Bully: it's really bad.

Did a little bit of testing.

Recast 5:00 - Surprise surprise!!
Duration ~0:30 - Further testing shows the duration varies. Lasted 20 seconds on a T1 Jeuno VWNM.

Inflicts the mob you use it on with a type of debuff that cause a chance of intimidation against anyone it acts upon.

Has a range of about 10-15 yalms. This is the best thing about the ability. Can be used for claiming.

Intimidation rate solo is just atrocious. On abyssea mobs in 3 attempts I got not a single intimidation. On Gukumatz 0 intimidates. On TW mobs 2 intimidates in 3 tries. 0 intimidates and a shortened duration on T1 VW Gargouille.

Duo testing was extremely limited but seemed no better. I don't know if party size even affects this ability anymore since SE left that out of the description.

A voke from a sch vs bully resulted in 100% vs. 70% enmity.

meh...

btw can you get to 95 on the test server? would you be able to test for moar DW and crit attack bonus? :p

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Insaniac

Did a little bit of testing.

Recast 5:00 - Surprise surprise!!
Duration ~0:30

Inflicts the mob you use it on with a type of debuff that cause a chance of intimidation against anyone it acts upon.

Has a range of about 10-15 yalms. This is the best thing about the ability. Can be used for claiming.

Intimidation rate solo is just atrocious. On abyssea mobs in 3 attempts I got not a single intimidation. On Gukumatz 0 intimidates. On TW mobs 2 intimidates in 3 tries.

Duo testing was extremely limited but seemed no better. I don't know if party size even affects this ability anymore since SE left that out of the description.

A voke from a sch vs bully resulted in 100% vs. 70% enmity.

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That's suprising...I'm still downloading, was going to go brew Shinryu or Dragua and test the procs too. Aquick question for a ray of hope - what about JA animation? Does it make THF shine all over?

Thanks for the heads up. ^^

The animation is boring too! The only hope for this JA is if the chance of intimidate increase drastically if you are in a full party.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Laphine

meh...

btw can you get to 95 on the test server? would you be able to test for moar DW and crit attack bonus? :p

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Already checked lol. Still DW2 at 95 on the test server.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Insaniac

Already checked lol. Still DW2 at 95 on the test server.

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;_;

/sigh

What has two thumbs and called this the moment SE mentioned bully?

This guy.

:eek:

/sarcasm

I only just came home, so no chance to test yet. Honestly, I knew it would suck from the moment it was announced. However, we finally get a decent claim tool, which I didn't consider before. That alone kinda makes it worth it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Arcon

I only just came home, so no chance to test yet. Honestly, I knew it would suck from the moment it was announced. However, we finally get a decent claim tool, which I didn't consider before. That alone kinda makes it worth it.

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I don't know if I would say worth it lol. Maybe more like a turd with a silver lining?

Yeah, I think everyone expected this ability to be stupid.

But the whole "no DW3 at 95" is upsetting. I suppose it's still possible we'll get it 95-99, but I'm not optomisitc.

Its like they have a "THF Fail Ability" button they keep mashing update after update after update.

Still needs to be tested in a party setting but I'm not holding my breath on it being good enough to make it on to my home macro page. I'm sure on anything like T3/4 VWNMs even with a full party there's like a 2% chance of it procing.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Insaniac

Still needs to be tested in a party setting but I'm not holding my breath on it being good enough to make it on to my home macro page. I'm sure on anything like T3/4 VWNMs even with a full party there's like a 2% chance of it procing.

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Even if it was, a 30 second duration with a 5 minute recast is retarded. But retarded is the baseline that SE operates on when it comes to THF job abilities.

Retarded functionality, retarded (positional or current enmity target) restrictions, retarded effect durations to go with retardedly long (and shared) recast timers. (Did you check to see if your conspirator/steal/accomplice timer reset?)

This hasn't changed in the better part of a decade....it isn't going to happen now.

I may have missed it in skimming. Does it share a timer?

No it does not.

