PALADIN. There is a new spell for every job that uses magic and/or a reused spell for jobs like RDM and SCH but no new spell for us? Even DRK got a spell.... Come on SE, can we please see some LOVE! Thank you!
Screwed again: New spells for everyone but...
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08-28-2011, 05:07 AMAldielQuetzScrewed again: New spells for everyone but...
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08-28-2011, 07:18 AMAldielQuetz
Show your support with a LIKE my fellow Paladins! Let's see some suggestions reposted if necessary from the improvements page. I know I hate it when someone complains and has no solutions to share.
In the improvements page I suggested a spell called Awe to compliment Flash, since we are the Magical Knights of this Realm. Maybe Regenga Lv 65, Regenga II Lv 80 and Regenga III Lv 95. See! There, now we get 3 new spells! Or a spell that's the single target form of the new WHM spell for MDB? Wouldn't anything be better than knothing fellow Knights of Vanadiel?!
So rate it up, post your suggestions and let's get recognized so we aren't all QQ again like after the last fail-update! -
08-28-2011, 07:32 AMEconomizer
If I had to make a bet about the new spells, I'd bet that Paladin will get Holy II. And you guys will probably be better at using it to deal damage then a White Mage.
I'd also like to see Paladin get Repose, since Dark Knights get Sleep/SleepII/Break, and they get Stun at the same level PLD gets Flash.
Aside from that, a Divine based Migawari type spell would probably fit Paladin well. -
08-28-2011, 08:25 AMAldielQuetz
I like where you are going. How about comparable spells, like getting Dia and Dia II, since DRK gets Bio and Bio II? Or add in Diaga since DRK gets Poisonaga? Repose to counter Spells like sleep, sleep II, bind, and break? And since DRK is now getting Tier 3 elemental magic, how about we get Banish III, perhaps even Banishga and Banishga II? How about a line of spells to match Absorbs, like Criple-MND,DEX,STR, etc that just reduces the monsters stats but doesn't buff the PLD, make it so Absorbs and Crips don't stack? Not to mention Holy II, and long overdue Raise II and III? Or maybe an AoE Reraise/Raise called Ressurection? I know SE can give us something more than 1 Job Ability over the last 2 level increases, right Pallys?
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08-28-2011, 08:47 AMEconomizer
Forgive me, but I'm not sure if you are serious or not.
I doubt Paladin would get Dia, since it is more of a Red Mage spell that White Mage happens to get since there is a bit of overlap. Furthermore, Paladin does not get Enfeebling Magic skill in the first place, rendering the idea even more out of place. I would place spells that cripple the enemy in the same category. Paladin isn't really an enfeebler outside of enfeebling Divine Magic.
I expect Paladin to get Banish III around the same time White Mage gets Banish IV, since White Mage gets better access to these spells, but only time will tell on this one. Since -aga spells are purely the domain of Black Mage and White Mage outside some AOE enfeeble spells, I don't think Paladin will ever get either of those.
Paladin will not get Reraise ever. Raise II is likely however, considering that Red Mage and Scholar both got another tier in the update notes. -
08-28-2011, 08:59 AMAldielQuetz
I am just putting ideas out there, Dia was originally a Divine spell, so they could make something else that works off Divine, and the cripple spells could be Divine based as well and be a debuff inflicted when the enemy gets blocked. Honestly, I was just putting down the categories and types of spells that DRK received and PLD did not so that people would have more things to think about. The word of the DECADE is BALANCE, so that's what I am after here, BALANCE.
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08-28-2011, 06:47 PMMorwy
Divine based Migawari at first sight seems an interresting idea, i'd like to see it. Flash II or anything on the same line of thoughts is fine too.
Now for the rest, considering our somewhat limited manapool, i'd rather heal myself and my party than cast Holy II which will prolly costs large amounts of mana and do limited damages. (unless you MB ! ^^;) -
08-29-2011, 02:47 AMEconomizer
I've seen screenshots of PLD using Divine Emblem and getting 7k Holy. I imagine Holy II would just add insult to this injury... maybe a party of Paladins to manaburn NMs.
Of course, most of the time, it probably won't be used, but who would say no to another Holy? -
08-30-2011, 06:41 PMgryyphynNone of those are in the new spell list on the test server for Pld. I think getting at least the non -ga Abyssea proc spells would be a good idea but I agree that Pld shouldn't get DOT or enfeeb spells. At least something like an erase would be nice though. Not going /dnc leaves me boned if I get bio or dia or etc...Quote:
Originally Posted by Economizer
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08-30-2011, 10:18 PMCaketimeI'd like to see this screenshot if you happen to have it laying around.Quote:
Originally Posted by Economizer
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08-31-2011, 02:13 AMCursed
DE was boosted last month and then nerfed. 7K holy before the nerf is nothing special.
