Sooo SE actually wants to know the numbers of PS2 users eh?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FrankReynolds

lol If I go shout with my friends in Port Jeuno (in case your wondering, nobody wants to hear your BS complaints in shouts in WG) about why you should move from PS2, will that make it a fact? Sounds to me like your a flake who blames his force D/C on his system.

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Right... so next you are about to tell me what I wore to bed last night? Since you are obviously sitting in my living room watching everything I do. Come off it, man. You have some kind of personal grudge against Sony for whatever reason. Were it not for the constant freezing I would play on 360. Wait... actually I wouldn't. The game just runs better on ps2 than it does 360. And before you jump in with all your "cheap used PC" arguments, the amount of space on said PC makes it impossible for me to fit all the other programs needed for it to serve any practical purposes, meaning I would be buying a PC specifically to play this game. Who in their right mind does that? Wait I guess you do...

Bottom line, just because your experiences differ from mine, does not make them false. I would invite you over to watch them in action and giv eyou numbers to talk to the others, but you'd just tell me I force D/C'ed whileI was in the middle of owning whatever NM I decided to fight. So nevermind. I mean that and the fact that your are probably standing over my shoulder watching me type this

Let's do some quick math. lets assume for the purpose of shits and giggles that SE has 1 programmer, and 1 tester who do all the PS2 stuff. Lets assume they are grossly underpaid and make $30,000 a year each. How many people who are unable or unwilling to transfer their accounts do we need just to support those two employees and still break even?

Actually now that I think about it, this thread is pointless. With the account transfer, POL and the POL viewer no longer serve a purpose. Once they drop the POL viewer, and they will, Both PS2 and 360 are out the window, as the both require the viewer to access the game.

They wont drop the POL viewer but just strip it down.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TetsujinX

Actually now that I think about it, this thread is pointless. With the account transfer, POL and the POL viewer no longer serve a purpose. Once they drop the POL viewer, and they will, Both PS2 and 360 are out the window, as the both require the viewer to access the game.

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IIRC, it's already been stated that POL is NOT going to be dropped because it is still necessary for logging into FFXI.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FrankReynolds

Let's do some quick math. lets assume for the purpose of shits and giggles that SE has 1 programmer, and 1 tester who do all the PS2 stuff. Lets assume they are grossly underpaid and make $30,000 a year each. How many people who are unable or unwilling to transfer their accounts do we need just to support those two employees and still break even?

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What makes you think that FFXI programmers are assigned to develop on a single platform?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FrankReynolds

Let's do some quick math. lets assume for the purpose of shits and giggles that SE has 1 programmer, and 1 tester who do all the PS2 stuff. Lets assume they are grossly underpaid and make $30,000 a year each. How many people who are unable or unwilling to transfer their accounts do we need just to support those two employees and still break even?

---

387

Even though some people can read this, it makes me feel better that I can't.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Leonlionheart

387

Even though some people can read this, it makes me feel better that I can't.

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And that was all without a single drop of Rum

Here is an example: We run out of things that absolutely have to be on the PS2 version also, spells. gear, and abilities to be able to add, due to a PS2 limitation that SE cannot program around (hardware). Since we cannot add more things due to the PS2 version, the game cannot expand. Since the game cannot expand, the game dies.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Economizer

Here is an example: We run out of things that absolutely have to be on the PS2 version also, spells. gear, and abilities to be able to add, due to a PS2 limitation that SE cannot program around (hardware). Since we cannot add more things due to the PS2 version, the game cannot expand. Since the game cannot expand, the game dies.

---

Solution: Add a new expansion. PS2 users cannot get it. Expansion adds areas that PS2 users cannot access, but X360/PC can. PS2 users still have access to everything that's already out.

BAM! The game continues to grow without locking PS2 users out of the game entirely. A solution is found.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Volkai

Solution: Add a new expansion. PS2 users cannot get it. Expansion adds areas that PS2 users cannot access, but X360/PC can. PS2 users still have access to everything that's already out.

BAM! The game continues to grow without locking PS2 users out of the game entirely. A solution is found.

---

I already knew this is exactly what would be said. It was very predictable.

That's why I wrote my example exactly the way I did. I did not say new areas - which would be what an expansion gets too - but new spells, gear, and abilities. And heavens forbid that SE ever wants to add another job, weapon class, or anything that can be taken to older areas. New anything will have to be in the RAM/Hard drive of older systems for various reasons.

Although I suppose you could get around it by not letting PS2 users buy any of the gear, see and of the gear, or log in if they own the new expansion. Except that isn't a solution. Basically, we will eventually hit this wall.

