New Frames please?

i want a ninja puppet >_>! dualwielding shuriken throwing ninjutsu casting puppet. do it now.

I'd rather have a real close range DD frame. VE is a tank, SS will stay out of range when the mob moves, preventing it from dealing max damage. Harlequin could easily be tweaked to fit this role, since it's currently useless.

Signed.

I want to see a Ninja frame, Katana's and all, Dual Wield.

:cool: :D

Lol'd

With 4 arms, so he can Quatro Wield!

someone please put a pic of that ninja puppet! omg that will be LMAO

dude, im totally wanting this frame. we need a buffing frame too... one that gives like party buffs and crap based off of your attachments >_>

AuraBot m-000
produces aura effects for all non-maneuver consuming attachments that are currently active.
would make pups wanted >_>

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Originally Posted by hideka

i want a ninja puppet >_>! dualwielding shuriken throwing ninjutsu casting puppet. do it now.

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I read that as:

DualWielding Shuriken
Throwing Ninjutsu
Casting Puppet.

Lul, Either way, a Ninja Puppet could be potentially useful. they could make it the close-ranged DD, It could be given a good heavy hitting base damage, that and Dual Wield V Couldn't hurt.

While we are at it, give us a little grim reaper scythe wielding automaton. Give it innate regain and make it have permanent endrain and a huge base dmg.

dude...
DeathBot XXXX
Give it a scythe for a hand.. hoood... make it cast all dark knight abilities and use soul eater >_> pocket lols

At the moment, there are no plans for adding new frames but we do plan on making the various roles that players have requested possible by making attachments more unique through new additions and adjustments.

Keep your eyes out for those updates!

How about you make old attachments more accessible?
Namely the 8 attachments which currently come only from "The Ashu Talif" 3 BC battles (well, technically they can come from the daily reward system Goblin as well).

Could make those BC accessible by a single member instead of the current requirement of 3, could make the drop rate higher etc. That way it will be easier to do the BC, there will be more attachments on the market, prices will go down and everybody will be happy except those people, mostly without PUP, who do those BC to exploit the market and take advantage of poor PUPs.

I'm sure someone has said this before, but none the less... Since some people want a bard/corsair type buffer pet... Just make a bunch of Aura Attachments that give Store TP/Regain/MAT/MDB/PDT/Etc. depending on manuevers/how many you have up. Then you could make some use of harliquin where if you gave him a high elemental attachment capacity, you could put all the Aura attachments on him and run around giving specific members a specific boost. So far, it is hard finding a use for PUP is the main events like Legion/Nyzul/Voidwatch, however, who doesn't want a job that can give them 5% regain like cor?

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Originally Posted by Rukkirii

At the moment, there are no plans for adding new frames but we do plan on making the various roles that players have requested possible by making attachments more unique through new additions and adjustments.

Keep your eyes out for those updates!

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I don't like the fact that Square Enix is beating around the bush with what we're asking for... I doubt that any attachments they add that may make our pets more like the role of a specific job are going to improve the pet to the extent of what we're hoping for (Just think about barrier module/galvanizer... They weren't necessarily game changers). What we really need is a pet with high DPS... Ranger pet, ValorEdge, and Stormwaker are all good but they don't have damage output like other jobs because for them to perform at their optimal level, we have to keep constantly controlling them via attachments, battle positioning, etc. What I would like to see is a strong pet like a monk, ninja, or samurai pet that can hold his or her own while dealing good DPS so puppetmasters can contribute to damage and actually be useful in big events.

On the same note, has anyone noticed the uselessness of valoredge/sharpshot in voidwatch/legion/etc. I have capped pet skill and tons of gear to improve ranged accuracy/accuracy and still the pet cannot even hit the enemies... and when they do get TP, their weaponskills like armor shatterer just miss anyway... There really needs to be an adjustment to innate pet accuracy because there is a large gap between Automatons accuracy and other pets/players when up against end game notorious monsters.
- With that said, an automaton with the main purpose of damage dealing, or revision of pet accuracy would be much appreciated right now. Please let them know what we want dev team.

