Dispel Flourish [Can I have it?]

For the sake of all those dancers who get killed by Ice Spike's Paralyze....

*clicks the like button*

I would love this, but it is the only thing stopping dnc from doing a lot of solos. Potential balance issues?

Dancer is in that unique realm of jobs that I consider a support job (Cor, Brd, Rdm, Smn) and is the only one that can't dispel. I think we're due to have a dispel flourish (but please put it in Flourish I).

Quote:

---

Dancer is in that unique realm of jobs that I consider a support job (Cor, Brd, Rdm, Smn) and is the only one that can't dispel. I think we're due to have a dispel flourish (but please put it in Flourish I).

---

DNC is more of a healing job or tank job then it is a support role.. COR and BRD are the only support jobs out there SMN and RDM are mage jobs which means they use MP to multi task and by saying RDM is support is actually insulting giving the average RDM would find more use in their job then a dnc.. (Read the RDM forum they are some pretty unhappy people there)

But I agree a dispel flourish would be nice to see especially pre 50 it would make a great tool as a main or sub job

flourish 1 and 2 have 3 flourishes, so if dispel would be a flourish, im for it being in flourish 3(OCD). make it good and have it dispel 1-5 stats depending on moves.

although if you ask me, i prefer to get a different flourish and get a dispel step!!!

I agree with it being in Flourishes III, I use Flourish I/II alot so would be a pain to have it in one of those especially if the recast is not friendly :(

Rather it be post-49 though...

I would go with Flourishes I with about a 20 second recast.

Normally, when I'm fighting a casting monster I try to Stun bad spells. I find that monster casting frequency is about equal or slower than my Violent Flourish recast (20 seconds) for most monsters I'm fighting. So if a monster casts Ice Spikes and I don't have to stun it because I have Dispel, Flourishes I is up and I can Dispel it.

Putting it in Flourishes III is not so good because Dispel is something that I want to have available whenever I need it. Striking Flourish has a long recast (2 minutes), so even if Dispel had a 20 second recast, if it was in Flourishes III and I'd used Striking lately, I couldn't use it. Striking Flourish is excellent with Rudra's, though I'm still not sure it's a responsible use of Finishing moves.

I think it would go to group 1 because it's a monster-affecting move, like Desperate/Animated/Violent flourishes are.

lets make it a more interesting dispel

dispel step - if we do get a new flourish, it will be something else instead of dispel because we already have it as a step!! mob loses a buff, 2 with presto, and you get finishing moves, awesome right!! and 15sec recast isnt too shabby

dispel samba - would be silly, but not boring. endispel on every hit that lands!!! would destroy things in PvP

I think dispel step would be way too much lol, means a dispel every 15 seconds or so, no one has such a fast dispel I think. Also, steps all have a building effect on the monster. Dispel can't really become a daze on target.

the actual spell has a 10sec base recast, as does blank gaze.
And who says all steps have to act the same. all you have to do is believe!!

If they did anything to Flours 3 i dont think i'll ever use them. I like striking my rudra's ><;

I'm gonna toss out a big fat NO here. DNC is already an outrageously strong class. Seriously, you can solo almost anything... You don't need a dispel too. And specifically to the person who hinted at wanting a flourish that would dispel multiple effects at a time... I don't know why you would think it would be a good idea to suddenly usurp the role of best dispeler in the game by nearly 5x. That's so ridiculous, it'd be laughable.

Lets make a tank that heals itself for massive amounts, dispels effects, can erase itself, enfeebles the mob, grants itself a run speed bonus, is highly evasive, and can self skill chain roughly every minute! Sounds like a fair and balanced design, right guys?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bigboy

I'm gonna toss out a big fat NO here. DNC is already an outrageously strong class. Seriously, you can solo almost anything... You don't need a dispel too. And specifically to the person who hinted at wanting a flourish that would dispel multiple effects at a time... I don't know why you would think it would be a good idea to suddenly usurp the role of best dispeler in the game by nearly 5x. That's so ridiculous, it'd be laughable.

