[dev1009] Seriously.... how could you make the HNM system worse...

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Originally Posted by KigenAngelios

On this note I understand that many people find X items from the old days worth it but there are some of us who want the item that they've always wanted their whole FFXI career, mine is Dalmatica. Lets not forget that SE has already mentioned and shown (in screenshots) the upcoming augment system that make items comparable to +2 emp armor. Some of the reasons SE is even bothering to revamp old content is to alleviate congestion (mainly of abyssea) and making content more accessible - which is miles above what many of us that they would ever do. Someone times its not about having the best of X its about getting what you want however small or big it is.

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Yeah, we need to think about those people taking things for sentimental reasons. Let's factor everyone being sentimental into the equation.

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Originally Posted by KigenAngelios

The point some of us are trying that some us are trying to make is that they are making these HNMs a near finite resource. Based on the math it takes 8hrs 15mins to gain 99 KS assuming you get every KS every time you could (KSs have a chance to drop only once ever 5mins and share a possible pool with KC, H.Q. KC, and BS) There is no level that you can only get a Kindred Seal (i.e. there will always be a shared pool). Coupled with the fact that Abyssea (i.e. high level mobs) make getting a Kindred Seal very rare also hurt us. Yes you can farm 8hr15mins+ solo on optimal KS farming mobs... but this is no where near equivalent to waiting 3hrs or so for a mob to spawn. Not even having a guaranteed drop means that the path to these items (incuding bb items, ridill-esque items, and abjs) means the effort heavily outweighs the reward which is bad game design at its best/worst.

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It's not necessarily just waiting 0-3 hrs every 21-24 hrs though. Even if you have no competition which I find doubtful you have to make your and most likely your friend's schedule around when the NM pops. NQ drop rates on trophies is awful from what I've seen and heard they're maybe around 10%. Sure the HQs are 100% but odds are you'll have more competition camping HQs and they pop only every 4 days at most.

With an alliance of 3 you have a chance at 3 seals every 5 mins you can potentially get a pop every 3 hrs or so. Even doubling that time if you just spend a couple hrs a day farming you're more likely to get a pop then you would from camping. Until we see the droprate off HQs you can't really say whether it's a terrible waste of time but at this time it's about the same amount of time spent camping given that there's always a chance you'll lose claim. Not only that but you'll be able to farm at your leisure.

Pretty sure SE mentioned looking to introduce something better than Black Belt for monks too.

So hey, By 95 maybe Black Belt will be shit tier!

Theres a bright side ^^

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Originally Posted by Sp1cyryan

Yeah, we need to think about those people taking things for sentimental reasons. Let's factor everyone being sentimental into the equation.

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I don't know if you're being sarcastic or not but - why the hell not? The more people who care about content X the better. Its better than being lethargic. Hell I'm one more person who is willing and up for helping people do stuff like this which means someone can get their desired BB item, or Defending Ring, or whatever. Better than completely eliminating the option.

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Originally Posted by Orson

It's not necessarily just waiting 0-3 hrs every 21-24 hrs though. Even if you have no competition which I find doubtful you have to make your and most likely your friend's schedule around when the NM pops. NQ drop rates on trophies is awful from what I've seen and heard they're maybe around 10%. Sure the HQs are 100% but odds are you'll have more competition camping HQs and they pop only every 4 days at most.

With an alliance of 3 you have a chance at 3 seals every 5 mins you can potentially get a pop every 3 hrs or so. Even doubling that time if you just spend a couple hrs a day farming you're more likely to get a pop then you would from camping. Until we see the droprate off HQs you can't really say whether it's a terrible waste of time but at this time it's about the same amount of time spent camping given that there's always a chance you'll lose claim. Not only that but you'll be able to farm at your leisure.

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Hurr Durr.

Yes the NQ drop rates are not the best, but many people have still gotten their BB items from them.

It does not give credibility to your ridiculous "hey guys lets go be incedibly bored as a six man group for THREE hours" nonsense. Most likely people will not be out as a group of six farming KS. It would be a person soloing them or a group of two maybe three tops on average. It is still a slap in the face.

SE: "Hey new people who came into this game in a time where KS no longer drop on mobs people actually fight (you know those abyssean ones) because clearly only KC should drop on a mob, go spend your time doing something mind numbingly boring!"
New MNKs: "Sounds good to me!"

God i wish there was a PM system on this site now so i can tell people when to just give up arguing with certain people >.>

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Originally Posted by Sp1cyryan

Hurr Durr.

Yes the NQ drop rates are not the best, but many people have still gotten their BB items from them.

It does not give credibility to your ridiculous "hey guys lets go be incedibly bored as a six man group for THREE hours" nonsense. Most likely people will not be out as a group of six farming KS. It would be a person soloing them or a group of two maybe three tops on average. It is still a slap in the face.

SE: "Hey new people who came into this game in a time where KS no longer drop on mobs people actually fight (you know those abyssean ones) because clearly only KC should drop on a mob, go spend your time doing something mind numbingly boring!"
New MNKs: "Sounds good to me!"

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You may have not have seen the threads having probably just started visiting here.

But there were tons of people on these boards complaining non-stop that the Devs needed to give people a reason to do things out-side of Abyssea, to "Revitalize Old-school exp". This is actually a rather ingenuously evil way of doing it. You force people to choose between mind-numbing FoV soloing for Seals, Or level your jobs in old-fashioned exp ways.

Neither are very appealing, But i find it kinda ... I can't think of the word? Deliciously Ironic/Evil. So there is a positive ^^

Edit: for the record, I never complained about the above, i just find it SE gave people what they wanted (reasons to do things outside of Abyssea), and they're now complaining more. (not everyone mind you)

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Originally Posted by KigenAngelios

I don't know if you're being sarcastic or not but - why the hell not? The more people who care about content X the better. Its better than being lethargic. Hell I'm one more person who is willing and up for helping people do stuff like this which means someone can get their desired BB item, or Defending Ring, or whatever. Better than completely eliminating the option.

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Very sarcastic,, *facepalm*

The reason? Quite simply if you think about it, it is ludicrous for the dev team to take sentimental value into account for adjustments to the game.

I'm glad I'm not the only one that sees this is a step in the wrong direction for a game that's been working toward being more accessible for over a year now.

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Originally Posted by Sp1cyryan

I am aware, and no I have looked and posted at and on these forums from a bit since they opened.

The official forums have convinced me that the human race should go extinct :P

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If i could agree with you without admitting I'm part of that race.

I would.

I really really would.

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Originally Posted by Karbuncle

But there were tons of people on these boards complaining non-stop that the Devs needed to give people a reason to do things out-side of Abyssea, to "Revitalize Old-school exp". This is actually a rather ingenuously evil way of doing it. You force people to choose between mind-numbing FoV soloing for Seals, Or level your jobs in old-fashioned exp ways.

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A lot of idiots begged for outside exp to be good again, and for reasons to exp outside of Aby.
However, if someone needs KSs, they aren't going to hop in an old-school XP party for them, they're going to solo it or do it with friends. This causes people to do things outside of Aby no more than Magian Trials do.