Lets start a thief ally and see what happens if people rotate and keep it up full time. :P

Meh, I wanted to tail tank Hazhdiha and see how many procs I'd get, but it seems no freepop NMs are up. Didn't see ??? for Dragua either. Probably needs dominion fame build up :-/ I'll try to think of something else that could Hundred Fists me.
Got 1 proc on Manigordos (abyssea tiger) and had to log for now.
God, I'd compare this effect to weak Paralyze - you're lucky if it procs once before wearing off. In before SE says it's awesome, because no monster can resist the effect...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Laphine

meh...

btw can you get to 95 on the test server? would you be able to test for moar DW and crit attack bonus? :p

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Just confirmed Crit Attack Bonus III at level 91. It's another 3%.

yay \o/ finally good news, we are sure to get another by 99 then~

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Laphine

yay \o/ finally good news, we are sure to get another by 99 then~

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Yeah!! If there is any justice in the world we will be the only ones who get it too!. I didn't feel like checking if WAR or DNC got the new tier but I will next time I'm on the test server.

no DW3 sucks.....

well, we certainly will have it by 99. Expecting dw3 now could open dw4 i guess, but dw4 is not something i would see them handing for us.

I'm more worried about a tool to make us forget about /nin. Something maybe akin to third eye and stuff. Bully had this potential, but as usual...

I would love not to have to sub nin if I'm going to be fighting something hard or need to actually tank. THF/war is so much more fun and so much more damage than thf/nin ._.

Since people are getting a bunch of Mini-2hr's, THF should get something like a Mini-PD. Since MNK gets a 1min recast Perfect Counter which not only evades an attack but deals Damage, i see no reason THF's "mini-2hr" ability could be on a 1minute timer.

Have it evade a few Attacks similar to Third eye? I would have suggested a "Perfect Parry" Idea, But that was ignored and of course they gave a variant of it to NIN instead. Really those abilities really only help us when we're tanking or solo, which is a very small niche to fill.

Hopefully those aside they give us more party friendly abilities that dont have 5% proc rate and on a 5min timer with 30sec duration.

While I'm at it.

Feedback on Bully:

Its pretty awful. According to initial findings, Its a short duration, long recast, and very weak... Pretty much as i expected. A bonus is that is works on your entire party.

Some Suggestions: Lengthen Effect time, or lower recast. lets be real a moment, its a glorified Paralyze, its not that broken, its not that powerful, its pretty useless no matter what. Can we at least make it somewhat useful and revamp it like follows?

Bully
Recast:2 minutes
Duration: 1 minute (effectively keeping it up only 50% of the time)
Potency: 10~15%?

Comparison to Paralyze I/II which can be kept up 100% of the time on nearly all mobs, has a rather high activation rate with the right gear, and can be cast every few seconds.

I beg you, please do not use the "Well it ignores resists..." excuse like they did with Aura steal =.=a

5minutes Recast, 30 second duration lets you keep this epitome of useless up only 10% of the time! Its not useful! Having something on a mob 10% of the time for a low Effect rate is worthless!

Thank you for reading.

I don't see myself even wasting a macro for this. Maybe somewhere out of the way if I need to claim something fast.

I can already do this MUCH better with paralyze arrows.

"But, THF's, Its SO AWESOME that it isn't subject to resists!!"

How do people this stupid get paid to develope video games?

There's really no reason for this ability to exist, I'm not sure why they keep adding abilities that serve no point and aren't needed AND don't help jobs that could use some help :/

THF having self-survivability without needing to sub NIN would also be awesome. I really really hate subbing NIN.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nebo

I don't see myself even wasting a macro for this. Maybe somewhere out of the way if I need to claim something fast.

I can already do this MUCH better with paralyze arrows.

"But, THF's, Its SO AWESOME that it isn't subject to resists!!"

How do people this stupid get paid to develope video games?

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If only i lived in Japan and had the proper credentials...