Lets make a tank that heals itself for massive amounts, dispels effects, can erase itself, enfeebles the mob, grants itself a run speed bonus, is highly evasive, and can self skill chain roughly every minute! Sounds like a fair and balanced design, right guys?

---

Super fair thanks for being on board with this

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by GERM

DNC is more of a healing job or tank job then it is a support role.. COR and BRD are the only support jobs out there SMN and RDM are mage jobs which means they use MP to multi task and by saying RDM is support is actually insulting giving the average RDM would find more use in their job then a dnc.. (Read the RDM forum they are some pretty unhappy people there)

But I agree a dispel flourish would be nice to see especially pre 50 it would make a great tool as a main or sub job

---

My criteria for defining a support job: party wide refresh, haste, and other benefits to a party that aren't standard (ie: defense down on a mob, paralyze, slow etc). While I agree dnc is able to heal and tank mobs on the other side of the job it is able to enhance the parties damage with steps as well as buff the party with sambas. Pigeon holing dnc as a healer or tank only is short sighted. Sure, DNC has Waltzes but that's just one of the many JA's that make up the list, the job's major tanking tool is an optional JA that isn't even available until you level 75. Also labeling jobs that use MP only as mage jobs is also ignorant. Just because a job uses MP it can't support a party? Avatars favor, and the entire Blood Pact: Ward series are support abilities. Rdm is the only job listed I can see an argument against it being a support job but there are situations where a RDM is only needed to haste and refresh his comrades and enfeeble the opposition. I made a point in saying that those are the jobs I consider support jobs, jobs that I have played and learned to appreciate, you're welcome to your opinion but if you're going to attempt to come at my post back it up with better claims.

Back to the topic Flourish I seems to be the best place for a dispel ability to me and I think an easy way to implement it is to add a job ability at level 50 that adds dispel to one of the flourishes of that category. While weight and dispel and stun and dispel sound awesome to me I feel that animated flourish is the likely candidate for such an ability.

For those who don't think Dancer needs a dispel ability think back to when Garuda's hastega lasted 30 seconds for 120 MP, or when Corsair didn't have sleep or dispel, or when Bard could only AOE their songs. When these things were fixed other jobs were still able to exist in their own lanes. Adding dispel to Dancer's repertoire is kind of like the missing piece to a puzzle.

Now that mages mostly sub RDM, the only time that Dispel is really an issue someone else can't handle is when we're solo or duoing with another melee (in which case we might as well be solo). So lets not mince words, it's a solo tool.

Would I like to have it, as a solo tool? Sure!
In the long term, would it make our job more desirable in group settings? Not really!

But for the same reasons, balance-wise:
Would it lead to balance issues on the group-scale? No!
Would it lead to balance issues on the solo-scale? There can't really be balance issues on the solo scale. Everyone goes their best solo job to solo anyway, so potentially changing which job that is doesn't matter.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bigboy

I'm gonna toss out a big fat NO here. DNC is already an outrageously strong class. Seriously, you can solo almost anything... You don't need a dispel too. And specifically to the person who hinted at wanting a flourish that would dispel multiple effects at a time... I don't know why you would think it would be a good idea to suddenly usurp the role of best dispeler in the game by nearly 5x. That's so ridiculous, it'd be laughable.

Lets make a tank that heals itself for massive amounts, dispels effects, can erase itself, enfeebles the mob, grants itself a run speed bonus, is highly evasive, and can self skill chain roughly every minute! Sounds like a fair and balanced design, right guys?

---

I think BRDs will be fine not being the best dispellers.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bigboy

DNC is already an outrageously strong class.

---

You talk as if DNC was the most overpowered Job in game. It is not. All jobs have been boosted on several sides and I don't think my request is any less fair than those NINs asking for Utsusemi:San or BLMs asking for Death spell.

