Newest interview (abyssea was a mistake?)

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Originally Posted by Kimble

And direct teleporting helps alleviate that problem.

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Yup anything to cut down meaningless nonsensical stupid time sink is greatly appreciate it in this game. When event is posted at a certain time, you expect most people to come on time, or at least the game helps alleviate the travel time needed to get there. Most "online" games nowadays are about fun and enjoyment, but a few odd games like Dark Souls and Demon Souls still give the old school players a hard and challenging game where dying over and over to overcome obstacles and hard challenge until you figure it out is deemed rewarding.

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Originally Posted by Kimble

So you're perfectly fine waiting around and not doing anything for an hour while everyone else gets there even though you were on time?

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If it takes that long i wont go with the people who take that long again.

You are very dense, lol.

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Originally Posted by Luvbunny

Yup anything to cut down meaningless nonsensical stupid time sink is greatly appreciate it in this game. When event is posted at a certain time, you expect most people to come on time, or at least the game helps alleviate the travel time needed to get there. Most "online" games nowadays are about fun and enjoyment, but a few odd games like Dark Souls and Demon Souls still give the old school players a hard and challenging game where dying over and over to overcome obstacles and hard challenge until you figure it out is deemed rewarding.

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Again, not a time sync.

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Originally Posted by Kimble

You are very dense, lol.

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I would say the same of you.

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Originally Posted by Natasha

I don't get anything from ffxi anymore cept maybe nostalgia... still enjoy it but if i hadnt have played it before abyssea and started after, I wouldnt be playing today.

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I have been playing since 2003 - I just shun out the endgame stuffs after seeing how much of a waste that is - plus I rather not try to "sweet talk" LS leaders to get my gears. It is a game, if I have to do this type of "social politics" I rather do it to advance my career, not for gaming - which is a waste of time. Hence abyssea is great, no more politics and BS, just grab a few friends, log in, and have fun. It renders big LS totally not needed and destroy that sense of accomplishment, not to mention deflate egos of a lot of LS leaders since they matter not, now everyone and 2 other people can get their gears and never have to "kiss ass" to get some helps or advance their "gaming career".

Hate to use a real life example but.

You would rather walk every where then take a car?

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Originally Posted by Natasha

If it takes that long i wont go with the people who take that long again.

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Unfortunately, unless you have control of 17 other peoples, you are completely dependent on them (for voidwatch anyway). The old school forced you to depend to other people, and sometimes that means having to tolerate some minor quirks and "know your place" to avoid dramas. The new ways let you just go at it with 2-3 other people, which is more easier to do unless you are a social pariah in the game. It gives you option of solo-duo (more time) or go with smaller group (faster and more efficient) or bigger group (safer but more prone to dramas).

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Originally Posted by Luvbunny

I have been playing since 2003 - I just shun out the endgame stuffs after seeing how much of a waste that is - plus I rather not try to "sweet talk" LS leaders to get my gears. It is a game, if I have to do this type of "social politics" I rather do it to advance my career, not for gaming - which is a waste of time. Hence abyssea is great, no more politics and BS, just grab a few friends, log in, and have fun. It renders big LS totally not needed and destroy that sense of accomplishment, not to mention deflate egos of a lot of LS leaders since they matter not, now everyone and 2 other people can get their gears and never have to "kiss ass" to get some helps or advance their "gaming career".

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Then it was the wrong game for you as thats what it was made to be. At some point people need to understand that some things are meant to be one way and other things are meant to be another. If ffxi maintains its 'new' mentality I'll need to accept that its not my type of game anymore. But the fact that people that HATE games like ffxi used to be, come into the game, and try to make it something else is ridiculous.

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Originally Posted by Kimble

Hate to use a real life example but.

You would rather walk every where then take a car?

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car is still travel, use a chocobo.

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Originally Posted by Luvbunny

Unfortunately, unless you have control of 17 other peoples, you are completely dependent on them (for voidwatch anyway). The old school forced you to depend to other people, and sometimes that means having to tolerate some minor quirks and "know your place" to avoid dramas. The new ways let you just go at it with 2-3 other people, which is more easier to do unless you are a social pariah in the game. It gives you option of solo-duo (more time) or go with smaller group (faster and more efficient) or bigger group (safer but more prone to dramas).

