible to enter solo will pretty much cause permanent congestion.
So the only two choices is to hold your breath for them to update the servers, or hope that old salvage gets a Dynamis-like redesign in the future. Given that I'm sure the neo salvage areas will use the same areas I doubt that'll happen. Just gonna have have to keep bothering your LS buddies to help you get in. >_> -
11-05-2012, 10:37 AMTsukino_KajiNo I make it sound like a ton of work to revamp an entire expansion thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Demon6324236
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11-05-2012, 11:06 AMDemon6324236
Well honestly when alot of the "super" weapons worth making are locked down thanks to that content, I say its worth the time. Removing the limit on Salvage would make Alexandrites supply jump because people could farm it like Dyna, Assaults would actually be doable start to finish without worrying about someone just leaving the static.
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11-06-2012, 03:02 AMMyo
Why does every event need to be soloable? What happened to teamwork and cooperation? I like salvage as a 3+ minimum person event. It's way more interesting and fun then soloing Dynamis... Besides, if salvage was soloable and/or more alexandrite were on the market, the price of alexandrites would drop and people making money off them would still make the same amount even if they aquired more from each salvage. Only thing you'd start to see a lot more of is bandwagon mythics.
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11-06-2012, 03:57 AMKincard
If they cared so much about the teamwork and cooperation required to clear salvage, they wouldn't have decided to raise the level cap for no reason and proceed to curbstomp the best gear in the game people spent years to get, and then also increased the drop rates and make khroma ore drop everywhere as an extra insult.
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11-06-2012, 03:58 AMZagenHmm my friend and I that duo Dynamis missed the memo that allowing solo = must solo.Quote:
Originally Posted by Myo
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11-06-2012, 05:33 AMLuvbunnyYou did not get the memo that the way players play this game has changed. Especially since Abyssea was released. Teamwork and co-operation is all great, meeting random new players is nice too, but a lot of people just want to log in and play, and not bother trying to set up things. You know how those random shouts usually end up anyway, half the people have no access but curious, and end up adding more delays. The other half are great but end up leaving because they see disasters coming miles ahead.Quote:
Originally Posted by Myo
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11-06-2012, 06:47 AMMyo
I always go back to this in my posts, but... The problem is that they need a way, beyond afterglow (which adds no benefit to the wearer of the weapon and costs 10-20x as much as the weapon itself), to reward hardcore players. The two ways of doing that in Square Enix's eyes, are through luck and skill/gear/job based events like legion,neo-nyzul, and odinV2, OR through dedication rewards like relics, 99emps, or for the even more ambitious (and for the people with the most time on their hands) mythics. So pick which one you'd rather reward the hardcore players with: events that casual players with 1 or 2 jobs that are poorly geared or completely wrong will be unable to complete or participate in, or items that you need to build that take a long ass time to get the money and resources for. Personally, I'd rather them reward players who play a ton with items that take a while to make,instead of introducing more endgame events that limit what job you can even use in them. Because those are the only two things SE has proven itself able to implement for hardcore rewarding and you know it.
Before you guys start whining that you want events that require skill and not luck and time, remember that to SE, that means that you want severly limiting endgame events that will end up excluding your dancers, blue mages, puppetmasters, and so forth. Cause this isn't WoW, you're not going to be able to jump out of the way of boss attacks or anything crazy, you have to think within the limits of the game. -
11-06-2012, 06:50 AMZagenSarcasm? Maybe it's just been too long since I played WoW but jumping didn't allow you to avoid any attacks.Quote:
Originally Posted by Myo
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11-06-2012, 07:04 AMMyo
You get the idea Zagen. lol Sorry if i got off topic! But I really do feel like the question of soloing salvage and other endgame events comes down to the fact that some people want the game difficult, and other people want the game to be fast and simple. Besides, if you can solo everything, why play a MMO at all? go play a single player RPG. MMOs are supposed to be for group events. :/
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11-06-2012, 07:16 AMZagenI asked that question in 2003 when I was told how BST was played...Quote:
Originally Posted by Myo
There are always people who prefer to be able to solo, just like how I always start a FPS with "run and gun" mentality even if it doesn't support it very well. While there are others who prefer to do things as a group even if they are events that don't require it or necessarily benefit from it.