DNC is a multi-task job, next to RDM and BLU and PUP, it can cover several roles. it is not a TANK or a HEALER or a DD or a SUPPORT JOB only, it can be anything as the situation requires and that's what multi-tasking means (not saying that the other jobs I listed can be all of that, but sure they can do more than one thing in a party).

And before you talk about a job being overpowered or too strong, maybe you should consider the fact that DNC is the only main melee job whose main weapon's skill rank is only a B+. (Even PUP got that fixed now.)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kjara

You talk as if DNC was the most overpowered Job in game. It is not. All jobs have been boosted on several sides and I don't think my request is any less fair than those NINs asking for Utsusemi:San or BLMs asking for Death spell.

DNC is a multi-task job, next to RDM and BLU and PUP, it can cover several roles. it is not a TANK or a HEALER or a DD or a SUPPORT JOB only, it can be anything as the situation requires and that's what multi-tasking means (not saying that the other jobs I listed can be all of that, but sure they can do more than one thing in a party).

And before you talk about a job being overpowered or too strong, maybe you should consider the fact that DNC is the only main melee job whose main weapon's skill rank is only a B+. (Even PUP got that fixed now.)

---

Uhhh... When did that happen, according to wiki, PUP's H2H skill is still B+. It used to be C+.

Edit: And I agree, a lot of the suggestions here make DNC the best at everything all the time. Which is the problem. I think we could do with a 3rd JA similar to fan/saber dances that would put us in a "healing mode" with a -delay on waltzes and maybe even +potency at the expense of say, damage dealt would be reduced by 30%.

I was talking about Automaton's skills rather, PUP's h2h sure isn't the main "weapon" of a puppetmaster's job, the pet is what people invite PUPs for lol.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kjara

I was talking about Automaton's skills rather, PUP's h2h sure isn't the main "weapon" of a puppetmaster's job, the pet is what people invite PUPs for lol.

---

We appear to have a difference of opinion, as any properly geared puppetmaster will outdamage his puppet by a mile.

Also, people don't invite Puppetmasters for the puppet, they invite them because there's nothing else seeking. Sorry PUPs, but it's true.

They could balance the Dispel Flourish by making it cost 5 finishing moves to do, and give it a 75% success rate.

IE: It's only good for Ice Spikes xD

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alkalinehoe

Uhhh... When did that happen, according to wiki, PUP's H2H skill is still B+. It used to be C+.

Edit: And I agree, a lot of the suggestions here make DNC the best at everything all the time. Which is the problem. I think we could do with a 3rd JA similar to fan/saber dances that would put us in a "healing mode" with a -delay on waltzes and maybe even +potency at the expense of say, damage dealt would be reduced by 30%.

---

That seems very reasonable. I would even say there should be a small Regain effect while in this stance if you are going to take a 30% damage reduction. If you wanted to go full tilt, you could completely remove the ability to WS in the stance and I would say a 3TP tick refresh with amnesia immunity would even be fair. Removing the stance would wipe TP obviously.

I can agree of DNC having a form of dispel

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kjara

I was talking about Automaton's skills rather, PUP's h2h sure isn't the main "weapon" of a puppetmaster's job, the pet is what people invite PUPs for lol.

---

People invite PUPs cause of sympathy not the pet lol

Either the dispel flourish would have to be under Flourishes I (10/15 sec recast), or they could add a piece of gear that augments Violent Flourish to add a dispel effect when used. Either way is a means to the same end.

I could get behind a dispel flourish, but I think it's unessissary. How about an absorb flourish instead?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dova_quetz

People invite PUPs cause of sympathy not the pet lol

---

I thought PUPs built PT because that was the only way thet could get them.

actually, people invite pups to do good damage or curing without pulling much hate... unless the rest of the party is totally incompetent.

And a big NO to dnc dispel. Dnc is overpowered as is. If you need dispel, /brd, finale hardly ever fails to proc on my bst/brd build, and my dnc/brd has even more charisma, shouldn't be an issue.