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Yes, and thats what separated good leaders from bad ones. You get a group together and keep people who refuse to act reasonably (reasonable being key, not suggesting elitism) out of the group.

Nah, that would be cheating because you wouldn't be taking in the adventure and enjoying it.

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Originally Posted by Kimble

Nah, that would be cheating because you wouldn't be taking in the adventure and enjoying it.

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Same adventure acutally, I observed many things from chocoback.

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Originally Posted by Natasha

Then it was the wrong game for you as thats what it was made to be. At some point people need to understand that some things are meant to be one way and other things are meant to be another. If ffxi maintains its 'new' mentality I'll need to accept that its not my type of game anymore. But the fact that people that HATE games like ffxi used to be, come into the game, and try to make it something else is ridiculous.

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Sadly this game probably not for you anymore, I have no control over what the developers will do lol. I think the developers just responded to what the general paying consumer wants, and made abyssea, which sold quite well, and it seems now they run out of ideas on how to make another blockbuster add ons. I am glad the game evolved for the better, and the developers (to some degree) willing to let go of the past and move forward to the future. Even if it means render the old content to be less of a challenge (and timesink) and make the game more accessible to a lot of players (which pose a problem of a lot of less skilled players). You can't always get everything, but I am happy with the compromise - FFXI is not quite WoW but at least have some quality of what made WoW more accessible and fun.

But they did open a big can of worm with Abyssea - now every single future add ons will be compared to Abyssea and if it does not live up to the same quality, people will not respond kindly. At the same time, it is good that Abyssea exists, it forces the developers to actually put some effort and "invest" in creating a better or on quality content if they want to keep paying customers happy. Maybe cut down the money pour into the trash that is FF14 and spend it more on 11? They now have no way of going back and have to move forward into the future - where fun, easy, accessible games rules (notice the rise of casual gaming on iphone and facebook). The problem is how to balance the casual and hardcore contents - but this is why we pay them monthly fees - SE needs to actually do some work and keep us happy and not completely ignoring customer's feedbacks.

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Originally Posted by Natasha

Same adventure acutally, I observed many things from chocoback.

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Is it just as exciting and fulfilling the 10,000th time?

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Originally Posted by Luvbunny

Sadly this game probably not for you anymore, I have no control over what the developers will do lol. I think the developers just responded to what the general paying consumer wants, and made abyssea, which sold quite well, and it seems now they run out of ideas on how to make another blockbuster add ons. I am glad the game evolved for the better, and the developers (to some degree) willing to let go of the past and move forward to the future. Even if it means render the old content to be less of a challenge (and timesink) and make the game more accessible to a lot of players (which pose a problem of a lot of less skilled players). You can't always get everything, but I am happy with the compromise - FFXI is not quite WoW but at least have some quality of what made WoW more accessible and fun.

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Except that this thread is about the developers feeling abyssea was a mistake.

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Originally Posted by Kimble

Is it just as exciting and fulfilling the 10,000th time?

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Do you have any idea how many times i've taken the mana clipper?

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Originally Posted by Kimble

So you honestly think the Producer creates the game, designs it, etc?

I think a lot of people really don't understand what a producer does.

He basically just makes sure shit is done on time and that people are on task and is a middle man better the game developers in the higher ups who pay to have the game made.

You can be in charge of people with out having hands on experience with what they are doing.

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Holy crap. I didn't say that either. WTF is wrong with you?

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Originally Posted by Natasha

Do you have any idea how many times i've taken the mana clipper?

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Well, in the end its simple then.

No one is stopping you from traveling the way you wish. Doesn't mean you should force your way on to others.

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Originally Posted by Kimble

Well, in the end its simple then.

No one is stopping you from traveling the way you wish. Doesn't mean you should force your way on to others.

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Thats the way the game was MADE. Is OTHERS who forced THEIR way on the game.

Well I think the developers are fing out of touch if they want this game to continue with that balance BS. Going back to the way things use to be would be placing the nails back in the coffin but hell its been a great run. They figured out how to give the game life again and now that XIV is finally playable lets just kill ffxi off for good that's what's gonna happen going back to the old endless grind...

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Originally Posted by Natasha

Except that this thread is about the developers feeling abyssea was a mistake.

