NEO Nyzul 2.0

when you've got ls members flee boting around at 200% for 9months straight 24/7 with 0 jail time... yea SE's not really concerned with people 3rd party usage.

Wow did your parrents teach you to be proud of cheating at a kids game?

Do they know what you really do all day? Cheat people you never meet. Talk down to people you deem under you because you have the best cheats arround. Would they really be proud of you?

I would sure hope not.

In game radar, please stop killing me here

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Originally Posted by Monchat

he is right though whn he says cheats (well light cheats like windower) were created to compensate the DEV's lack of playing the game. lol yeah, 10 year and still 6 macro lines, every year we get hundreds of gear.. come on..

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^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

This is correct, Windower, and some things in or like it, have been made to fix SE's flaws in their game they will not do themselves. There is no reason not to give us more macro lines other than potential skilling up while afk, solvable via not actually giving us unlimited lines, 20 would work.

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Originally Posted by Gokku

Distance: Oh frogs charm @ 20yalms? thats cool se to bad a fucking yalms a made up term and you gave us no way of knowing it. yet again shit they should have added to the game day 1 if they are going to base gimics around it.

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Gokku is also correct in the fact of yalms. Do you want to tell me how the fuck you measure these? Can you eyeball the distance of yalms and say your 22.3 yalms from the mob? If to, I commend your attention to SE's system, at the same time, your lying out your ass more than likely.

They would have to get rid of to many players on the PC to get rid of people using windower. And PCs normally are the biggest MMO member supplier, because its where we have forums, we have to pay our billing, and its overall easier on us, let me just point this out though, you want PC people removed from you. Did you notice? They stopped making this game for anything EXCEPT the PC, also its only via digital download, they will not do this for Xbox either. What this means is if they did it, you would see almost no new players on your Xbox/PS2 servers you want. Soon as people leave, if they don't come back, your server just died a little more, and it wont get its life back.

Like it or not SE is lazy with this game when it comes to playing it. They do not care we want more macro spots and that they can do it they just make new content. I'm happy with this, if people using windower get this to help them, cool, less time on SE and more time on my new content. You said how hard is it to hit 2 macros. Being your on a console I don't expect you to know but from what I have ever seen with my PC, my Xbox is much easier to hit macros fast. PC I have to wait about a second for it to pop up my macros, then hit the button, after I do this though I have a problem, they take about 3 seconds before they will pop up, if I need 3 macros your talking about 10 seconds... no. My 360 gets that same 3 macros hit in 3-4 seconds at most because you can hit the trigger after hitting your macro and it pops up instantly.

You want to blame the PC players because you are not one, thats about as easy as I can say it, blame a different group because 1 did something in them so everyone must pay. If you don't like that people use windower, then bitch to SE to get off their ass and fix a 10 year old problem they have had no reason not to. I myself have never seen a use for Windower, because in the only time I have looked at it, it has many useless things to it that might be cheating in some form. Only thing I want from windower is macros. Call it an easy button if you want, but your wrong, its simply a user patch to a flawed game people cant get them to fix.

no i did it to show all the "drop console" players how stupid they sound. You did that nicely thanks.

You call things flaws then complain to SE about it. You have no right to change the rules as you see fit. That is called cheating. You might as well plug in your game genie while you are at it cauz where will a cheater really draw the line. You lack the morles to know right from wrong and I dont have 18 years to teach you where your parrents failed you.

You know using information outside the game is cheating right


Not to mention for there has been at least one contest you had to actively break the ToS to even enter the contest so it's pretty clear SE does not care.

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Originally Posted by Gokku

when you've got ls members flee boting around at 200% for 9months straight 24/7 with 0 jail time... yea SE's not really concerned with people 3rd party usage.

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I remember, this one time, when people were duping salvage drops and there was a whole bunch of people on some forum saying that SE would never be able to catch all the dupers and even if they could, SE would never ban them because it was their mistake for having shitty code and it would destroy the game; then one day, a whole bunch of people got banned. A lot of laughs were had and one guy looked such a moron that he never showed showed his face under that name again. Good times.

Coming on to SE's forums and saying crap like that is just stupid. If people complain a lot, you can bet that someone will start looking in to it. And given their history with banning fishers and gardeners en masse and with little due process, i wouldn't hope for any kind of reasonable response on an issue like this when it happens.