When an event like the old events can be done solo for the same if not greater gains why not allow it? The only reason I could see Salvage not having been made solo yet is because SE believes Alexanderite are the only bottle neck for mythics.
If my group were given the option to do salvage solo on top of being able to go as a group because that brings the fun factor with it, I'm sure we'd actually consider making a mythic or 2 instead of just selling off the alexanderite. Due to our play times that would equate to a guaranteed year or more of playtime for us. For now it sits as an event we do from time to time when we're bored and nothing else comes up. -
11-06-2012, 09:25 AMFynlarI don't know if you've actually done Assault/Salvage at level 99, but if you did you'd realize it's mostly extremely easy content by level 99 standards. The fact that it requires you to drag along 2 other people "just because" is kind of an insult, especially when everyone already KNOWS that there are tricks to get around actually having to take 3+ people inside the event.Quote:
Why does every event need to be soloable? What happened to teamwork and cooperation? I like salvage as a 3+ minimum person event.
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11-06-2012, 09:34 AMArconIt already is soloable. I solo it daily with a mule. It's not even about whether or not that's good or bad, it's about whether or not SE want to stop us from doing it, despite it already being possible.Quote:
Originally Posted by Myo
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11-06-2012, 03:33 PMMyoI've done more salvage in the past year then more people have done in their entire FFXI career. And you can't kill the SSR boss solo, nor can you get there with enough time to kill it without multiboxing if you go for 4 cottons and then the linen from boss. And SSR is where the most Alex drops.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fynlar
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11-06-2012, 07:24 PMKincardYes you can. It requires you to make some pointless/self-defeating sacrifices but it's certainly possible.Quote:
you can't kill the SSR boss solo
Besides, people arn't asking for the content itself to be adjusted, just making it so that we can enter alone. I'm pretty sure most people that farm salvage know that farming with 2 is the most effective way but the problem is that we arn't allowed to do that, either. If your stance is that 24 levels later its still too hard for you to solo then it wouldn't make any difference to you if other people could enter solo because they wouldn't be able to clear it.
Still, like I said above, unless they fix the servers so that salvage is unable to be congested, I think I'd take being limited by the three-person requirement over needing to wait for people who don't have a clue what they're doing to finish in there before I'm allowed to enter. -
11-06-2012, 08:19 PMArcon
The content should dictate manpower requirements, not arbitrary limitations.
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11-06-2012, 08:54 PMDemon6324236
Agreed, no event should really force you to go with a certain amount of people unless you just cant do it. If it were hard enough it took 3 or more lv99s, that would be one thing, I have no doubt Neo-Salvage will need that many people, but Assaults & Salvage are both soloable by 1~2 lv99s, there is no real reason it should force us to go with 3 players, especially when its content meant for players 24 levels lower than us.
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11-06-2012, 11:19 PMJohnGottiWait what memo ? Certain aspects of the game have changed, however Odin 2, Neo omega, Legion would like to have a word with you, i'd love to see you log in solo and do these events on your own.Quote:
Originally Posted by Luvbunny
Ffxi has always been about teamwork and with the new expansion been endgame content only more of it is surely to come. -
11-06-2012, 11:33 PMAfaniaYou can if you're BLU. Just put DoT on the boss to prevent it goes idle when it charmed. Should only take about 10 min.Quote:
Originally Posted by Myo
BLU can also AoE burn mobs on F 1 2 3 4, which allow much faster killing speed solo, especially if you bring a couple of med for MP. Once I did over 20k~25k dmg in 1 sec by pop Fanatic, 2hr then spams WoR+ B.typhoon with Efflux/CA and pull 5~8 mobs. When you run out of MP pop dusty elixir/megaelixir and spam more, then sleep everything with dreamflower+sheep song when Fanatic wear. When you can deal 1~2.6k dmg on 5~10 mobs, that's pretty fast kill.
Any other job that's not BLU I imagine it will have hard time clearing everything solo though.
The problem is NOT that it's not soloable, nor ppl don't want to team up. The problem is that solo gives higher gil/hr in dyna than team up in salvage. If you avg 100 alex a run in SSR, split with 3 person, that's 33 alex per person. Selling alex at 20k gives 660k, after 1.5hr of work plus time to gather+ farm AP for it. How much gil you can farm solo in dyna on BST after 2hr? Certainly higher than 660k even with worst competition.Quote:
Originally Posted by Myo
So what's the point to team up? There are no point, you just lose profit when you team up with other ppl, unless they're willing to give you alex for free(then again, you may as well team up in dyna for 600 coins and get all 600 coins for free too). You'd better spend time in dyna instead of spend time in salvage unless you have mule to get you in.