I only state that we should plan ahead for this in a slow manner that gives plenty of advanced notice and warnings, of about 1-2 years, and that anyone who opposes this wants FFXI not to get things, which spells death for an MMO.

Again, even if SE announced the PS2 would be dropped, it will take a lot of time. Legacy users will have plenty of time to upgrade or drop the platform over a lengthy transition period. There is no need to fear a transition, and anyone who takes the time to understand what a successful transition would entail and still opposes it is someone who wants the consequences - eventual death for FFXI.

I say that anyone who understands those consequences and accepts them has no place here.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Volkai

Solution: Add a new expansion. PS2 users cannot get it. Expansion adds areas that PS2 users cannot access, but X360/PC can. PS2 users still have access to everything that's already out.

BAM! The game continues to grow without locking PS2 users out of the game entirely. A solution is found.

---

I like this idea. That also creates incentives for PS2 users to seriously consider upgrading so they can access the new content. Eventually, the ever-increasing amount of content only available to non-PS2 users would dwindle the PS2 population down to nothing, making this entire discussion moot.

They probably aren't looking to dump PS2 anyways. The more logical reasoning is that they are seeing if it's viable to further enhance this game on the PC. Like, whether or not a graphical upgrade is worth the effort. With the failure of FFXIV(thus far) I'm sure they are reconsidering their stance to some kind of an extent to toy around with 11 to gain customers sooner than later.

It's also possible they are looking into moving PS2/PC/360 users onto their own servers so that they can enhance the PC version without restriction with the ultimate goal of having everyone move on from the PS2 in time. In either case the last thing they are thinking is kicking PS2 users, imho.

All I see from this thread is PS2 users complaining about how poor they are.

Be better at life and then maybe when you can afford a worthwhile computer you will see why playing FFXI on PC is the superior experience.

Again: If you're worried about paying $60-$120 for a new computer ($120 includes the monitor), then you have bigger problems to deal with. Stop being terrible at life.

EDIT: As a university student with absolutely no financial support from my parents, I have managed to study full-time, and work enough so that I can start paying my student loans while I am still in school, and still have the spare money to spend on things like an iPhone(which includes the $80 per month cellphone bill). You're obviously not trying hard enough.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Economizer

I already knew this is exactly what would be said. It was very predictable.

That's why I wrote my example exactly the way I did. I did not say new areas - which would be what an expansion gets too - but new spells, gear, and abilities. And heavens forbid that SE ever wants to add another job, weapon class, or anything that can be taken to older areas. New anything will have to be in the RAM/Hard drive of older systems for various reasons.

Although I suppose you could get around it by not letting PS2 users buy any of the gear, see and of the gear, or log in if they own the new expansion. Except that isn't a solution. Basically, we will eventually hit this wall.

I only state that we should plan ahead for this in a slow manner that gives plenty of advanced notice and warnings, of about 1-2 years, and that anyone who opposes this wants FFXI not to get things, which spells death for an MMO.

Again, even if SE announced the PS2 would be dropped, it will take a lot of time. Legacy users will have plenty of time to upgrade or drop the platform over a lengthy transition period. There is no need to fear a transition, and anyone who takes the time to understand what a successful transition would entail and still opposes it is someone who wants the consequences - eventual death for FFXI.

I say that anyone who understands those consequences and accepts them has no place here.

---

By my understanding, it's possible to set different .dat IDs for gear on different platforms. That's part of what having a different client for PC/X360 than for PS2 would allow to be done. Thus, PS2 can still handle new spells, abilities, gear, monsters by using old .dats where other clients would use new .dat files.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Eric

All I see from this thread is PS2 users complaining about how poor they are.

Be better at life and then maybe when you can afford a worthwhile computer you will see why playing FFXI on PC is the superior experience.

Again: If you're worried about paying $60-$120 for a new computer ($120 includes the monitor), then you have bigger problems to deal with. Stop being terrible at life.

EDIT: As a university student with absolutely no financial support from my parents, I have managed to study full-time, and work enough so that I can start paying my student loans while I am still in school, and still have the spare money to spend on things like an iPhone(which includes the $80 per month cellphone bill). You're obviously not trying hard enough.

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Because clearly anybody not doing as well as you are must be a terrible person who does not deserve to play FFXI.

Your total lack of empathy for your fellow players should be shocking, but is depressingly unsurprising.

Being an European, I've always felt the PS2 excuse was dragged over my head as "Why we can't have nice things". I really wonder however how much the engine would have been improved if they dropped the PS2 support. These days the PC version is running like an old car, you're afraid of it to break down every second. Accidentally launching other full screen applications crashes it, ctrl+alt+delete on win 7 and vista crashes it (use ctrl+shift+delete instead), changing from 32 bit colors to 16 crashes it, alt tabbing during full screen crashes it, looking at it crashes it and so on. If all of these issues could be solved by nuking the PS2 into oblivion I'm all for that really.