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Originally Posted by Demon6324236

You said how hard is it to hit 2 macros. Being your on a console I don't expect you to know but from what I have ever seen with my PC, my Xbox is much easier to hit macros fast. PC I have to wait about a second for it to pop up my macros, then hit the button, after I do this though I have a problem, they take about 3 seconds before they will pop up, if I need 3 macros your talking about 10 seconds... no. My 360 gets that same 3 macros hit in 3-4 seconds at most because you can hit the trigger after hitting your macro and it pops up instantly.

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They actually did reduce the time for the palette to show up, but it brought up certain issues so I imagine it's put on hold fer now, if not discarded completely.

On another note, last time I checked, you can actually activate a macro without waiting for the palette to become visible. Sometimes they do not work even if they're visible, though, but that's a different matter altogether!

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Originally Posted by user201108211515

no i did it to show all the "drop console" players how stupid they sound. You did that nicely thanks.

You call things flaws then complain to SE about it. You have no right to change the rules as you see fit. That is called cheating. You might as well plug in your game genie while you are at it cauz where will a cheater really draw the line. You lack the morles to know right from wrong and I dont have 18 years to teach you where your parrents failed you.

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Actually no, see PC gamers could lose consoles and we would lose players, but we also have the only form of the game that is still able to be purchased, meaning our community wouldn't rot and die nearly as much because we can get new players. Consoles would because there is no ability for new players. Your ideals that cheating is anything and everything that is a 3rd party tool, is wrong, simple. If a company stops doing something for a game and people mod the game in a way that betters it, then the mod is not cheating, its infact fixing or adding to the game in question. Example, Star Wars:Empire at War. This game is never going to be touched by its makers, it has nothing coming to it, however people mod it and add content and fixes alot. Why is this the same? Because, SE has left us 10 years with this broken setup and they never fix it. So fans did what fans do, rather than watch a game we all love suffer because of this problem, we rise up, and we fixed it. Over these years all they have had to do is integrate some of what Windower has, and they would have been fine, you want to look for cheaters, look at people cheating via dat mods for lamps/NMs/Claim bots/flee shit. Windower is not your main problem your going to have, trust me.

people swore up n down that salvage duping was in the game for a reason and this is how SE wanted us to do it thats why the drop rates were so bad. Lots of lols later we saw how that turned out.

Who is willing to bet it wont happen again to NNI cheaters.

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Originally Posted by user201108211515

people swore up n down that salvage duping was in the game for a reason and this is how SE wanted us to do it thats why the drop rates were so bad. Lots of lols later we saw how that turned out.

Who is willing to bet it wont happen again to NNI cheaters.

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I'm sure it will, because they are cheating. My question is, after they ban this group, how many people will there be left who can do this content without it being a waste? And better yet, will this small number make SE reevaluate their ideas about this, or will they be ignorant as normal?

did you once in 10 years complain to SE about the problems you have? Or instead you took matters into your own hands. I'm sure it starts with windower. But consider it a gate way drug to cheating.

Deny it all you want but it is console players that keep this game alive. We are the one farming for the items you buy with exploited gil. With out us you would have to go farm things your self. Sure hope you can find a bot for that. Else you might quit the game cauz farming is hard.. Wonder if SE knows farming is hard. May be they will change it for you easy mode players and items you need will just be delivered via mog house.

get real man. You are only fooln your self. Breaking the rules is cheating no matter what excuses you have. You want things to change for the better how about being part of the soloution not adding to the problem.

Were here to complain about how the game is broken. You would prefer we take matters into our own hands and just cheat?

Its not ps2/3 or xbox players that cant play by the rules.

The best part about this is how so many people cried about how aby was sooo easy and the game is a joke now. So SE makes something hard and people just cheat it. They would cheat leigon too but is no where for them to speed hack away to.

Ahahaha, don't even begin to, ahaha, you think far too highly of yourself.

Think you got who is fooling themselves mixed up

sorry I have self respect. Guess you wouldnt understand.

It's okay, you clearly have no clue how people are making gil or gathering items in this game either.

clearly cauz you know everything. Or bothered to read any of this post before trolling.

Choco blinkers and fish bots is how "exploiters" are geting gil.

Guess you havent noticed the inflation. clearly have no clue how people are making gil or gathering items in this game either.

Voidwatch must be cheating too then, you get exp and cruor per fight
So is abyssea since that's where nearly everything gives you some form of cruor and you can burn it then turn it into gil

trolln on 1 liners isnt really proving your point.