If summoner gets more summons, then puppets should get more frames.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

If summoner gets more summons, then puppets should get more frames.

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I second that motion... Granted they plan to add Cait Sith as a allie for summoners, then it is concluded. Puppetmaster should get a new pet!

In my opinion they should follow a different model.
Similarly to what they did with Stormwaker (giving us two additional heads), they should follow that model and ovver new customization parts for Sharpshoot, Valoredge and Harlequin.
A new head maybe? Whatever, something that slightly changes the behaviour of that frame and that you equip before equipping attachments.

For example having a Valoredge that also casts healing spells on himself, or a harlequin that casts an Utsusemi-like spell, or a Sharpshoot who doesn't melee at all, but shoots faster and from longer distance (they recently increased the engage distance of rangers, but did nothing at all for our pets)

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

If summoner gets more summons, then puppets should get more frames.

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Originally Posted by Shinron-PUP

I second that motion... Granted they plan to add Cait Sith as a allie for summoners, then it is concluded. Puppetmaster should get a new pet!

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No, PUP needs no more frames or heads. Some situational parts (such as when the dispel part was added) are always welcome, but really all I see are some fan boys crying out "ZOMG SE THAT JOB OVER THERE GOT SOMETHING, WE WANT SOMETHING!"

People are looking for any excuse to get anything they can on their preferred jobs and it is just silly. Caitsith is one avatar to a job that operates differently and is widely considered one of the most useless jobs. Compared to something like BST where every level cap since 75 BST has been getting new jug pets, but I don't see that being whined about as a reason for more frames. The request for equal treatment for something different is something you expect from younger siblings not getting the same candy at the store. As if PUP has not gotten enough adjustments on its own lately compared to something like SMN which gets useless spirit adjustments because they were casting the same spells since 75.

PUP has gotten more than its fair share of late. Besides why do we need more frames when Harlequin is pretty useless?

If you are bored with your frames that is not SE's problem.

We don't need new frames, we need more changes to the ones we have now. The casting frames are perfect, they're everything I dreamed of. Now they need to give Valoredge new ways besides a janky provoke to hold hate and recover/protect his HP (Cannibal Blade 2 and improved barrier module please), a reason to use Harlequin (Martial arts traits and two fists to attack with?), and some native acc/eva traits for sharpshot.

So much can be done to make what we have now even better, what's the point in new ones?

I don't know why people are so adverse to just some new heads. I think it's an easy fix to give more control over how your auto acts and also more diversity without cluttering up everything with more and more parts. You have the 2 turbans for Stormwalker and they work at giving great whm/blm situational support. Why not something like these:

For Harlequin since it attacks with both hands free for attacking:

Shaolin Head: Allows H2H WS's; slower attack speed, higher damage output
Bandits Head: Allows Dagger WS; faster attack speed, lower damage output

For Valoredge with it's shield and tends to act like WAR:

Champions Head: (PLD) Allows use of some of the light magic spells while DD; raises Defense, Auto-Provoke, Sword WS
Soulstealers Head: (DRK) Allows use of some of the dark magic spells while DD, raises Attack, 2 Handed WS

For Sharpshot Frame with it's ranged attack:

Snipers Head: Only allows for ranged attack and auto stays at max range; large bonus to ranged WS damage
Assassins Head: uses ranged and regular attacks but always at close range; smaller bonus to all WS damage

With any of these, you could also have attachments that give you more control over them just like many of the attachments that change AI for the existing 2 heads. You could even make type of damage (slashing, blunt, piercing) with the type of head you put on it. Just thought these up real quick. Please feel free to expand, change, or suggest others!

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No, PUP needs no more frames or heads.

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No, SMN needs no more summons or blood pacts.

That's basically what you said.

It's not a matter of need. It's a matter of want. It's called content. They give new stuff to jobs all the time. Did RDM really "need" Temper? Did BLM really "need' Meteor? Did we really "need" new weapon skills (at least when they arent much of an upgrade over anything)? No, we didn't. That's not a reason not to have them.

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Caitsith is one avatar to a job that operates differently and is widely considered one of the most useless jobs.