Current SSR alex gain only allow 1, at very best, 2 person in there, unless the drop of alex doubled. -
11-06-2012, 11:59 PMSpankWustler
The issue I see is that OG Salvage has two conflicting mechanics at work with the level cap of 99.
The way salvage doles out rewards punishes groups, because better performance leads only to a faster clear rather than more substantial rewards in almost all cases. The only thing that a group of three adds is the need to split the Alexandrite rewarded among all three parties, reducing what each party receives for his or her time.
Salvage punishes attempts to solo it by flat-out not allowing you to enter solo, unless you take advantage of specific entrance mechanics. Two mules or something similar are required to enter "solo".
The result is an event that is most appropriate and most rewarding for one (maybe two) person(s) but requires a group of three or more bodies to enter. For those reasons, this restriction feels very artificial and ...well... restrictive compared to most restrictions.
If content can be soloed, it should be open to that. If content requires a group, it should actually require the group or at least try to. -
11-07-2012, 01:13 AMDragoy><)))°€
One might imagine that they would need to reduce the amount of rewards so that it is balanced, similar to Assault. While I doubt anyone cares for Assault “rewards” (other than Nyzul Isle Investigation/Uncharted Region (former probably only for completion's sake)), in Salvage, users might actually get upset by less alexandrite and armour yield.
I'll quote an old reply:
It is no doubt certain that they know how people do Salvage and Assault in general, so this reasoning does surely get lots of rolling eyes. It already did at level 75, and what are we now... 99'ish?Quote:
Originally Posted by Camate
I do hope they will get into adjusting the Treasures that are of Aht Urhgan soon, though even more so I hope they'll actually do something they deserve to be done with! Looking at Salvage II, it doesn't look too good, which is expected, I guess, but I shall wait and see, before I judge thee. -
11-07-2012, 05:16 AMAfaniaHonestly though, I'm totally fine with salvage requires 3 players to enter, as long as SSR drops 150~180 alex avg with 3 players.Quote:
Originally Posted by SpankWustler
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11-07-2012, 05:30 AMArconBut how are you gonna do that? Just artificially increase the drop rate? Then people would just bring mules. Otherwise you'd have to reinvent the event completely, because unlike other party-friendlier farming grounds (Dynamis for example) it has a fixed amount of loot that can be cleared solo/2box. If you wanna increase that amount to a degree that it can't be farmed completely with just one person then you may as well wait for the Salvage remake, because it would alter the event completely.Quote:
Originally Posted by Afania
I think regular Salvage is fine as it is now (aside from the entry limit). Incorporate the changes into the Salvage remake and solo people can still do old Salvage, while groups can try to tackle new Salvage. -
11-07-2012, 07:47 AMFynlarIf that's really what you think, I don't think you're as experienced with Salvage as you claim you are.Quote:
I've done more salvage in the past year then more people have done in their entire FFXI career. And you can't kill the SSR boss solo, nor can you get there with enough time to kill it without multiboxing if you go for 4 cottons and then the linen from boss.
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11-07-2012, 07:58 AMArconWhile it's possible, he's right in that it's extremely annoying. But I think most people mean 2box when they refer to soloing anyway, rendering that particular issue moot.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fynlar
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11-07-2012, 10:06 AMSapphires
Soloing in this game means 2+ boxing characters and not having to share your loot with anyone else ;p
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11-07-2012, 12:44 PMTennotsukai
I support this thread!
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11-07-2012, 01:28 PMAfaniaBring mules can't really be helped. No matter what you do, players with mules will always farm more efficient than actual players team up with more players. Ppl bring mules to legion, to einherjar, to dyna, to ADL, to meebles, to NNI merc, to everything. And those group with mules always come out with higher profit/farming efficiency than actual players.Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcon
I have to point out most of the dyna DB, it's coin gain is probably lower than 2 actual player duo though. Although ppl just prefer mules cuz it's still higher than 1 char solo. But coin gain in dyna is still based on performance mostly.
But that's still better than limited to 100 alex per pt in SSR, no matter how big is the pt size or how efficient pt kills.