Neither is trolling on level 1 mules

what difference does it make? I need to show off my gear to have my point be valid? Your troll attempt isnt very good.

What does NEO Nyzul 2.0 mean even.

New Nyzul the second?
Should it be NEO Nyzul 1.0?

This NEO-fad that has been going on (since the Dynamis changes?) is annoying me almost as much as calling monsters MOBs!

What were we talking about again?
Oh right, nothing!

Wait what? I think it was about the Nyzul Isle Uncharted Regions being planned in a poor, wrong, altogether messed up fashion, no?

For discussion about cheating this is not (methinks?), and it probably is borderline a violation of them so called guide-lines of the forum so...

(Yeah, I know that's funny.)

You're the one claiming I'm trolling, I just had to laugh at you thinking console players are holding up anything but updates.

Inflation, Neo Nyzul none of those affect anyone at level 1, hiding behind a mule is purely so you can troll

Then you have the gall to say I have no self respect while hiding behind a level 1 mule, hyprocrite much?

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Originally Posted by user201108211515

did you once in 10 years complain to SE about the problems you have? Or instead you took matters into your own hands. I'm sure it starts with windower. But consider it a gate way drug to cheating.

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There have been many times people have complained about 6 lines for a macro only. Seeing how far it has got us by now I have no reason to complain anymore, I feel like a lil kid yelling through the house I want more than the 6 legos I got. My parents don't give a damn I need more legos to actually build something, either I deal with it or I find a way of getting more outside of my parents because my parents are to busy with their soap opera to bother getting me more of them.

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Deny it all you want but it is console players that keep this game alive. We are the one farming for the items you buy with exploited gil. With out us you would have to go farm things your self. Sure hope you can find a bot for that. Else you might quit the game cauz farming is hard.. Wonder if SE knows farming is hard. May be they will change it for you easy mode players and items you need will just be delivered via mog house.

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I am quite sure console players make up a good portion of the game, I am also sure that a PC only game of FFXI would sustain itself better than a PS2/Xbox community would, not because PC people are awesome, like I said, PC can be bought still and thus has new players. I have been trying to get a friend of mine on this game for a long time, he has a bad PC that couldn't run the game so he needs it for 360, but outside of Amazon wanting $200+ for it we have had no real luck. If you can tell me where you would find it not only would it help me but I will retract the idea that PC can sustain an influx of new players better than either PS2 or Xbox can.

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get real man. You are only fooln your self. Breaking the rules is cheating no matter what excuses you have. You want things to change for the better how about being part of the soloution not adding to the problem.

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Then tell me, how long must a player wait for his/her game to be fixed by its creators before taking matters into their own hands. It is not hard to see where this game is broken or where they let us fix it ourselves, even in some cases doing so just to help themselves as well. A case of this would be inventory, I think they could probably fix the fact we run out, however they make money off of mules people make and transfer items, now they make money and we have more room. If they fixed this, we would still have more room but they don't get the extra $ for us paying to have more space, which we already do/did with their satchel.

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Were here to complain about how the game is broken. You would prefer we take matters into our own hands and just cheat?

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No, I don't want to cheat, I want to fix the game, I have no problems telling people where they are wrong. SE is wrong with VW drop, they are wrong for relying on luck for NNI as well. If it were possible yes, I would say "cheat" and give someone a Mekira body & their belt after their 100th Kaggen, you know why? Some people get it their 1st kill, now tell me how thats not broken. If this teaches you a lesson for life its "Try and try again, but sometimes life just fucks you in the ass while others get shit the easy way with no effort :D" not how it should be. If you agree with this you are wrong. Simple and true, its like saying people born into a rich family should have to do nothing, they are above you, while everyone else who has to work for things but make it no where are being treated fairly. Not true, its because the world is broken, cant fix the world, can fix a game, so no reason why we shouldn't.

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Its not ps2/3 or xbox players that cant play by the rules.

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Yep and they cant break them, give those same players the power to cheat and watch how long they play without windower once they look at it and see it makes things they way it should be. When you have the power to do something your much more tempted to. In other words, you follow the rules yes, but you also have no choice, you cant break them, so its an unfair role to play.

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The best part about this is how so many people cried about how aby was sooo easy and the game is a joke now. So SE makes something hard and people just cheat it. They would cheat leigon too but is no where for them to speed hack away to.