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You say that like there's some guarantee that Cait Sith is going to drastically change summoner for the better or something (and for a "most useless job", i sure end up playing it a lot more than PUP). That's not likely to happen at all. They will most likely be just another toy, just like another frame/head would be. This is the exact same situation and don't try to pretend it's not. New attachments don't help as much as people think because we already have good attachment builds and unless we get more capacity/more slots, any new attachment is going to see limited use at best.

Frankly I don't care if the new frame bakes cookies or does handstands. Every job deserves new content.

I personally wouldn't mind different frames that catered to specific melee damage types. Blunt, slashing, etc.

The only frame combo puppets are missing really is a heavy DD melee frame. While it might be cool to have a puppet with a buster sword for an arm, it would be easier for SE to just make valoredge not suck as a damage dealer, instead of making it a PLD that can't heal itself outside of cannibal blade, and holds hate VS the master alone about as well as a real PLD without Almace VS any DD in the game.

On a side note, if they're going to continue to add attachments, it would be nice if they would increase the slots/elemental capacity so we can actually use them.

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Originally Posted by Retsujo

I personally wouldn't mind different frames that catered to specific melee damage types. Blunt, slashing, etc.

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Huh? Isn't this already possible? VE is slashing, SS is blunt/piercing during TP-with piercing for WS, and the mage frames are blunt.

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Originally Posted by Kysaiana

The only frame combo puppets are missing really is a heavy DD melee frame. While it might be cool to have a puppet with a buster sword for an arm, it would be easier for SE to just make valoredge not suck as a damage dealer, instead of making it a PLD that can't heal itself outside of cannibal blade, and holds hate VS the master alone about as well as a real PLD without Almace VS any DD in the game.

On a side note, if they're going to continue to add attachments, it would be nice if they would increase the slots/elemental capacity so we can actually use them.

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Totally agree about the elemental capacity increase, it has needed to be raised or straight-up taken away for years.

On the other point, i always thought of VE as a WAR. Yeah it has the shield arm, but i always thought that was just SE's commentary on how they wanted WAR to be-sword/shield. Just my opinion anyways.

I have recently returned to the game and am shocked to see bst with another TH pet. Can pup please!!! Get some sort of TH advantage? If not a new puppet or head, at least an attachment? Although I think a THF bot would be pretty sick. Dual wielding daggers lol maybe that's just me. We always seem to get left out in the cold.

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Originally Posted by knauerpower

I have recently returned to the game and am shocked to see bst with another TH pet. Can pup please!!! Get some sort of TH advantage? If not a new puppet or head, at least an attachment? Although I think a THF bot would be pretty sick. Dual wielding daggers lol maybe that's just me. We always seem to get left out in the cold.

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Still don't get some ppl's obsession with this idea that pet jobs need TH. Unless its TH+3(which isn't going to happen at this point), why bother?

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This is a post I made quite a while ago on ffxiah, and never got round to posting here. I'm sure it won't be seen or heard, but as I grow continually discontented with the state of pup, and my inability to use it in most areas of the game I thought it could be worth posting. I'm sure this just amalgamates a lot of the information already in this thread. (Sorry for the Quote tags, I'm just trying to make this a little less WallofTexty)

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Attachments

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As for expanding via attachments I really hope Square realise that we have a finite number of slots and elements to work with, and include an expansion. Some of the already existing attachments should be innate - Shield mastery, counter, double attack to name a few. Some of those job ability/trait attachments are non-negotiable. An attachment to prioritise curing on a frame that was designed to with the intent to replicate white mage is counter-intuitive.

As for creating attachments that are meant to emulate certain jobs I fail to see how that'll improve things. Many people draw analogues to pld and Valor (as evidenced by it gaining Invincible via our new 2hr), but without a native mp pool that can't be recreated. Most other slots on the mage jobs are accounted for. Barrage turbine is a great example of an attachment done right, though it does eliminate wind maneuvers, which messes with haste and can cause the wrong ws to go off.

