Please SE lower the sparks requirements for Rem Chapters 1-5

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Originally Posted by Afania

Also to add one extra input....if player A pay for sub and play the game + do group content v.s another player B who pay for sub but refuse to play the game nor pt with others, player A's opinion would worth a lot more weight than player B.

Money wise, both players pay same amount of money, but player A contributes to server population, economy, and put the community together by participating community events.

MMORPG built on community, a MMORPG with tons of active subscription but ghost town everywhere is a dead MMO, even if the company is making money.

Eventually all players would quit cuz nobody would want to pay sub fee to play a ghost town MMO.

If I'm a game dev, I'd WANT player B to play the game more, but I wouldn't make decisions to please player B by making player A quit.

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If player A quits because player B is able to enjoy the game more... than player A is the problem, not the solution.

I'd play more if my favourite jobs were useable in more content. I'd play more if I could make more progress when I did log in, instead of being walled off by not using 3rd party tools and not already having all the best gear. I am not seeing how making it less grindy to get chapters solo makes player A quit... those people are already capped on AF/relic they want, so making it so I can get it doesn't hurt them at all.

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Originally Posted by mattkoko

Okay so there may be some people that have cheated to get mythic. I honestly did not hear about that and I do admit where I am wrong.

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Cool, thanks. I didn't say "everyone" who has a mythic did that, but a LOT of people did. And unfortunately, anyone who made a mythic in the last few months probably got some of that cheated alexandrite from the market, and so benefited from the cheating too.

It was a bit of a snarky remark, admittedly, but it gets tiring having folks who cheat (including using windower and scripts to gear swap for them etc) tell me that I'm a problem because I want to have some chill things to enjoy when I play the game.

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Originally Posted by mattkoko

And to your point about it not effecting anyone else by making chapters easier to farm with sparks, let me ask you this. Where are we going to get people for group content (elite content according to you) if everything is so easy to get solo? Lets use chapters as an example since that is the topic at hand right now. If they make chapters so easy to get from sparks, do you really think there will be enough people to do the battle fields for chapters or any of the other equipment from those battle fields? It may be able to be done but it would certainly be harder considering most of the battle fields, you get at least 2-3 people only after chapters. And if one of those people is a pld, you will have to wait even longer since that person that has pld is farming his chapters by doing sparks since it was made so much easier. The reason why group content survives still is because it is more efficient then soloing. If soloing is made more efficient, there will be no need for delve, incrusion, higher tiered battle fields, skirmishes, etc.

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I think you're missing the point. People already said it in this thread, it's already too late to get groups to do that content for the most part, as people have hundreds of chapters already so no one wants to do it. Also, the other drops aren't really worth anything anymore ... so yeah, not a lot of point. Heck, I barely did any of the BCNMs for 1-6 and I have enough chapters for now to have zero desire to do those battles. So, at this point, once the initial rush is over, it DOES make sense to increase solo opportunities to farm these items. I agree at the beginning it's good to make the rewards skew heavily to groups vs solo, but once lots of people are capped, not so much.

I have lots of chapters 1-6. I don't need them to reduce the spark cost, but that doesn't mean I oppose them reducing the spark costs so that others can get them.

The people who like doing these group battles or who are geared good enough to do them have gotten their chapters. At this point there is zero harm in making it a bit less grindy to solo them.

You're example is flawed because what's really holding groups back now is that most people who want those items already have them. It's hard to get a PLD because Mr. PLD has 200 chapters on his mule already.

Also I highly doubt people would stop doing groups if you reduced the chapter cost from 15K to 10K for example. Still way faster to do groups AND you get the shot at neat gear.

The only people hurt by refusing the lower the cost are those who aren't able to get into groups.

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Originally Posted by Afania

You must be new to this forum :) It's not the first time Olor act as if his/her opinion is above everyone else's then proceed to bash anyone dare to disagree....or threaten with "if I quit the game would die, because 95% of the player base has the same opinion as me". Once he/she said he/she wants anyone with better gear than him/her to quit the game so dev can design the game just for Olor.

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Not really new to the forum. I been coming in a lot because some times the Dev say something in the forum that they don't mention anywhere else. And I add to the discussion when I feel necessary. However, a lot of times I hold back just because some people make it hostile and I normally avoid confrontation. This time I couldn't help it I guess lol. I am always up for friendly debates and I will admit when I am wrong like I did in my previous post. But Like you say, I notice Olor, makes it sound like she is the only one that plays the game and it must be developed around her and her alone or else it's wrong.