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I agree, people did this because they were to laid back by Abyssea, it made them forget how hard shit can be, but the thing is, its luck, luck should never be the idea where you place all your content, where lucky=win unlucky=failure. Effort=Reward & Laziness=Nothingness, thats how it should be, work should be rewarded while doing nothing will get you nothing. If Gokku in fact has done all these things he said in only 2 months he shows to a point that ideal still exists, I however think its more a matter of extreme luck if someone were able to get all of that as well. Because no matter of skill offsets VW, and only so much time can be saved in NNI, luck will always play a factor. I do not want luck entirely removed, it is a fundamental idea of what RPGs have, but the massive amount of luck needed for the content is outrageous. For this reason, I will say if I did 30 runs back to back of NNI where my group is doing 15 floors a run legit and we fail at floor 80 every time because of bad jumps... your damn right, Ill cheat at that point, because if I'm doing what people say needs done to win, and is mathematically correct, but luck is whats stopping me, at that point the game goes from being fair, to being full of shit.

Yea I'm level 1 lol. Why would you argue with me then if that is what you think lol.

Been playn for 8+ years and still only LV 1 lol

Like the guy said, stay on topic.

Were talkn about NNI and how the only people to get floor 100 cheated or leeched of people cheating.

lol yea and instead of being a good little boy you decided to steal some legos. Thats kind of a bratty move.

Just because we complain about it wont mean SE will change it. 6 line macros is not ruining the game to an extent that you have to use spell cast or else you cant play the game. The game works just fine as is in reguards to macros. That you have issues hiting 2 macros to do things and have to use a 3rd pt tool to make the game easier for you.. is your problem. You wana cheat.. cant stop you but I sure can complain about people that cheat. If you happen to be in that boat. sorry. IDC what your excuses are. You are breaking the rules. You dont like the rules of the game then dont play. But cheating and then lookn at me ugly cauz I say it causes problems. Thats just your issues with reality.

I agree too its anoying to have a luck event like this but cheating the rules wont make it better. You have to do what were doing now.. complaining. Attacking me a LV 1 noob wont make the content any easier.

The fact that people have to hack to win should say it all to SE. But we are still waiting for a fix. So we have to continue to complain.. our options are to be part of the problem or part of the soloution? Or rather... risk it and break the rules and hope no ban hammer falls.

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Originally Posted by user201108211515

Yea I'm level 1 lol. Why would you argue with me then if that is what you think lol.

Been playn for 8+ years and still only LV 1 lol

Like the guy said, stay on topic.

Were talkn about NNI and how the only people to get floor 100 cheated or leeched of people cheating.

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No, you misunderstand, we were talking about how NNI is unfair and unbalanced, not how everyone cheats & leeches to win. But that it is unbalanced for that reason. We went off topic when we went to the idea of everyone cheating to win and that being the only way and it only went on from there.

My opinion on this topic is that we are basically going to have to wait till SE bans the cheaters, if they ban all cheaters at some point, then we will be able to watch as nearly no one has the gear from it, and that will be either good, or bad. And then SE will either leave it, or fix it, I'm hoping the fix it idea, but we know SE, fixing isn't something they do well, they are like a plummer who comes out to fix your pipes, but while they are fixing them they cause 3 more leaks they don't notice, and your calling em back out the next day, and again, because they are the only plummer in the next 100 miles.

pretty sure thats what I said but ok.. What you said instead. The game will be just fine after the ban hammer falls. People said it would be the death of FF when salvage bans hit. we are still here. Pretty sure we will survive just fine with out them. And odds are no one will even remember them when they are gone.

Salvage is much easier now btw VS when it 1st came out so odds are NNI will get easier too after they ban people.

SE likes to do that.. its like a double insult to injury. If people would have just waited they would have had a fair chance.

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Originally Posted by user201108211515

lol yea and instead of being a good little boy you decided to steal some legos. Thats kind of a bratty move.

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Well not a perfect example, point was you cant do much you should be able to with 6...

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Just because we complain about it wont mean SE will change it. 6 line macros is not ruining the game to an extent that you have to use spell cast or else you cant play the game. The game works just fine as is in reguards to macros. That you have issues hiting 2 macros to do things and have to use a 3rd pt tool to make the game easier for you.. is your problem. You wana cheat.. cant stop you but I sure can complain about people that cheat. If you happen to be in that boat. sorry. IDC what your excuses are. You are breaking the rules. You dont like the rules of the game then dont play. But cheating and then lookn at me ugly cauz I say it causes problems. Thats just your issues with reality.