You could also A.edge 50-70 mobs for 9-11k with divine emblem up. that too has been nerfed.
if you insist on a screenshot i could check if I took any. But this isn't regarded as unknown info. I think there was a thread about it on either BG or FFXIAH.
But post nerf, I call bullsh!t on anyone saying they did a 7k holy. -
08-31-2011, 02:26 AMCaketime
I don't read BG or FFXIAH, and I'm sure there are others who are just like me who would like to see some proof. Condescending makes a great case for you though, keep it up.
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08-31-2011, 02:28 AMCursed
I'll search. and I don't see how offering to search for it or providing an FYI is Condescending.
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08-31-2011, 02:35 AMCaketime
I did request proof, and you dismissed it initially, implying that I should just take your word for it. Sorry, but I'm not a child, I don't just take things that people say on forums as gospel without something to back it up.
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08-31-2011, 02:45 AMCursed
One of my first tests. Wasn't using any MAB atmas. The atmas used here are VV/Sea Daughter/RR.
The best Atma combination, I would learn, was Hell's Guard, Ultimate, Cosmos.(more than doubles AE dmg)
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y14...tMABAtmas2.jpg -
08-31-2011, 03:07 AMCaketime
This makes me wonder if it was actually a nerf and not a mistake that cost a young programer his job. Either way, it's very interesting.
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08-31-2011, 03:36 AMZagenDo you mean Gales?Quote:
Originally Posted by Cursed
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08-31-2011, 04:59 AMMartel
About that 7k holy... http://www.ffxiah.com/screenshots/58921
The DE nerf shouldn't have affected this at all. All the fix did was make DE stop working on Aeolian edge.
BTW, as noted in the screenshot, this is hardly normal dmg. I was stacking ever possible advantage. Atma, day/obi, mab/divine/mnd gear, and holy circle on an undead mob.
Considering the ten minute timer, it's pretty worthless. Just damn fun.
As for post nerf dmg.. well it's lightsday now I'll go pull out some gear and see what things look like now. -
08-31-2011, 05:31 AMCursedyes. thanks for that. hell's guard/ultimate/cosmos is what i use for cataclysm spam i think, that or beyond.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zagen
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08-31-2011, 06:15 AMEconomizerThis and all the rest of what Martel said. I think I may have been confusing, but yeah, I didn't mean to say 7k damage was normal, just the limit.Quote:
Originally Posted by Martel
I certainly hope that 7k can still be reached currently, even if it is rare, since it is a ten minute ability, and you aren't reaching this outside Abyssea, but who knows, it could have been hit with AE spam.
Getting Holy II (I understand it supposedly deals 2x the damage of Holy in its current form) would make reaching high damage spike numbers much more likely. -
08-31-2011, 06:53 AMMartel
Well, I went and checked my old DE test data, then went to DE holy a bunny with no gear to check if DE dmg calcs have changed at all.
Old DE holy
Target:wild rabbit
82 MND,
no gear 918 dmg
New DE holy. same stats/target, 918 dmg.
So DE's dmg calulations haven't changed at all. Getting a 7k holy still isn't easy, since you have to catch it when the dominion bonus to cruor buffs are at their peak. But it's still possible.
Hoping for Holy II soon. Cause that's gonna hit really really hard. lol
As for other spells, I'd love Flash II, Flashga, etc. And a divine based migawari-esque spell would be great. Or even something scherzo-like. -
08-31-2011, 02:17 PMOphannus
On the bright side, from my tests it seems PLD has Defense Bonus VI at 91. Wooo..
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08-31-2011, 02:19 PMLordscyon
It be nice for paladin too have Flash II @ least too make everyone happy!
Flash! Flash II! -
08-31-2011, 05:43 PMAldielQuetz
Camate, man.... Please brother... Another defense bonus..... This is such a shame, can we please have something else? Please!
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08-31-2011, 07:41 PMCursed
Defense Bonus..... ugh.... aye yay yay.
Might as well have given us
-Blank Stare
Job ability
Grants 100% of nothing, lasts 5 minutes, recast 5 minutes. -
08-31-2011, 07:55 PMZarchery
Doesn't EVERY major update leave a few jobs unchanged? There are 20 jobs; you can't add to each of them every time. Monk gets absolutely nothing this time around, and I'm fine with that.