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Originally Posted by Olor

Cool, thanks. I didn't say "everyone" who has a mythic did that, but a LOT of people did. And unfortunately, anyone who made a mythic in the last few months probably got some of that cheated alexandrite from the market, and so benefited from the cheating too.

It was a bit of a snarky remark, admittedly, but it gets tiring having folks who cheat (including using windower and scripts to gear swap for them etc) tell me that I'm a problem because I want to have some chill things to enjoy when I play the game.



I think you're missing the point. People already said it in this thread, it's already too late to get groups to do that content for the most part, as people have hundreds of chapters already so no one wants to do it. Also, the other drops aren't really worth anything anymore ... so yeah, not a lot of point. Heck, I barely did any of the BCNMs for 1-6 and I have enough chapters for now to have zero desire to do those battles. So, at this point, once the initial rush is over, it DOES make sense to increase solo opportunities to farm these items. I agree at the beginning it's good to make the rewards skew heavily to groups vs solo, but once lots of people are capped, not so much.

I have lots of chapters 1-6. I don't need them to reduce the spark cost, but that doesn't mean I oppose them reducing the spark costs so that others can get them.

The people who like doing these group battles or who are geared good enough to do them have gotten their chapters. At this point there is zero harm in making it a bit less grindy to solo them.

You're example is flawed because what's really holding groups back now is that most people who want those items already have them. It's hard to get a PLD because Mr. PLD has 200 chapters on his mule already.

Also I highly doubt people would stop doing groups if you reduced the chapter cost from 15K to 10K for example. Still way faster to do groups AND you get the shot at neat gear.

The only people hurt by refusing the lower the cost are those who aren't able to get into groups.

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I'm not missing the point. I think the wrong thing is being suggested though. Rather then making chapters easier to solo, I would much rather them focus on balancing more content and/or jobs to help a wider variety of jobs get recruited easier. I may be wrong but I think the main reason people resort to soloing is because they can't get into content with a job they love with out resorting to the most OP jobs. Even you have mentioned that you would love to be able to bring bst to more content or any content for that matter that involves groups (again I admit this is a problem that some jobs cannot get into any group content). Though I have been able to get in some group content on drk, I did have to resort to leveling whm just to boost chances in getting recruited. However, leveling whm was also a personal choice to be more helpful to my ls. Again, sacrifice. Also, if you demonstrate to a couple of groups that you are willing to be flexible to the jobs they need, more people will get to know you, respect you, and see your skill level and in turn, may be more likely to accept you on another job in the future. SE will never be able to make ALL group content that will welcome ALL 22 jobs. The only content that succeeded with that (and still does to some extent) is VW. There has to be some give and take between both developers and the players.

Back on topic though, you also mentioned that people don't need that content for chapters, yet you say they still solo for chapters which completely contradicts your point. I still see shouts to a lot of different battle fields (yes, even AAs which were the very first ones chapters 6-10 if I recall correctly). And since you admitted that some people still need chapters, perhaps they can fill some spots in those battle fields.

Just to recap really quick, I am not fighting your opinion just to fight it. I just think making sparks easier to farm is not the direction to go for anyone. There are enough people in this game to do group content. Just not enough jobs are able to participate in that content. Some people counter this by just leveling the OP job. Not everyone does. If they can open the slots for more people to go on the job they want to go, this thread wouldn't even have to exist. Therefore, I would rather them focus their resources on making it so more jobs can go to group content, rather them turning this into a solo online role-playing game.

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Originally Posted by mattkoko

Also, if you demonstrate to a couple of groups that you are willing to be flexible to the jobs they need, more people will get to know you, respect you, and see your skill level and in turn, may be more likely to accept you on another job in the future.

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I did all the chapters I have on WHM and BRD. I've been plenty flexible with my jobs. I would never even ask my friends to bring me as BST on content because even if my BST was geared twice as well as my other jobs (it isn't) - it would contribute half as much.

Also I don't use 3rd party tools so in terms of performance, it's adequate but it is no where near what people want to see. Also, I'm not the best player. I'm dependable, I listen to instructions, I try to gear well but I'm not going to pretend I'm so awesome on whm or brd or whatever that people will be falling over themselves to invite me on BST... even if BST didn't suck so bad.

I can join groups for these things because my bard is adequate for the task, but honestly sometimes I just come home from work and want to derp around a bit and make progress solo. I don't think it's unreasonable to ask that the progress we can make solo is a little less grindy, especially now that the content is no longer prime content.

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Originally Posted by mattkoko

But Like you say, I notice Olor, makes it sound like she is the only one that plays the game and it must be developed around her and her alone or else it's wrong.