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Like I said, tell me how long it is a maker of a game can leave something broken before the players are allowed to fix the game. If the players truly care about the game they will try to fix or improve it with or without the makers because we want the game to be better, we dont want to leave it for another game because of its simple minor flaws. I love this game, I play this game everyday, I know many people on it and talk to alot of them every day. I have no intent to leave it, but I am also not the kind of person that deals with broken things. If its broke fix it, but SE isnt, thats my problem with them and why I think Windower works. And I dont think Windower is cheating, its 3rd party which is against the rules, yes, but its also an improvement that fans of this game have asked and begged for, for a long time, and without any help from them fans will do what must be done to improve the game.

Edit:Example of this is I'm 100% sure there will be a mod for ME3 someday (if it allows for mods, not sure, never saw all to many for ME2 like we did with KotOR or DA:O) to fix the ending, people have raged up and down at that ending, and people want it changed, Bioware says they will fix it, if they don't, I am 100% sure that fans will do what they can to take it into their own hands and do what the makers were unable to do, which was satisfy the player base.

Side note: I know I keep talking about other companys and their games but they are what mostly comes to mind as my examples. Like with now, not fixing their game, I think fans will do it themselves if possible, in FFXI it was possible, and thus, it was done.

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I agree too its anoying to have a luck event like this but cheating the rules wont make it better. You have to do what were doing now.. complaining. Attacking me a LV 1 noob wont make the content any easier.

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I dont care what level you are or who you are, that matters to me about as much as who you are in real life, you could be a dev for all I care, Ill tell you all the same, we are complaining, and we have been complaining, and we are getting nothing done by complaining, because this company does not care to change its ideas around its customers, they are doing the wrong thing, but this doesnt matter to them.

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The fact that people have to hack to win should say it all to SE. But we are still waiting for a fix. So we have to continue to complain.. our options are to be part of the problem or part of the soloution? Or rather... risk it and break the rules and hope no ban hammer falls.

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This is partially correct, it should say it all to SE, but it apparently doesn't. And were not waiting for a fix, because they came here and told us were not getting one, we continue to complain and seem to be making no ground. As for our options, you make it sound as if cheating is helping the solution because it shows them its that damn bad, we are cheating just to beat it. However I know your saying cheating is the wrong thing, I understand your point of view on this and I agree with everything NNI related.

I will not however say at any time I think Windower is cheating the way I have ever used it. By this I mean I removed every single app on the thing. I use it for either 1, running scripts as macros thus I am not limited to only the 6 lines, I can use 16 line macros to change my entire set of gear in 1 press, as it should be. If you saw my old way it was a mess, my RDM macros alone, I had 1 row, TP/WS/TP/Enhancing/TP/Enfeebling/TP/Healing/TP/Nuking. I had all these copys of TP macros because I needed to have 5 of them, 1 for every set I changed to it from, because they all had different pieces I had to change, this was a mess and I will never think the game should be run like that, its messy, crazy, and generally not how a company working on its 10 year old MMO should operate, they should be better than this by now. My 2nd reason is I play my gfs character as well when needed. Now I only have 1 copy of this game for Xbox, so I can have my 2nd account on there, but my gf I couldn't get on and play all 3 at the same time. Now my problem with this is Windower very easily allows you to open more than 1 FFXI window, which the original FFXI will not let you do. Thats the only 2 reasons why Windower isn't cheating, if you use all its apps, yes, by all means I will call it cheating. Afk skilluping is cheating. Knowing where NMs will pop before they do is cheating. But giving us more macro spots, no, I think that is perfectly fair game.

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Originally Posted by user201108211515

pretty sure thats what I said but ok.. What you said instead. The game will be just fine after the ban hammer falls. People said it would be the death of FF when salvage bans hit. we are still here. Pretty sure we will survive just fine with out them. And odds are no one will even remember them when they are gone.

Salvage is much easier now btw VS when it 1st came out so odds are NNI will get easier too after they ban people.

SE likes to do that.. its like a double insult to injury. If people would have just waited they would have had a fair chance.

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True but part of why its easier now is we are 24 levels higher, not sure if you just meant it got easier at 75 after they were banned, I wouldn't know, never paid much attention because I was never into end game content at that point.

really not about to read all that nonsence when you still dont understand that no ammount of time is enough to say you have the right to change the rules.

You do not have the right to change the rules just because you dont like them.