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Mage Frames

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I know that our mage frames got quite the buff recently, and for that I am thankful, but there are some more changes I would like to see implemented. Damage gauge + Optic Fiber I feel is broken, never do I need a cure at 80% hp, often this will create scenarios where my mp will burn at stupidly fast rates. I'd like to see Damage gauge either removed or changed to grant an afflatus: solace type effect and the curing behaviour to be innate to the frame. Furthermore, I would like to see Soulsoother cast cure 4, instead of just 5 and 6. With the changes to cure 4, and vivi-valve + 1 LM it can easily cure for 600, which my dumb little cure-auto often cure 5s me for.

Allowing us to have a "Support Deploy" ability would be amazing, sometimes I don't want my auto to nuke or enfeeble. It would push the enhancing magic aspect of RDM frame to a new level.

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AI, Head stats, and Animators.

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I know that the head of the frame is the AI of the automaton, and the body the stats, however I think with some minor changes to that formula we could see some interesting combinations that would expand upon the versatility. Merely relegating mp to the frames head would allow us to create a pld-esque frame, while the standard valoredge head could be focused more on attack. I also feel that the head slot should home some job specific traits; Red - Autorefresh or Fastcast, White - Cure Potency + Black - Magic Attack Bonus + Rng head - Snapshot Valor - PDT or Attack.

Animators pale in comparison to other melee options, their inclusion (and the fact it precludes us from using any ammo) deprives us of both weapon skill and melee enhancing options. For a job that is already attack deprived this is much more detrimental than it sounds. If you insist on keeping them then they should at least be congruent with their description - I fail to see how +Dex has any bearing upon speed or directness of commands. Apart from very loose lore they act as nothing more than an annoyance, and everytime you add a viable melee ammo for pup it's as if you're taunting us.

Other adjustments I'd like to see include: More job ability attachments, allow Barrage turbine to consume only 1 Wind maneuvre, innate job traits like counter, double attack etc (That are further enhanced by the use of coiler etc), Auto acc buff. Reworking of harlequin.

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This post is long, I apologise for that, brevity was never one of my strong suits. The rest of this is an addendum to what I wrote on FFXIAH.

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Mo' autos, Mo' problems. (Problems for PUP in high level content.)

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I don't claim to understand the Dev teams rationale and philosophy behind jobs, it feels as though certain jobs are tiered and better for fodder content. Pup is definitely one of those classes. Yet at the same time contrivances such the proc system in Voidwatch relay a message that you want all jobs to be used for endgame content. There's a massive, currently insurmountable problem with that.

Puppetmaster is a job based upon a pet, alone it pales in comparison to nearly every other melee. Automatons either die immediately or have such low accuracy and attack as to be worthless. I know that autos damage is calculated differently, and that the formulas for this are seeming mysteries. However unless this largely (and I mean largely) unbalances the job it is time to allow outside buffs to hit pets.

Job Ability Idea: Emulate - Copies beneficial effects from Player to Automaton (Including Temporary Items).
I hear the balance bell chiming, but frankly PUP is currently useless on any high level content. Anything requiring Embrava (NNI) and even on fodder content is largely outclassed by other jobs. This would put us closer to other jobs. I doubt highly it would let us surpass SAM WAR or

Pup, against todays content, performs poorly. Autos are as defensive as a wet paper towel, and about as potent. You still add mage options to our gear selections. You're adding new jobs without fixing what is already there. As you continue to add high level content the disparity between jobs is becoming increasingly evident. PUP will be forever the whipping boy of our community, along with dnc and thf, unless some attempt to fix the underlying causes of the problems.

It seems like there's a good deal of information in there that is either simply incorrect, or that I disagree with, but goddamn, I think you've managed to out Wall of Text me. I'll edit this post in response at some point, when I have the time to sit down and chew my way through that.

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Originally Posted by Theytak

It seems like there's a good deal of information in there that is either simply incorrect, or that I disagree with, but goddamn, I think you've managed to out Wall of Text me. I'll edit this post in response at some point, when I have the time to sit down and chew my way through that.