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08-31-2011, 10:31 PMMorwy
Well
90 Monk > Impetus.
90 Paladin > Sepulcher.
kthx.
I'm fine with Monk not getting anything because they got a lot already. Paladin on the other hand... -
09-01-2011, 01:20 AMAldielQuetz
Take away counter and martial arts and make h2h damage half of what it is, then you would know what we are dealing with here. With a sword and a shield if I dump everything I have on something like Uhledeshi, let's just say, and a MNK does the same from the start, who will end up with hate?
The MNK.
Principle role of MNK is to do damage not hold hate
Principle role of PLD is to hold hate.
Our job does not work as intended.
Help. -
09-01-2011, 01:29 AMAldielQuetz
And @Morwy EXACTLY!
We haven't gotten anything good added since Enlight, and we don't even get a spell this time? Why not?
We need something that gives us a decisive advantage in what our job was intended to do without being sub job-locked to get it. Where is the Warrior part of Paladin? We are warriors that learned white magic through meditation. Did we forget how to provoke through alcoholism?
It's more fun to play a job that works right, and we are all passionate about PLD, we just need to be heard and a 1minute ability with a 5 minute Recast is not helping.
Lower Palisade recast to 3 minutes like you did Bully and give us Flash 2 so we can have 2 short recast hate tool without subbing WAR, that's all we need, please Devs, please Camate, throw us a bone, make the job fun again instead of a lolJob or a chore.
Thank you so much for every second of your time reading these Camate, I know your job can't be easy. -
09-01-2011, 02:21 AMAhrana
I'm going to say tha the problems with paladin aren't caused by lack of tools, it's by how the enmity system hasn't scaled well past 75. Adding another ability that doesn't address the core problem isn't going to fix the problem.
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09-01-2011, 05:52 AMSeptimus
According to the magic dat file, Paladins are going to get Holy II at level 99. Data miners found this last year.
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09-01-2011, 01:57 PMAldielQuetz
Let's shoot for Flash II, more utility than a nuke that gets bolstered every 10 minutes.
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09-01-2011, 08:18 PMUrteil--------Quote:
Originally Posted by Cursed
Ha. -
09-02-2011, 05:20 AMSeptimus...Quote:
Originally Posted by AldielQuetz
But you specifically asked for Holy II.
You're getting something for which you asked, then you are marginalizing it as if it is not important. I do not understand.Quote:
Originally Posted by AldielQuetz
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09-02-2011, 08:08 AMRearden
The new JA allows gimp PLD to pretend they put work into an Aegis or Ochain for 1m every 5m, what else could you want? Oh right, flash II, with its incredibly high CE values.
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09-02-2011, 12:47 PMAldielQuetz
Flash II this update, a spell at 99 is next update. Not getting a spell is a slap in the face when literally every other job that casts/sings/etc got one.
Balance.
I want Holy II, next update. -
09-02-2011, 03:12 PMSephiran
I personally believe that Square should address such issues through a support job bonus system. For example PLD/RDM should get access to spells and abilities that would normally be out of reach with the sub-job's level cap (specific examples: PLD/RDM would get a proficiency in Enfeebling, access to better Protect and Shell spells at earlier levels, and a higher tier of Fast Cast than that which is available with /RDM at it's current level. PLD/WHM should get access to Afflatus, Banish III, Raise II, Reraise, Esuna, Cure V, and Magic Defense Bonus III.)
Anyone else jiving with this idea? -
09-03-2011, 12:36 AMAldielQuetz
I also think that the healing grace or whatever it's called that reduces enmity from cures should NOT be gained through sub job.
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09-03-2011, 02:59 PMTheytak
Personally, I want Banish III/Holy II on pld just because pld is supposed to be the king of divine magic in the same way drk is the king of dark magic. Though I won't ever actually be able to cast holy II, being a galka and all...
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09-06-2011, 05:08 AMSephiranActually, Tranquil Heart isn't such a bad thing. If you're going /WHM, chances are you're either soloing, serving as multipurpose use in a party, or cure tanking.Quote:
Originally Posted by AldielQuetz
One reason I love /WHM is that it allows you to control enmity, not just gain it. If things get rough, you can loose it if need be, and Tranquil Heart kinda facilitates that by making so that you lose enmity under such circumstances. After all, when are you most likely to spam cure yourself? When you're near death. As a result Tranquil Heart targets your hour of desperation. That, and it only reduces enmity gain while casting, but not from the actual spell's effect, which in turn allows you to resume your job as tank quickly.