THF updates always feel like they got done and at the last minute realized they had forgotten about THF and just knock something out half-ass so they can go home for the day.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Atomic_Skull

THF updates always feel like they got done and at the last minute realized they had forgotten about THF and just knock something out half-ass so they can go home for the day.

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You are missing the point entirely.

THF is SUPPOSED to be weak and its job abilities are SUPPOSED to suck sweaty donkey balls.

TreasurePLacebo Hunter (that just so happens tobe outclassed by every single weakness trigger proc style endgame event that has been introcuded post level cap) is all you should ever have.

Shut up. Sit in the corner and take it.

lol I can't wait to try out the new stuff

Well, so much for being optimistic, and hoping for a 'perfect counter' style ability ><

I love the attitude in this topic. Other forums have topics like "Temper Info" or "Scarlet Delirium Recast" with people being shocked and outraged that their new spells and abilities are disappointing or out-right horrible.

Here, the topic is "Bully: It's really bad" with responses such as "Feedback on Bully: It's pretty awful." If someone assumed it would be good, or suggests it ever will be good, he is promptly corrected by a fellow who knows the truth of things.

You guys are the Buddhist monks of the FFXI world. You understand that all existance is suffering, any "God" (the development team) is just somebody who knows as little as we do but sits behind a bigger desk, and that coming to peace with awfulness is the only way to know tranquility.

I'm trying to keep a little positive about the ability. Has anyone on the test server managed to try it out in an alliance? Maybe they missed the wording out but the affect is still much greater with a full party/ally. If it is then it could still be useful for chainspell/hundred fisting NMs n stuff.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by noodles355

I'm trying to keep a little positive about the ability. Has anyone on the test server managed to try it out in an alliance? Maybe they missed the wording out but the affect is still much greater with a full party/ally. If it is then it could still be useful for chainspell/hundred fisting NMs n stuff.

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I couldn't get anymore than 1 person at a time to help me with testing since all people were doing on the test server was loading up with gear and using their free WoE emps for lulz.

i still cant get on is the beta at certain times

From the looks of the JP forums Bully is getting lowered to 3 minutes and I guess the intimidate rate increases with everyone in your alliance so 18/18 might = boss intimidation. Blind hope has got a hold of my ankle. Hopefully he's not here to drag me into the depths of the rage sea.

I would still like it to be a little better for low man play since it's kinda terrible for that.

they should at least lower every 5min JA we have to 3min while they are at it lol

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Laphine

they should at least lower every 5min JA we have to 3min while they are at it lol

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Three minutes is still too long a recast for most of the things that have a 5 minute recast currently.

A three minute timer doesn't fix steal, aurasteal, despoil, conspirator, hide, accomplice, (even mug) etc because their base effect duration, functionality, shared recasted timers, etc. are all severely flawed and functionally useless as a result.

It would just be putting more bandaids on shotgun wounds.

3 minute recast with a 30 second duration is not going to fix bully either....

It would need to be something like what Krabnucklehead said: 2 minute recast/1 minute duration and increased potency.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nebo

Three minutes is still too long a recast for most of the things that have a 5 minute recast currently.

A three minute timer doesn't fix steal, aurasteal, despoil, conspirator, hide, accomplice, (even mug) etc because their base effect duration, functionality, shared recasted timers, etc. are all severely flawed and functionally useless as a result.

It would just be putting more bandaids on shotgun wounds.

3 minute recast with a 30 second duration is not going to fix bully either....

It would need to be something like what Krabnucklehead said: 2 minute recast/1 minute duration and increased potency.

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I'm starting to lean to 'work with what you've got'. 3min is better than 5, not great but slightly better. Also, look at this affect from this perspective: A 3min Provoke v2: 70% of voke hate, very slight chance of intimidation and 10-15' range. Sounds at least acceptable for claiming NMs (not like there's anything worth claiming these days tho....) and voking off mages (or at least giving them intimidation chance, better than nothing) when they pull hate and Collaborator fails/is down. I'd say PLDs would be jelly of just that, haha.
But seriously, SE, is this all you've got for THF...?