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I'd be interested to know what you think is wrong. I know that calling PUP bad is a sweeping statement, but I've tried to be factually accurate in all other regards. I will amend anything that is simply incorrect. I don't think a 'great deal' is though.

And yeah, the post really got away from me. I'm not good at being concise. I'll probably make about 20 edits to try to get it towards reasonable levels.

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Originally Posted by Balloon

I'd be interested to know what you think is wrong. I know that calling PUP bad is a sweeping statement, but I've tried to be factually accurate in all other regards. I will amend anything that is simply incorrect.

And yeah, the post really got away from me. I'm not good at being concise. I'll probably make about 20 edits to try to get it towards reasonable levels.

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Your summary of why and how pup is a bad job is inaccurate, somewhat uninformed, and demonstrates that you probably don't know much about FFXI math. Pup is not a top tier melee DD, no, we'll never out damage a mnk or a war, unless KKK get involved, but that's a separate issue, but we can easily keep up with and out pace non pure DD jobs, like thf, dnc, nin, bst, etc. We're far from the worst DD job, atm, we're sitting sort of around lower-middle.

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Originally Posted by Theytak

Your summary of why and how pup is a bad job is inaccurate, somewhat uninformed, and demonstrates that you probably don't know much about FFXI math. Pup is not a top tier melee DD, no, we'll never out damage a mnk or a war, unless KKK get involved, but that's a separate issue, but we can easily keep up with and out pace non pure DD jobs, like thf, dnc, nin, bst, etc. We're far from the worst DD job, atm, we're sitting sort of around lower-middle.

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That paragraph was ambiguous, but it's meant to be with high level content in mind. I still think pup is a bad job for the current relevant content, but not the worst. Our innately lower attack, accuracy and the cycle delay added with the use of Maneuvers really damages our offensive output. Right off the bat we're at a disadvantage from having a lower pdif, being penalised more heavily by level correction and requiring more accuracy to cap our hit rate. When geared similarly to a mnk (http://www.ffxiah.com/item-sets/260946) our hitrate is uncapped against Qilin (something like 75+((540-480)/2)+2x(Level Difference) if bg is to be believed) at around 80%, which includes Aggressor and Stalwarts. It's not the worst dps, but given the same buffs jobs can pull about 200ish dps ahead. That's where our pets should closing the gap.

I'm not proficient with FF math, but I have a very basic understanding of it, enough so that I know what to gear towards and what stats effect what.

In the context of VW, and other endgamish content I'd consider THF DNC NIN BST etc to be bad jobs too.

There's not a lot of fodder content as it stands. PUP/THF is great in dynamis, but I think I'd rather take an equally well geared DNC/THF or BST/DNC. I think discussions of endgame content is more pertinent, consider that the game is currently largely focused on that content.

That stands for most 1h classes, we get absolutely slaughtered with ratio and level correction.

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Originally Posted by Balloon

Stuff about attachments

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I agree that SE needs to realize that we only have so many elemental slots, and that some of the attachments they've given us are made useless by the combination of that, and what's necessary for the puppet to be viable in certain situations (ex: needing target marker and stab 2 in order for VE, or especially sharpshot, to have any melee acc at all). However, I don't necessarily agree with your opinion on the Job trait attachments. Barrier module's blocking effect should be innate, yes, however, the rest of them are designed to function as a trade off, and they work the same way as player gear does. You can't use double attack/crit gear if you don't have enough acc/haste to make it worthwhile. That's an issue with elemental slots, not the attachments themselves.

I do agree about the redundancy of damage gauge, but remember that it was released as one of our original attachments, several months before soulsoother/spiritreaver came into being, and actually does serve a purpose for stormwaker, whose innate cure trigger is 30% HP. Or was. I can't remember if they changed it. That said, both damage gauge and scanner fall into the category of "should have been built in" and in the cases of soulsoother and spiritreaver, they are (soulsoother technically has damage gauge built in, due to it's higher cure triggers, and spiritreaver has scanner built in, evidenced by the many bugs over the years that were a result of equipping it with scanner), however, scanner should be innate on -all- magic puppets, not just the one that doesn't cast enfeebles without tearing its arm out of its socket.