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Yes, paying customers like me feel that Abyssea is not a mistake - it is the best thing that ever happened in the game, it is forward thinking, fun, enjoyable, accessible and worth every cent and time I put on in the game. I am looking forward for future content and hoping they can look back at Abyssea which is a great success (maybe not for developer) and learn a thing or two that can be implemented in future add ons. As a company you want to create blockbuster content that the majority of players want, even if it is at the expense of loosing what make the game unique (and harder and not as marketable) in the first place. Give customers what they want, sell a lot of add ons, make money and have big success so that the game is sustainable and they will keep making contents for years to come.

I am hoping Camate can forward this thread to the developers. They need to create more blockbuster contents that pleases the majority, even if it means watered down and easy as long as the fun factor is there. I just wish they can use the money to update and upgrade this game and not spend it for trash project like FF14.

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Originally Posted by Natasha

Thats the way the game was MADE. Is OTHERS who forced THEIR way on the game.

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Who is stopping you from traveling by foot and/or chocobo? lol

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Originally Posted by Kimble

Who is stopping you from traveling by foot and/or chocobo? lol

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Never said i couldn't just said that its a bad idea and goes against what the game was made to be.

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Originally Posted by Natasha

Never said i couldn't just said that its a bad idea and goes against what the game was made to be.

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Maybe by your standards. Sadly, you can't force your standards on others. sorry.

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Originally Posted by Luvbunny

Yes, paying customers like me feel that Abyssea is not a mistake - it is the best thing that ever happened in the game, it is forward thinking, fun, enjoyable, accessible and worth every cent and time I put on in the game. I am looking forward for future content and hoping they can look back at Abyssea which is a great success (maybe not for developer) and learn a thing or two that can be implemented in future add ons. As a company you want to create blockbuster content that the majority of players want, even if it is at the expense of loosing what make the game unique (and harder and not as marketable) in the first place. Give customers what they want, sell a lot of add ons, make money and have big success so that the game is sustainable and they will keep making contents for years to come.

I am hoping Camate can forward this thread to the developers. They need to create more blockbuster contents that pleases the majority, even if it means watered down and easy as long as the fun factor is there. I just wish they can use the money to update and upgrade this game and not spend it for trash project like FF14.

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FFXI was always and will always be a niche game... no matter how casual friendly it gets. These changes wont do much if anything to increase the staying power of 11.

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Originally Posted by Kimble

Maybe by your standards. Sadly, you can't force your standards on others. sorry.

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Already explained the problem with that statement. It was the others who brought about the change in the first place so if they can do it ? Not saying I can but your logic is flawed.

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Originally Posted by Natasha

Never said i couldn't just said that its a bad idea and goes against what the game was made to be.

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There are a lot of things that changed from what the game was made to be, because the players responded and reacted and tell the developers this is how they want it to be - like Ninja tank and how awesome Rdm used to be (which resulted in Rdm getting crap in the years after that). It is online "social" game that evolves because of the players participation - which dictates what the developers will do next (if they are smart that is). Just because you make the game, does not mean players have to take it as it is, unless it is offline game like FF13 (which got a lot of negative reaction for its linearity). If they want to keep paying subscribers, they have to react fast and evolve fast (which they did with forums and test servers) - move forward to the future and leave the past behind (no need to reminiscence how great the way things used to be - they are gone because the majority do not want them).

If they feel direct port is not what people want, you will not see it implemented in Sky, Sea, Outpost tele, ToAU, WoTG, Abyssea and Voidwatch. People WANT this and DEMAND this - hence they responded and gave us this. Atma and proc are popular, so they implement this on new dyna and voidwatch. To some extend the developer has no choice but to give us what we want, after all we are paying their bills.

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Originally Posted by Natasha

Already explained the problem with that statement. It was the others who brought about the change in the first place so if they can do it ? Not saying I can but your logic is flawed.

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Who are others? The people that create the game? They can do whatever they feel like doing.

How many worlds have been shutdown? If that's not the biggest clue to the fact the game needed the changes they made and so many players came back if they go back to the old ways basically the end is in sight and the subtle push to 14 will be completed. Looks like the only way to make 14 a success is make 11 unplayable again for most lol....

