[dev1216] Weapon Skill Adjustments

Axe ws basically got nothing from the update. Best ws is still ruinator and it didn't even get the boost from alpha removal. Swd mostly just gained better CDC (basically it went from being a little worse than req to being a little better) but RUN can't use that and req didn't get a boost. Sanguine blade got boosted (indirectly only though as far as we know) so kinda nice if you are trying to be self sufficient.... but resolution got an insane buff so you'd really kill your dps not using gswd. Actually in general 1hd weapons gained very little from the ws update while in general 2hd gained a lot so the gap between using 2hd and 1hd increased a lot this update to the point where the answer will be use a 2hd weapon if you can. Which is odd because I thought they were wanting to close the gap between 2hd and 1hd instead of further widening them

Notable exceptions are realmrazer got a good boost while it doesn't look like Shattersoul got anything (though that hasn't been tested and the magical staff ws got a decent boost)... but lol mage weapons right?

You can find testing and new stats on the thread on bg wiki though it's still in progress.

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Originally Posted by dasva

Notable exceptions are realmrazer got a good boost while it doesn't look like Shattersoul got anything (though that hasn't been tested and the magical staff ws got a decent boost)... but lol mage weapons right?

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Cataclysm is pretty crazy now. Gotten over 9000 (totally not an intended pun) AoE on everything around on Geo with 3000 TP. <_< Still good for a solid 3kish AoE nuke WS at 1000 TP too. WS set not even optimized for it, I just use it in my low tier nuke setup.

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Originally Posted by dasva

Which is odd because I thought they were wanting to close the gap between 2hd and 1hd instead of further widening them

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The main thing to decrease the gap from what I can tell is that they allowed dual-wielders to get TP faster now.

And I think that most mythic/emp WS gained a bit for both 1H and 2H users, it's just unfortunate for RUN that they can't use any of them.

Problem is that 1H jobs already get TP so quickly that they are severely handicapped by WS delay. At capped haste my dancer would gain 40% DPS if WS delay was eliminated. SE's proposed changes to dual wield will result in another 1 TP per hit for me, pushing me up to almost 7/hit, and it only boosts my DPS by 4% because of WS delay. Have to understand that more than a third of my time at capped delay is spent frozen by WS delay. Adding more TP gain just makes the problem worse.

JA/WS Delay is what kills light DDs in general so far as I know. Heavy DDs don't suffer either as much. Post-cast delay hurts mages too though I understand why that's necessary in some form, otherwise the DPS on a BLM would be infinite.

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Originally Posted by Byrth

Problem is that 1H jobs already get TP so quickly that they are severely handicapped by WS delay. At capped haste my dancer would gain 40% DPS if WS delay was eliminated. SE's proposed changes to dual wield will result in another 1 TP per hit for me, pushing me up to almost 7/hit, and it only boosts my DPS by 4% because of WS delay. Have to understand that more than a third of my time at capped delay is spent frozen by WS delay. Adding more TP gain just makes the problem worse.

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So, do they basically need to just make 1-handed WS stronger in order for dual wielders to compete? Cause they seem to just be making us fall further and further behind.

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Originally Posted by Babekeke

The main thing to decrease the gap from what I can tell is that they allowed dual-wielders to get TP faster now.

And I think that most mythic/emp WS gained a bit for both 1H and 2H users, it's just unfortunate for RUN that they can't use any of them.

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True though a lot are still not really worth using lol. Don't feel bad for Run though. Resolution got a huge buff and was already a great ws and Dimidiation is pretty dang good too

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Originally Posted by Olor

So, do they basically need to just make 1-handed WS stronger in order for dual wielders to compete? Cause they seem to just be making us fall further and further behind.

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What they needed to do was give every 1H weapon a WS that is so good at 2000 or 3000 TP that it's worth saving TP for and not just spamming something else at 1000 TP, similar to Insurgency. This wouldn't eliminate WS delay, but it would increase the time between our WSs substantially (and thus reduce WS delay).

To give a taste of what this would take, Rudra's Storm is currently the best dagger WS that significantly scales with TP. For DPS using unstacked Rudra's Storm's (at 3000 TP) to pull even with spamming Evisceration (at 1000 TP) for my setup even including WS delay, it would need a 3000 TP fTP of 14.5 (it currently has 8.5). So yeah, imagine a world where 3000 TP Rudra's Storm does *another* 60% damage post-update. That's the world we'd need to go to.

Sounds like a missed opportunity. Maybe they'll revisit DW job's WSs again when they do the dedicated DW adjustments.

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Originally Posted by Byrth

What they needed to do was give every 1H weapon a WS that is so good at 2000 or 3000 TP that it's worth saving TP for and not just spamming something else at 1000 TP, similar to Insurgency. This wouldn't eliminate WS delay, but it would increase the time between our WSs substantially (and thus reduce WS delay).

To give a taste of what this would take, Rudra's Storm is currently the best dagger WS that significantly scales with TP. For DPS using unstacked Rudra's Storm's (at 3000 TP) to pull even with spamming Evisceration (at 1000 TP) for my setup even including WS delay, it would need a 3000 TP fTP of 14.5 (it currently has 8.5). So yeah, imagine a world where 3000 TP Rudra's Storm does *another* 60% damage post-update. That's the world we'd need to go to.

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For THF I assume it's worthwhile just waiting for SA/TA to be up again?