The game is not broken just cauz you say it is.

The game does not need you to fix it.

The game does not need 3rd pt tools to work properly.

The lies you tell your self. Leading you to beleive you are not doing wrong.. again.. your problem.

You dont like the rules. Go find a game that you do like the rules. Play that game.

Having a million excuses about it wont make you any less of a cheater.

Wow, did this thread get derailed.. it's beautiful.

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Originally Posted by user201108211515

lol he says he wont troll n the very next line he calls me an idot. priceless lol

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Insulting is not trolling, and his insult was quite fitting.

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Originally Posted by user201108211515

Justify it all you want. But in "reality" not following the rules is by default cheating.

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No justification needed, using Windower is definitely cheating and no one's arguing that. But cheating isn't necessarily bad. There's a clear difference between (most of) the plugins Windower offers and flee/pos hacks or bots. Pretty much everything Windower has should have been in the game from day one. Without Windower most people wouldn't consider the game worth playing at all. And don't tell me that it is, because that is clearly your opinion, and you've shown everyone that your judgment cannot be trusted.

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Originally Posted by user201108211515

its funny though. You say you "out preform others" when in reality it is a program that plays the game for you that is so awesome.

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This is yet another line that proves you have no clue what you're talking about. Windower does not do anything at all for you. It is not a bot and doesn't allow botting (unless used by very skilled people, and still only in a very limited way using timers, similar to the <wait> feature in macro lines). Windower is basically just a better user interface.

It's funny you're arguing about not knowing right from wrong but insist on following the rules blindly. A few hundred years ago slavery was legal. Does that make it right? As long as it's not illegal, you'd beat your wife? Is that your line of reasoning? If that's what your parents taught you, shame on them and shame of you for being so gullible to believe the bullshit they were feeding you.

Using Windower is neither good nor bad. There are people who use it who don't cheat at all, no plugins, just the ability to fix the game crash or prettier graphics. Are they bad? A tool doesn't make anyone bad, only how they use it. And Windower severely limits someone's ability to automate the game, even with AutoExec and SpellCast. The Windower team is actually quite vigilant about that, which is also why they don't tolerate any flee/pos hacks or similar programs. It all depends on where you draw the line. You obviously think everyone possessing a knife is a murderer, even if they use it for cooking. And if you feel comfortable with that line of thinking, good for you. But don't go telling others what right or wrong is, because you obviously don't have a hint of a clue on the subject.

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Originally Posted by user201108211515

Been playn for 8+ years and still only LV 1 lol

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Judging by the intelligence of your posts it wouldn't surprise me.

"Pretty much everything Windower has should have been in the game from day one."

Says who? you? I didnt realise you were the game creator.

"A few hundred years ago slavery was legal. Does that make it right? As long as it's not illegal"

And look people complained and things were changed for the better. People didnt get a bot to make black people white and the problem was solved that way.. Do you think before you speak?

Another bad troll attempt from someone that thinks they have the best excuse for the use of cheats.

Nothing you can say will make the use of 3rd pt tools anything less then cheating. It is aginst the rules.

If you dont like the rules. Dont play or complain untill the rules are changed. But cheating and then acting like I'm the problem. You have reality issues as well.

You dont make the rules.

"Judging by the intelligence of your posts it wouldn't surprise me. "

I have to explain right n wrong to you yet you think you can question im intelligence. GL with that. You are more likely to wake up tomorrow with the skill to play this game with out cheating.

3rd pt tool users are a joke. You play on easy mode. You lack the skill to play the game by the rules.
Be mad about the truth, I'm sure it hurts. Make excuses all you want. It wont change anything.

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Originally Posted by user201108211515

"Pretty much everything Windower has should have been in the game from day one."

Says who? you? I didnt realise you were the game creator.

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Says the gaming standards across the board. Every game features most of these features now, and almost every game featured them back when FFXI was released.

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Originally Posted by user201108211515

"A few hundred years ago slavery was legal. Does that make it right? As long as it's not illegal"

And look people complained and things were changed for the better. People didnt get a bot to make black people white and the problem was solved that way.. Do you think before you speak?

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Do you read before you reply? We are complaining. Or didn't you get what this entire thread was about? Also, the bot analogy is off, breaking the rules in that scenario would have been to integrate different races in social groupings.

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Originally Posted by user201108211515

Another bad troll attempt from someone that thinks they have the best excuse for the use of cheats.