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I'm sad that you think so. I don't think that asking for alternate paths for content to be equalized a bit when they are past their prime is asking for the game to be tailored to me. I know I'm not the only player that doesn't love doing missions. I know I'm not the only player that dislikes having to play support in groups pretty much exclusively.

I've tried to be respectful in our conversation, sorry if that hasn't come across the way I wanted it to.

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Originally Posted by Olor

I do not see the reason why people get up in arms about others enjoying the game in their own way. How does it hurt you if I don't want to do mission battles but prefer to work on current gear instead? I've said it a million times. I have zero interest in logging on and doing nothing but watching cut scenes for hours on end, then two-shotting a boring battle. Geeze.

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If you go through the stories, it will make it easier to get REM tales multiple ways. Not only will it give you access to the rest of the BCNM's, but it will open up more zones to get the first time spark bonus in, along with additional objectives for defeating sky/sea gods or finishing limbus zones.

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Originally Posted by Olor

I did all the chapters I have on WHM and BRD. I've been plenty flexible with my jobs. I would never even ask my friends to bring me as BST on content because even if my BST was geared twice as well as my other jobs (it isn't) - it would contribute half as much.

Also I don't use 3rd party tools so in terms of performance, it's adequate but it is no where near what people want to see. Also, I'm not the best player. I'm dependable, I listen to instructions, I try to gear well but I'm not going to pretend I'm so awesome on whm or brd or whatever that people will be falling over themselves to invite me on BST... even if BST didn't suck so bad.

I can join groups for these things because my bard is adequate for the task, but honestly sometimes I just come home from work and want to derp around a bit and make progress solo. I don't think it's unreasonable to ask that the progress we can make solo is a little less grindy, especially now that the content is no longer prime content.



I'm sad that you think so. I don't think that asking for alternate paths for content to be equalized a bit when they are past their prime is asking for the game to be tailored to me. I know I'm not the only player that doesn't love doing missions. I know I'm not the only player that dislikes having to play support in groups pretty much exclusively.

I've tried to be respectful in our conversation, sorry if that hasn't come across the way I wanted it to.

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I don't use 3rd party tools either. The most cheating I do is open up FFXIAH.com and stalk shouts from there so I can do other stuff rather then stand around in Jeuno.

And I dont have any problems with what you say. It is how you say it. I didn't have any problems with your previous posts since it was just the sharing of opinions. Maybe it was just coincidence but I just noticed you being snarky in a couple of recent posts.

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Originally Posted by Olor

If player A quits because player B is able to enjoy the game more... than player A is the problem, not the solution.

I'd play more if my favourite jobs were useable in more content. I'd play more if I could make more progress when I did log in, instead of being walled off by not using 3rd party tools and not already having all the best gear. I am not seeing how making it less grindy to get chapters solo makes player A quit... those people are already capped on AF/relic they want, so making it so I can get it doesn't hurt them at all.

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If player A quits because player B demand to play the MMO like a single player game, then it's player A's problem.

But if player B quits because player B can't enjoy what player A enjoys, then it's not player B's problem.

That's some serious double standard, isn't it. Once again it's "the game should focus on making Olor happy, idc about everyone else. If you don't like my opinion it's your problem"

Sorry to be blunt, IMO it's certainly your own problem that you're unwilling to compromise to make progress. There are thousand ways to make progress that's more than just use 3rd pt tool or change jobs.

I don't use 3rd pt tool and I never get complaint from other players for not using it. In fact most players from PUG don't use it either. The game is very playable without tools, including jobs like WHM. In my case I try to compromise by using different macros, or make a FC/cure pot hybrid set for WHM. Or study enemy status aliments before entering events, and spams haste whenever I get a chance to to avoid buff drop. Those are the compromise I made for not using the tools.

I also don't play bandwagon jobs, however I try to make friends and social with them whenever I get a chance. If they're /shouting for jobs I don't have, I spent time to send /tell and explain why my jobs can replace a bandwagon jobs in events and get the job done. Sometimes when they ask me to change jobs, I just came up with 100 excuses and dodge the requests, eventually I still get to play my jobs. Those are the compromise I made for not playing bandwagon jobs.

I don't have every single gears as well, but if there's a gear I can get solo, I sure don't mind reading texts from the WoTG CS for moonshade.

You spent lots of time reading posts on the forum and replying them, but you're unwilling to watch a 3 min CS in mission BC for 119 AF fight access? The time you spent on the forum you could have finish it 10 times already.