Eventually PS2s will stop reading your discs and the HDD will stop storing data. I've replaced several PC HDDs over the years either because of they break or they're just outdated. Consoles break down over time which is normal for any console unless its an Atari 2600 which is built for lasting centuries which is not the case for the PS2 as it has moving parts inside. From what I have read buying an old PS2 new plus all the items you need in order to play FFXI are as expensive as a new TV and a computer good enough to run FFXI with everything maxed out.

I'm gonna laugh if you fanatical PC-only people get your way and drive off all the PS2 players and the end result is FFXI no longer brings in enough money to justify keeping it up and running. FFXI dead at the hands of those who thought they were trying to save it from death.

Then I'll be sad because you killed FFXI for all of us.

Think on that.

Better for the game to die , then to live on in stagnation then.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Teraniku

Better for the game to die , then to live on in stagnation then.

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Okay, you go ahead and quit when they stop updating. I'm not done with FFXI until I've completed every level and merit of every job, finished every mission and quest, completed every side event, killed every NM, gotten every drop (even if I don't keep it), fully leveled every craft, acquired and fully upgraded every Artifact, Relic, Mythic, Empyrean and future strata of every armor and weapon and other item there is.

That's going to take a while. Even if they stopped updating FFXI today I probably wouldn't be done with it for at least five more years.



What? I don't have the time to devote to FFXI that I used to.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Volkai

Because clearly anybody not doing as well as you are must be a terrible person who does not deserve to play FFXI.

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Now you're getting a hang of it. I'm only thinking of my peers who would be better off trying to fix their lives instead of playing FFXI.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Volkai

I'm gonna laugh if you fanatical PC-only people get your way and drive off all the PS2 players and the end result is FFXI no longer brings in enough money to justify keeping it up and running. FFXI dead at the hands of those who thought they were trying to save it from death.

Then I'll be sad because you killed FFXI for all of us.

Think on that.

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Except the PS2 population isn't even as big as you think it is. Look at how few PS2 supporters there are here compared to PC users.

I really hope they put all the PS2 users on a Separate server and just cut support. That way they don't have to Axe them. They can just let them realize the mistake on their own.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Eric

Except the PS2 population isn't even as big as you think it is. Look at how few PS2 supporters there are here compared to PC users.

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But then again this is the English side speaking up we have no idea whats happening on the Japanese side

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Joslyn

But then again this is the English side speaking up we have no idea whats happening on the Japanese side

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Actually i had a lot of fun with google translator this morning and i checked the japanese forums on this site.

There doesn t seem to be a topic about the survey but there is one about the ps2/ps3 and guess what? almost all of them play on ps2.

Don t get me wrong they are also asking for a port of the game for the ps3, but atm s-e said they wouldn t port it

So i don t know where everybody got their numbers( like that guy who said 6ppl played on the ps2) but it doesn t look like the ps2 version is going anywhere.

I hope this will shut up condescending idiots like eric who assume not buying a pc equal being poor.

Heres the link
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...S2%E2%86%92PS3

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...BC%91%E3%82%92

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Taka-_-

Is interesting FF11, that incorporate any elements of the new content and over-capacity of the PS2 is a little lonely. Some also lonely face of the current graphics compare to the game again. FF11 is interesting because, rather than upgrade it with shaving shaving narrow lines, WS, magic, PC, NPC, in response to the new hardware will also continue to add new contents for renewed world graphic What should not. Also I think the PS2 user should respect, try to hear their views on what once ~ V and polling. Increase even if the content is also renewed ground, but high spec PC and transfer people to feel that the PS3 a lot.

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Except that this thread is talking about the exact same thing we're asking for. WE can't upgrade WS, graphics, magic, PC, and NPCs due to PS2. They want an upgrade for PC and a port to PS3.

EDIT: And yeah, if you can't buy a $60 PC, you're poor. There's no getting around that. It's a miracle that you were able to afford FFXI in the first place. The PS2 game and HDD cost ~$100 for quite a while, but now a $60 PC is too expensive?

Wow, if that's the case, then some of you have really let your lives go downhill.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Eric

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...BC%91%E3%82%92



Except that this thread is talking about the exact same thing we're asking for. WE can't upgrade WS, graphics, magic, PC, and NPCs due to PS2. They want an upgrade for PC and a port to PS3.

EDIT: And yeah, if you can't buy a $60 PC, you're poor. There's no getting around that. It's a miracle that you were able to afford FFXI in the first place, since the PS2 game and HDD cost ~$100 for quite a while, but now a $60 PC is too expensive?