Nothing you can say will make the use of 3rd pt tools anything less then cheating. It is aginst the rules.

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Again, do you read before you reply? I stated bluntly that Windower is cheating and that no one is arguing otherwise. I'm not and I never was. I'm saying that cheating isn't necessarily bad. There are different stages of cheating. There are cheats of convenience, cheats for your own profit and lastly cheats at the expense of others. Windower falls into the first two categories. There is no flee/claim botting possible with Windower, so no one else suffers from other people using it. The fact that you're upset about it is evidence that the only thing hurting in your context is your ego.

Wow... i don't even... i mean... what? how's this for you, i've played on console up untill the last year and am among the few people who even understands how to fully utilize the /macro set command to legally "expand" gear swap macros (or macros in general)

I recently made a switch to windower, mostly for the improved graphics and the ability to KNOW how far i am from mobs, even without windower macros i can (and with some jobs i still do) swap out 15 pieces of gear in seconds (triple tapping the same macro chaining via /macro set x) but honestly this process was cumbersome, and if i made errors it could lower my efficiency, only thing windower macros do for me is eliminate that potential of error.

Also you have no pride in your own character if you can't post as yourself, i care not to hide, i take responsibility and ownership of my opinion, as such the character you see posting is who i play as, you on the other hand dare to mask yourself while demeaning others for lacking that which you are most devoid of.

Finish graduating high school before you come onto a forum and hormone rage at everyone else.

As if it would make you feel better to know all the gear I have. I dont need to show off to win an arguement about what I know is right. But do feel free to use that over and over as a way to make your self feel better.

I get it i really do people are tryn to say that cheating isnt so black and white. that some how you all are special and live in some grey area where rules and morles dont apply to you. some could say.. no where in reality.. but online where its ok to act like a scum bag and cheat at a kids game with out fear of bad karma.

And a special shout out to the grammar police. Gotta love em. when they cant win the arguement.. time to nip pick your spelling. That will prove how you are right and I'm so wrong. As if everyone on the planet has english as a main language.

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Originally Posted by Arcon

I'm saying that cheating isn't necessarily bad. There are different stages of cheating. There are cheats of convenience, cheats for your own profit and lastly cheats at the expense of others.

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Your posts usually are such that could be mine, but with this part I do disagree. While I probably understand your point and your view, it's not how it works. SqEX determines what is good and what is bad, more and less loosely in the User Agreement and Terms of Service.

Sure, there are levels to it, like, modifying the files of the game, or using something that simply 'parses' the data the game already provides. It's not about which is more bad than the other, it's just not allowed and that is it.

SqEX is more at fault than any player here though, really...


Just my thoughts~

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Originally Posted by user201108211515

I get it i really do people are tryn to say that cheating isnt so black and white. that some how you all are special and live in some grey area where rules and morles dont apply to you.

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Funny that you mentioned grey areas, as I used that in my initial reply here, but I accidentally closed that tab so blubb...

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Originally Posted by user201108211515

3rd pt tool users are a joke. You play on easy mode. You lack the skill to play the game by the rules.

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Your right, I'm a shitty player, I suck at FFXI because I think instead of having to hit 2~3 macros to do something, I want to be able to only hit 1 macro. I show that I have so little skill in playing this game because of this. Technology does not prevent them from from making it only 1 macro, as fans, with our lesser knowledge, have been able to do just that... But ok, I'm done fighting with you, I play on both the 360 & PC, I know and understand what you have with the consoles, and what your missing, you don't it seems because you think Windower is bad. If next update they said they were giving us 16 rows a macro, you would shutup and be happy. We make due with what we have, simple as that, don't like it, goto PC and do the same. I don't care what you say, you can not call someones "skill" into question because they don't want to waste time hitting more buttons for a game to do the same thing. You play inefficiently, I cant blame you, your on a console, its how they are built, but you cant say people suck because they want to play the game in a way that works better just because the devs choose not to change it.

Let me give you one last parting gift as an example of their ignorance to change things though, this is a post I made in the Tanking area, in a thread about fixing tanking for PLD.

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Originally Posted by Unleashhell

SE will not adjust enmity caps and they have already said they have no plans to adjust that.

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End of the thread is here, because this means SE already said...

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Originally Posted by SE

PLD is a job we no longer care to have used in content we create, as such, your enmity is fucked up, and shall remain as such. We are sorry to all PLDs out there who disagree with this, but we just don't care about your job anymore, or any idea of tanking, we would rather everything be a bunch of zergs and weakness procing. That is all.