"I don't want to watch CS, I don't want to make friends, I don't want to play other jobs, I don't want to try to convince others to invite my jobs, I don't want to log on for more than a couple of hours, I want to make progress but I think sparks took too long to farm, I don't want to change how I play at all. I think the game should give me gears more easily so I can make progress faster without any compromise for what I want to do in game"

Sounds like "Me, me, this should please ME only! If this isn't for me then it's everyone else's problem!" all over. I'm not entirely convinced that this isn't your own personal problem at all. At least 95% of the players I encounter in game compromise at one point of time to make progress, those who doesn't compromise doesn't complain/bash others on the forum either. Players with 0 room to compromise AND bash anyone with different opinions are certainly the minority.

Or rather, if others can compromise to make progress, why can't you?

As previously stated, it is fact that players in MMORPG would tend to solo, unless pt gets better reward. Thus solo in a MMORPG should never yield good reward or else everyone would just solo, the connection between friends/ls would be destroyed.

If SE hand out gears more easily solo just because player B(who doesn't log on) enjoys to solo, it'd destroy the community because everyone would just ended up soloing. If player A quit because of that, it's not player A's issue.

If player B is unhappy because player B only wants to solo and refuse to do anything else, and not happy with the solo progress, IMO it's player B's issue. The issue being player B is currently playing a MMORPG and insist to play like a single player game.

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Originally Posted by Olor

I think you're missing the point. People already said it in this thread, it's already too late to get groups to do that content for the most part, as people have hundreds of chapters already so no one wants to do it.

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While I agree that this is an issue, since this game is a MMORPG, IMO the better way to fix the problem is to give out more incentive for ppl to help with the fight, instead of handing out gears solo.

If each BC fight gives out 5k~10k CP, even players with capped gears would be willing to help out. We'd see more players do the content as a team.

If SE makes 119 easier to obtain via sparks, everyone and their mother would just want to solo and finish AF119. Nobody would bother to make a pt, make friends, ask for help and help others. FFXI would turn into a terrible game in which we just enter Abyssea and solo for sparks and gears, with 0 /shout in town.

If player A quit because FFXI turn into a ghost town MMO, I don't think that's his/her issue since majority of the players probably don't enjoy a ghost town MMO. IMO it's player B's issue to ask SE to turn FFXI into a ghost town MMO.

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Originally Posted by Olor

Also I highly doubt people would stop doing groups if you reduced the chapter cost from 15K to 10K for example. Still way faster to do groups AND you get the shot at neat gear.

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If you count the time to farm merit, make a pt, /shout and take the risk of failing then I'd say the solo efficiency is quite close to pt. PT has to be much, much, MUCH more efficient than solo to be an incentive to pt. I solo for CP/REM's tales very often just because it's often less efficient to make a pt for them. But I don't solo for plasm because there's no way I can get plasm nearly as fast as a delve pt. Thus plasm/delve is the right example for reward/effort ratio as a pt content, 119 AF isn't.

FYI, at 10k each you can collect 8 REM's tale for 119 af in 3hr. Sometimes a BC takes 1hr+ just to fill up, not including the time you farm merit, wipe with PUGs, zombie and shadowbind in PUG and so on. If you're not doing VD(which is nearly impossible with PUG) you'd need multiple runs to finish it, which often takes longer than 3hr of solo.

IMO higher tier BC just needs to give out better reward for helpers such as 5k~10k CP, that'd solve most of the problem.

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Originally Posted by Olor

How does it hurt you if I don't want to do mission battles but prefer to work on current gear instead? I've said it a million times. I have zero interest in logging on and doing nothing but watching cut scenes for hours on end, then two-shotting a boring battle. Geeze.

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I'm not "hurt" if you want to solo or enjoy solo, but I'm pretty sure it'd hurt the game in the long run if solo gets stuff more efficient than pt.

Yeah I don't really see what 3rd pt tools have to do with Rem chapters anyway. Those fights are not really that demanding.

My oldest FFXI friend was kicked off his LS for not installing a SCH stun-tool, he refused to do this and was kicked. He was also insulted by them and spammed with hateful /tells, so he left our server for 6 months to get away from those people. He's back now and seems to be enjoying himself again, but he was very hurt because he is a loyal and helpful player, it really hurt his feelings that they wouldn't take his veteran scholar without added hacks. But that was for delve, not Rem chapters lol.

The main problem is mono-build content, content that encourages people to use a "my way or the highway" approach to building parties. It would be good if there was greater job-inclusivity, where your well-equipped and played-with-skill jobs were always welcome in events. I don't see the game suffering if there was greater flexibility in content-acceptable jobs and in players' willingness to accept jobs that might not fit the rigid 'perfect build.'