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Originally Posted by Luvbunny

There are a lot of things that changed from what the game was made to be, because the players responded and reacted and tell the developers this is how they want it to be - like Ninja tank and how awesome Rdm used to be (which resulted in Rdm getting crap in the years after that). It is online "social" game that evolves because of the players participation - which dictates what the developers will do next (if they are smart that is). Just because you make the game, does not mean players have to take it as it is, unless it is offline game like FF13 (which got a lot of negative reaction for its linearity). If they want to keep paying subscribers, they have to react fast and evolve fast (which they did with forums and test servers) - move forward to the future and leave the past behind (no need to reminiscence how great the way things used to be - they are gone because the majority do not want them).

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People loved it as it was, FFxi was very highly regarded despite its smaller player base before ffxi and was the 2nd highest income subscription based mmo for a number of years up to abyssea, which didnt change that. (right under wow).

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Originally Posted by Kimble

Who are others? The people that create the game? They can do whatever they feel like doing.

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The others would be people like you who like to complain that they have better things to do than waste time in a game. Which logically should suggest to them that they shouldnt be playing games in the first place then.

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Originally Posted by HimuraKenshyn

How many worlds have been shutdown? If that's not the biggest clue to the fact the game needed the changes they made and so many players came back if they go back to the old ways basically the end is in sight and the subtle push to 14 will be completed. Looks like the only way to make 14 a success is make 11 unplayable again for most lol....

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Take a look, worlds were shut down after abyssea... people came back to see what was changed and they didnt like it which lead them to quit again. Many of the players who quit before abyssea did so to start up on ffxiv and simply didnt return even with the unhappy events around that.

Um.. im pretty sure FFXI wasn't the 2nd highest.

Nothing says fun like standing around and doing nothing right?

Honestly, you are the only person ive ever met that has a problem with faster means of travel.

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Originally Posted by HimuraKenshyn

How many worlds have been shutdown? If that's not the biggest clue to the fact the game needed the changes they made and so many players came back if they go back to the old ways basically the end is in sight and the subtle push to 14 will be completed. Looks like the only way to make 14 a success is make 11 unplayable again for most lol....

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Let's hope it won't come to this. Though you can see a massive difference in the attitude from FF14 developer (Yoshi) and the FF11 (Tanaka now - again...). Do I wish that Yoshi is back and in charge of FF11? YES YES YES and many times YES!! This is a guy who understand what the consumers wants and have a good read of the new things and what works, and actually rather prompt in delivering BIG results and SUCCESS!! No wonder he is now put in charge to fix the mess that Tanaka did with FF14 - I would do the same if I were SE. If you read Yoshi regular newsletter, you feel a connection and confident in his abilities, a HUGE difference from the bits of interview from FFXI. It's like the team lead by Tanaka (again) now felt threatened by the success of Abyssea and trying to backtrack and dismiss it as failure and how unhappy they are. What a crap of BS!! Office politics more like it.

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Originally Posted by Kimble

Um.. im pretty sure FFXI wasn't the 2nd highest.

Nothing says fun like standing around and doing nothing right?

Honestly, you are the only person ive ever met that has a problem with faster means of travel.

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It was, I haven't seen the report since 2008 but if abyssea boosted numbers like you said it did then theres little reason for it to have changed.

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Originally Posted by Natasha

Take a look, worlds were shut down after abyssea... people came back to see what was changed and they didnt like it which lead them to quit again. Many of the players who quit before abyssea did so to start up on ffxiv and simply didnt return even with the unhappy events around that.

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A lot of people slowly started to quit FFXI around 2007-2008 when WOTG came out because WOTG added hardly any new end game content. The game got very stagnate and stale.

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Originally Posted by Natasha

It was, I haven't seen the report since 2008 but if abyssea boosted numbers like you said it did then theres little reason for it to have changed.

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Where did I say it boosted numbers? lol

Also.

http://www.brighthub.com/video-games...les/35992.aspx

FFXI was never second anything. Maybe if you completely ignored korean MMOs FFXI came in the Top 4 for awhile.

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Originally Posted by Kimble

Where did I say it boosted numbers? lol

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Sorry, wasnt speaking of you personally.. Im talking aobut those supporting abyssea, I see alot of 'it brought more people into the game'.

Edit: and like i said, last time i saw it, it was in 2008