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So there you have it people, PLD is screwed, its use has been lived out and shall not be brought back due to SE not wanting to change their amazing Enmity system/cap that was flawed since we got our level cap higher than 75...

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As it was said before, Enmity has been broken a long time, so tell me, why is it they are so ignorant they can not bother to change a flawed system that has no use anymore? It has made tanking die completely in this game. The reason is simple, SE does not want to fix their problems, they will give us new things, and they will leave us with the old problems. I would love to watch your attempt to tell me we fans have no right to say SE is wrong, and the Enmity system is fine how it is, just because of the stupidity needed to make that claim.

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Originally Posted by Dragoy

Your posts usually are such that could be mine, but with this part I do disagree. While I probably understand your point and your view, it's not how it works. SqEX determines what is good and what is bad, more and less loosely in the User Agreement and Terms of Service.

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And I disagree with this. SE determines what's allowed and what isn't, but that bears no implication on what's right or wrong (or good or bad). That would imply that rules are perfect, but they very rarely are. Rules are designed for a reason, and people usually like to assume that it's for a good cause. However, the rules were set up by normal humans. Whoever thought of it at SE headquarters wasn't infallible. Third party tools are banned, but why? Why do other games allow them freely? SE thinks it's a good way to prevent botting/hacking, but nothing could be further from the truth. Hacks and bots have a much easier timer working around the rules and restrictions than normal humans have, hence it's just making it easier for the people abusing such exploits, while regular players suffer.

The real way to approach this would be to address the actual problems, not the means people employ to exploit them. One very right thing they did was randomize the claim timer on spawn. While that alone was not enough to stop the botting, it made it a lot harder for most of them (even rendered some of them ineffective), while giving casual players a fighting chance.

Similar to this, they shouldn't flat out ban third party applications when trying to get rid of flee/pos hacks. There's some semi-easy way to find out if someone is hacking positions or increase their movement speed that they could employ in most cases. Instead they discourage an entire market that many other games employ to strengthen the game's community. Which still wouldn't be too bad, if they were able/willing to implement these changes themselves.

Again, for the slowpoke above:
No one disagrees on the fact that Windower is against the rules. It even says so on the Windower main page. People don't have a problem with being called cheaters, people have a problem with the rules themselves. And they are complaining. They have been for almost a decade now and some things still aren't fixed. People will keep informing SE of things to change, and I for one hope that one day Windower will be completely obsolete. But in the meantime, most will use whatever tools they have available to make the game more enjoyable to them.

Sure I can. You cheat at a game. How can we cant call your skill into question. Babe ruth was never taken to court for cheating. So no one can argue his greatness. But barry bonds cheated at a game and got cought and will forever be a joke. But I'm glad to be done arguing with you barry. Your denial of reality is very tiring. If tomorrow SE did give us 16 line macros that still wouldnt chage the fact that people are hacking to win at NNI.

You fail to ever make a point that some how says its ok for you to cheat cauz you say the rules dont apply to you. Again that is your issue with reality.

The enm topic is something you might want to take to pld forums where people might care. Get a thread going, complain, get others to complain. I never said SE makes good decisions.. Actually I dont like 90% of what SE has done to help ruin this game. But I cant do anything about it my self. I have to get other people to complain as well.

I play by the rules. For 8+ years I have watched as cheaters get everything handed to them and SE rarely if ever did anything about it. So no. you are mistaking me for someone else. I feel SE is just as much to blame for allowing people to cheat as the cheaters them selves. It shouldnt have taken 7ish years to fix HNM but it did. Does it anoy me sure.. but its been changed so that no longer can PC players prevent honest players at a chance to play by the rules.

That is all we want for NNI a chance to play by the rules. But no one wants to go unless the hacks are there too. So our options are to never go or get hacks of our own and that is not fair. So how else can we weed out the bad eggs?

Just because you dont like the rules does not mean you can break the rules.

Just because you complain and it is not changed right this instand if ever.. does not mean you can just break the rules.

If you dont like the rules then dont play. Go play a game that you agree with the rules.

You act as if you ca just change the rules of life as you see fit. You going to start muging people because you dont want to go to work anymore? I mean where do you draw the line? When are you held to a higher standard in life? Where rules apply to you. Or was I missinformed and the universe does infact revolve arround you. Get real. Get with reality.