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Originally Posted by Balloon

Stuff about Mage pets

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The issue with Soulsoother's MP inefficiency is less of an issue of attachments, because those are optional, and more of it's still terrible healing AI that is about as intelligent as a 2004 Valkurm Dunes WHM. "YOU'RE MISSING HP! OMGBIGGESTCUREIHAVEGO!" is not very intelligent. That said, as much as I would absolutely love for our puppets to get cureskin, there's absolutely no way in hell SE would ever do that. We already step on whm's toes too much for them as it is.

I definitely agree with the support deploy idea, though, and I proposed it in another thread. However, for it to really benefit the buffing, it would also require that they get rid of the incredibly stupid "Only casts buffs on the master, then whoever has hate" restriction. The puppet's not picky with -nas or cures, but trying to get it to pro/shell/haste/regen someone that isn't tanking is impossible. I wouldn't mind seeing the "Only cast regen if the monster checks DC+" restriction abolished either, because it's pointless and annoying.

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Originally Posted by Balloon

Stuff about heads/frames and animators

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I disagree with you on the heads = JTs idea. It'd be way too messy to implement, because it would require reworking them so that using non-matching head/frame combos didn't completely suck 90% of the time. It's not a matter of minor changes, so much as "completely redesigning the method behind which automatons operate," which is absolutely not something I want SE doing. Fixing issues with the AI is one thing, but mucking with the spaghetti code could cause permanent damage they forget/decide not to fix, and it's not remotely worth the risk, for how little the benefit would be.

Also worth noting, even though animators prevent us from using ammo, we don't exactly have a wonderful range of nice TP ammo pieces anyway, so we're not missing out on a great deal. The bigger problem with the animators is that there's absolutely no difference between them, aside from how much their hidden +dex stat gives; except animator +1 and it's nice little HP/MP boost. I'd much rather they add some obvious benefits to using the different animators, or too upgrading them, than have them muck around with stuff that doesn't need fixing.

That said, I do agree that poor harle needs some love.

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Originally Posted by Balloon

Silly nonsense about pup being a bad job

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As I mentioned, pup hardly "Pales in comparison to every other melee." Pup is not designed to be able to out damage jobs like mnk, war, sam, drk, drg, or rng, because those jobs are designed almost entirely to focus on damage output. It would be horribly unfair if any job could out damage one of them, while also being able to perform some other ability significantly well. Among the jobs that split their roles, like pup does, pup is one of the stronger melee DDs, if not the strongest (it's really a toss up with dnc, and depends heavily on gear). Mind you, none of us can compete with blu for sheer damage output, but in terms of melee damage, pup's ahead of most of the remaining jobs. Yes, this does rely on our pet to a degree, however, we are not like bsts; the majority of our damage comes from us, not our pet. For a bst, the player supports their pet. For a pup, the pet supports the player.

Of course, everything changes at high haste, but every JA heavy job suffers in high haste, not just us. The only reason we're always ignored in zerg situations is that, unlike jobs like blu, dnc, or thf, we don't exactly have much to bring to the table that someone else can't do better. We lack a unique "draw" that secures us a spot in the alliance, when whm heals better, blm nukes better, and we're not a heavy DD. Dnc has haste samba, debuffing steps, and respectable damage output. Thf has treasure hunter and doesn't need anything else to get its slot. Blu has it's handful of stuns, as well as it's sheer magic damage output. Bst is in the same situation we are, and they honestly even have it worse, because they don't even have an option like Kenkonken, which can put us on par with the heavy DDs.

Pup is, in no way, a bad job, however. It has it's quirks and annoying bits, but so does every other job (except sam and whm). There's nothing poorly executed about being able to drop a 1-2k (outside abyssea) ws and a 2-3k T5 nuke at the same time, or a Cure V. Lord knows neither whm nor blm could out melee us. Our biggest problem right now is not so much that we lack anything, but that there's nothing in the game except fucking zergs. Every job has a weak event, and for pup, it's zergs. Hopefully, within a year or so, we'll have moved away from every single event being 4x emp war/mnks+2x schs for embrava, and when that happens, pup will find its niche again.