Wow, if that's the case, then some of you have really let your lives go downhill.

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Im glad to see you can t make the difference between not wanting to spend 100$ on an outdated computer that will only run ff11(especially when your ps2 can play it fine) and being poor...i think you should go back to school because clearly you still have a lot to learn about life.

I make $100 if I work on a Saturday. I'm a college student. If you can't spare that much money, you're poor.

If you want to make the argument that you're being smart with your money, NEWS FLASH: You're spending at least $156 per year on FFXI. If you're playing this game, you have no right talking about how you don't want to "waste" money.

If anything, it would be a good investment. By buying a PC, you'd be able to play FFXI at higher settings with more options to do things like using the official windowed mode to surf the ffxi wiki when you need help with things. Not to mention, it won't break down nearly as easily as a PS2. If you ever play anything other than FFXI on your PS2, chances are that you are wearing down the (cheap) PS2 laser and eventually you'll start getting disk read errors. Never mind HDD issues which are also a problem.

By the way, here's another thread about JP players who are against PS2 limitations.
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/5796

Unlike other people here, I actually have evidence for my claims.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DSK

There are PS2 and one of the platforms that currently support
users have suffered many other platforms such as: the inconvenience it becomes a bottleneck. • New extended DISK No content of this new content system just by turning • Existing use of the content items out of the bag limit of 80 · inconvenience caused by the addition of the job or not - New Abilities • The number of rows and macro development, a new menu hierarchy No Continue Strengthening the rule of parallel icon display limitations of alliances and HP · MP · PT - Window design failure of the item name or description of the character limit · item description character limit what Daijina · PS2 • Development of capabilities not able to achieve 100% is limited because of the turning-use graphical existing equipment · turn to use a MAP existing MAP of the area - New lacking in freshness shape • The Monster Troy UI Mossari inconvenient · font dirty · still There, these are all the result of considering the PS2. I now I play on PS2 is bad, I feel there is a limit to update the other while considering the PS2. FF11 basic PC specs, if the average is now widely used you can play comfortably, is that our clients need to download. Capacity becomes a bottleneck if the development side, while using the system developed inconvenient FF11 old will have more substantial hardship, and "the current system difficult" and said the results only, as its user Not satisfied with the answer is negative chain of positive and does not benefit anyone. To improve existing content or create something new, a real improvement unless the fundamental lack of resources I think is impossible. (Specs of the PS2 at the same time of course) has raised the demand for even more development in the forum, I also need to revisit their environment if the user also has a variety of needs. The only hope their efforts on the development side is not fair. === stakeholders toward development: I have to go in and start the presentation of the benefits of migrating active relief campaign for the PS2 and user-think What I think ~ V. Feeling of hope is better FF11 even PC users can PS2 users is the same but has received the opinion of various current debate just us there is a limit , we sought the views from the development side . ■ ■ there are three questions a. such remedy or promotions associated with the transition to PS2 users will do the hardware available? 2. adding new areas such as new jobs and not turn to use the new content or extended time there? 3. What is the planned development of FF11 turning while the use of graphical content with existing systems and future long? For this matter, please answer us. Thank you. ===

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EDIT:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mariruru

The business also sell PC, now and would become affordable cheap too

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They're also suggesting that PCs are affordable and cheap.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Eric

I make $100 if I work on a Saturday. I'm a college student. If you can't spare that much money, you're poor.

If you want to make the argument that you're being smart with your money, NEWS FLASH: You're spending at least $156 per year on FFXI. If you're playing this game, you have no right talking about how you don't want to "waste" money.

If anything, it would be a good investment. By buying a PC, you'd be able to play FFXI at higher settings with more options to do things like using the official windowed mode to surf the ffxi wiki when you need help with things. Not to mention, it won't break down nearly as easily as a PS2. If you ever play anything other than FFXI on your PS2, chances are that you are wearing down the (cheap) PS2 laser and eventually you'll start getting disk read errors. Never mind HDD issues which are also a problem.

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See, you just assumed i don t own a pc where in fact i do. and no spending 100$ on an outdated machine just to play one game is not a good investment

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ash

See, you just assumed i don t own a pc where in fact i do. and no spending 100$ on an outdated machine just to play one game is not a good investment

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Feel free to ignore everything else i said, including the part where I said that you ALREADY invested $100 to play the game a few years ago, so you are either calling yourself stupid, or you are admitting that it is a worthwhile investment.

Feel free to also ignore the part where I proved that JP players also hate the PS2. After all, by doing so, you are making the conversation about how poor you are rather than whether or not people support the discontinuation of the PS2.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Eric

By the way, here's another thread about JP players who are against PS2 limitations.
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/5796

Unlike other people here, I actually have evidence for my claims.



EDIT:


They're also suggesting that PCs are affordable and cheap.

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Thats the very second post of your topic, for every japanese player bashing the ps2 i could post 1 that plays on it, we could go at it till we bore the crap out of this forum...


People what's PS2, I'll do I will still know the
Nde, the problem is related to the PC as well as in ranging PS2
FF11's just not a suitable PC, right thread I already built that has been almost no stock
The business is also selling the PC, and now they have become too cheap and affordable treatment should be terminated the shop Chau

Unfortunately, the continued long So I Do not FF11 will not go
It also also, I think it's because the PS3
Strange extreme + 構成Rashiku PS2 is not compatible PS3, the PS3 version of FF11 of making do and making it equal to the effort a new game,
Because it is a way to survive by loss of a pair of PS2
Since quite some number of games people play in the game a strange thought, that is compatible with the PS3 I can not help it Do not I already


Xbox360 version is a very bad reputation, not That I Do not run from the PC version can be ported to some extent lazy
Transplant itself was run by lazy, but because it has succeeded, what would we have felt like running on the emulator
It has a lot to handle heavier but ridiculously enough if that should work with original Xbox360
So if you cut corners out with a version of PS3, the following version of Xbox360, it can not be less than the product, probably


PS: the source of the PS3 version that 出Senai


bottom line is i posted a link who got 230ish replies your has 344

even if only 50% of the people who replied play on ps2 that is still a lot for a small sample of the population via 1 website

Yeah the thing you just posted is asking for a PS3 port bc the xbox port was lazy (which i agree on). Nobody wants PS2, they either want discontinuation or a PS3 port.

By the way, there is no link, no quote of who posted it, and really it's just a mess because you failed to highlight the important parts. Instead all we see is a bunch of JP google translate gibberish. Learn to post better.

LMAO at posting links to people complaining about the PS2 in Japanese as evidence that they should keep it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Eric

Yeah the thing you just posted is asking for a PS3 port bc the xbox port was lazy (which i agree on). Nobody wants PS2, they either want discontinuation or a PS3 port.

By the way, there is no link, no quote of who posted it, and really it's just a mess because you failed to highlight the important parts and instead all we see is a bunch of JP google translate gibberish. Learn to post better.\

---

Just curious how many of the post in the link you posted have you translated? Cuz don t get me wrong they want a ps3 port i ll give you that the thing is it doesn t exist yet and s-e has no plan to make one. So you cut ps2 tommorrow you also cutting ps3 players and that is a lot more people than you seem to imagine.

Oh and for the highlight thing im sorry im just a poor firefighter with no education unlike you who seem to know it all/

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FrankReynolds

LMAO at posting links to people complaining about the PS2 in Japanese as evidence that they should keep it.

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If you would read most of the post even if they hate it most of them play on ps2/ps3...

By the way, the post I linked to by DSK has 97 likes. SOOOO many JP players are against dropping PS2, aren't they?

The point that I'm trying to make here is simple. The argument that SE shouldn't drop PS2 support because the Japanese love the PS2 is total garbage. There are tons of valid reasons for why PS2 support should be dropped. This survey is an indication that SE has thought these same things.

By the way, from the same thread:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kenta

The PS2 is already broken, for me personally migrated to the PC is a great favor for a
career or how to convince the PS2 users, I'll have to take.

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EDIT: and more

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Forest

The PS2 is also proposed to terminate service basically I agree. The reason
　was revealed that the capacity problems of VU last HDD in ①. The limitations come in the near future Good luck cheating is cheating, because Square Enix desperate.
　That life itself came hard ② PS2.
　It may have become a stumbling block in the development of FF11

---

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ash

no education

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That explains it all.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Eric

By the way, the post I linked to by DSK has 97 likes. SOOOO many JP players are against dropping PS2, aren't they?

The point that I'm trying to make here is simple. The argument that SE shouldn't drop PS2 support because the Japanese love the PS2 is total garbage. There are tons of valid reasons for why PS2 support should be dropped. This survey is an indication that SE has thought these same things.

By the way, from the same thread:

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When did i say the loved the ps2? i said they played on it or ps3 and that there is way more that use those version than you might think.

Also you should stop with the condescending crap nobody thinks your cool or intelligent with your attitude.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ash

nobody thinks your cool or intelligent with your attitude.

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There seems to be a trend here. Mostly you speaking for entire groups of people. I'm not trying to seem cool or intelligent, BTW.

[Comment deleted by Moderator]