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Originally Posted by Theytak

Our biggest problem right now is not so much that we lack anything, but that there's nothing in the game except fucking zergs. Every job has a weak event, and for pup, it's zergs.

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This, more than anything, is what I was trying to articulate. I just don't see SE moving away from that style of content. I think the jobs should be changed to be more conducive to that play style, rather than hoping they add events that those jobs do excel at.

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Originally Posted by Theytak

Also worth noting, even though animators prevent us from using ammo, we don't exactly have a wonderful range of nice TP ammo pieces anyway, so we're not missing out on a great deal.

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http://www.ffxiah.com/item/19779/potestas-bomblet -

http://www.ffxiah.com/item/19764/demonry-core -

http://www.ffxiah.com/item/19249/thew-bomblet

http://www.ffxiah.com/item/19769/mantis-eye

We're an attack starved job, just remember that this is 15 attack we're losing ON TOP of mnk, dnc etc

I agree that animators need to have a function beyond DEX and Pet:HP. Pet bonuses ideally. At the very, very least it should allow us to equip ammo on top of an animator.

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Originally Posted by Theytak

There's nothing poorly executed about being able to drop a 1-2k (outside abyssea) ws and a 2-3k T5 nuke at the same time

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Yes, but if you're looking for pure damage against fodder content I'm inclined to say that Sharpshot would do better (Just pedantry.) This is fairly moot for endgame, Recasts and pet AI that is too stupid to pull off a lot of sequential nukes. It's problematic keeping enough maneuvers on to be able to do consistently high damage; it shreds into your DPS and DAD is less viable thanks to pets standing in AoE range.

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Originally Posted by Theytak

I disagree with you on the heads = JTs idea

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I honestly didn't think that was reasonable. We're talking about a developer that is too lazy to implement more Macro slots. It's unviable. I like the idea hypothetically though.

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Originally Posted by Theytak

However, I don't necessarily agree with your opinion on the Job trait attachments. Barrier module's blocking effect should be innate, yes, however, the rest of them are designed to function as a trade off

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I agree to an extent, sure, that doesn't preclude having individual traits though. I'm not sure where counter would fit, but Double attack should be innate within the Valoredge frame, then expanded upon, they should all have a small amount of acc boosts, the Blackmage frame could have a small amount of Magic Attack. It'd ease the reliance on those attachments slightly.

Ultimately it is an issue with Elemental Capacity and slots. Unless we're looking at something magically groundbreaking though we're not gonna exchange an ice slot on the blackmage frame for some fast cast. If they're insistent on adding these they need put them on slots previously unused by auto (For instance Mage attachments on Fire slots.) It wouldn't make sense with how it currently is, but it's the only way I see it being viable without changing things up.

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Originally Posted by Theytak

Kenkoken stuff

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Kenkoken makes us more competitive to players without a mythic, but I don't think that's a fair comparison.

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Originally Posted by Theytak

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Originally Posted by Balloon

Silly nonsense about pup being a bad job

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I wouldn't say that it's silly nonsense, but instead a miscommunication on my behalf. I've changed the content of that post to reflect that. I was having a discussion about the merits of PUP on high level content such as legion and Voidwatch, but failed to make that clear. My apologies. I would agree that pup is not the worst job and has certain niches where it does well.

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Originally Posted by Balloon

it is time to allow outside buffs to hit pets. Job Ability Idea: Emulate - Copies beneficial effects from Player to Automaton (Including Temporary Items).
I hear the balance bell chiming, but frankly PUP is currently useless on any high level content. Anything requiring Embrava (NNI) and even on fodder content is largely outclassed by other jobs. This would put us closer to other jobs. I doubt highly it would let us surpass SAM WAR or DRK

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This is the point I wanted to stress the most. Pet jobs should be about their pet. I know the master can outperform the auto, but they're supposed to work in unison. If the pet could do 2/3 of the damage the player can do now we'd be competitive. Hell 1/2 would go quite a way to making us viable.