Voidwatch Final Chapter

The ironic part being Dnc can't actually use a relic.

So are the new trigger adjustments for Provenance going to be added to the rest of Voidwatch in the next update?

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Originally Posted by Camate

• Making blue alignment and red alignment max at the beginning
This is currently only at the brainstorming phase, but this is one of the things we are thinking about to help low man groups and also players that get into Voidwatch later.

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This I consider a bad idea. One thing that was really done right with VW is it allowed for variety. It allowed much more freedom with job choices. If you change it so that red and blue start capped, this event will turn like all the others, in that players who don't want to level and gear sam, mnk, cor or whm will become unwelcome to these events.

I really see no point in a game with 20 different jobs when only 4 or 5 actually count for anything.

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Originally Posted by Calamity

This I consider a bad idea. One thing that was really done right with VW is it allowed for variety. It allowed much more freedom with job choices. If you change it so that red and blue start capped, this event will turn like all the others, in that players who don't want to level and gear sam, mnk, cor or whm will become unwelcome to these events.

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There was no diversity in VW, ever. There was no need for BLM, SMN, RDM, BLU, etc. There was only a need for their proc spells. I don't know about you, but I didn't feel like playing BLM when I was BLM for VW. I felt like I was forced to abuse my job to fit into the system proposed by VW. And that I didn't enjoy. I don't know about other people, though.

And aside from that, it limited job selection a lot more than any other event. Only it didn't limit it to a few jobs, but it forced a lot of other jobs, which, in turn, forced some people to come on jobs the group didn't have. I wanna come WAR or THF to VW, how often do you think I was either? Rarely, it's my BLM, SCH, SMN or BRD they want. Again, I can't speak for others but personally I wasn't happy about this. It forced jobs just as much as any previous system, only the other way around.

Capping red and blue light would help in that regard, actually. It would still require some proc jobs to be able to keep temporary items up (as they just said they won't change that, if I understood it correctly), only it wouldn't force you to cap red and blue lights specifically, meaning if you're after items you'll only need enough proc jobs to stay alive, not enough to cap everything out. For that I think it's a good step.

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Originally Posted by Camate

• Other familiar pets besides sheep
Since the Voidwatch participation level is 75 and we did not want to have a jug that cost too much, as a result of comparing the higher level pets for that level, we decided to pick Nazuna. However, this is something that can be changed. We’d like to look in to this based on your feedback, so if you have an opinion please let us know. (It won’t make it in time for the final chapter, but we would like to look into it for the future of existing Voidwatch content.)

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Nursery Nazuna caps at level 86 without Beast Affinity merits and requires 4 Beast Affinity merits and augmented Monster Gloves +2 to cap at 99. Given that some of the stuff we bring our Voidvoyeurism to bear upon is hard to hit already and that Sheep Charge requires 100 TP, I could seen even a level 96 sheep being slightly more horrible than a level 99 sheep. Keeping in mind that pets can't drink Stalwart's Drink, a level 86 sheep would have a terrible time gaining the TP for Sheep Charge.

Lucky Lulush is available at the same level as Nursery Nazuna, almost as cheap to produce or buy, and has a much higher level cap. It also has a physical, single-target Ready command that's very similar to Sheep Charge.

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Originally Posted by Arcon

There was no diversity in VW, ever. There was no need for BLM, SMN, RDM, BLU, etc. There was only a need for their proc spells. I don't know about you, but I didn't feel like playing BLM when I was BLM for VW. I felt like I was forced to abuse my job to fit into the system proposed by VW. And that I didn't enjoy. I don't know about other people, though.

And aside from that, it limited job selection a lot more than any other event. Only it didn't limit it to a few jobs, but it forced a lot of other jobs, which, in turn, forced some people to come on jobs the group didn't have. I wanna come WAR or THF to VW, how often do you think I was either? Rarely, it's my BLM, SCH, SMN or BRD they want. Again, I can't speak for others but personally I wasn't happy about this. It forced jobs just as much as any previous system, only the other way around.

Capping red and blue light would help in that regard, actually. It would still require some proc jobs to be able to keep temporary items up (as they just said they won't change that, if I understood it correctly), only it wouldn't force you to cap red and blue lights specifically, meaning if you're after items you'll only need enough proc jobs to stay alive, not enough to cap everything out. For that I think it's a good step.

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Maybe that's just your experience. In mine people have a certain freedom to choose the jobs they want/feel most comfortable with. I've never felt that not wanting to level sam (or mnk or w/e the bandwagon of the week is) should automatically disqualify me from participation and I never will. Now obviously the real solution would be to close the gap between jobs, balance things out so that any DD/healer/support/whatever can do just as well as any other in their given role, but we'll see giant pink marshmallows falling from the sky before that happens. So that being the case I fully support a system that punishes overspecialization. It's the closest thing to "balance" we'll ever see

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Originally Posted by SpankWustler

Nursery Nazuna caps at level 86 without Beast Affinity merits and requires 4 Beast Affinity merits and augmented Monster Gloves +2 to cap at 99. Given that some of the stuff we bring our Voidvoyeurism to bear upon is hard to hit already and that Sheep Charge requires 100 TP, I could seen even a level 96 sheep being slightly more horrible than a level 99 sheep. Keeping in mind that pets can't drink Stalwart's Drink, a level 86 sheep would have a terrible time gaining the TP for Sheep Charge.

Lucky Lulush is available at the same level as Nursery Nazuna, almost as cheap to produce or buy, and has a much higher level cap. It also has a physical, single-target Ready command that's very similar to Sheep Charge.

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GooeyGerald is a really cheap high level pet with some amount of resistance as well. both his TP moves are magical though, Good thing is they can't miss!

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Originally Posted by Karbuncle

GooeyGerald is a really cheap high level pet with some amount of resistance as well. both his TP moves are magical though, Good thing is they can't miss!

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This is a good point.

Sadly, I mentioned that last bit because I assume that the Development Bros WANT the !!! move itself to miss at least 5% of the time. Balance, sadness, giant spiders with the heads of horses, etc. Even within the rabbit's repertoire, Lucky Lulush's Snowcloud would be preferable to Foot Kick since Snowcloud is elemental.

The rest came from having to pick something level 76 and cheap to match the Development Bros qualifications, and uncapped to match my own qualification.

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Originally Posted by SpankWustler

This is a good point.

Sadly, I mentioned that last bit because I assume that the Development Bros WANT the !!! move itself to miss at least 5% of the time. Balance, sadness, giant spiders with the heads of horses, etc. Even within the rabbit's repertoire, Lucky Lulush's Snowcloud would be preferable to Foot Kick since Snowcloud is elemental.

The rest came from having to pick something level 76 and cheap to match the Development Bros qualifications, and uncapped to match my own qualification.

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Yet sadly, in the end bst is going to be no more desired in VW now, than it was then. I just can't see an alliance leader filling a slot with a job that has 1 potential proc. Maybe if that sheep proc showed up at the same rate that all the bst procs combined came up before the update, which seemed pretty often, maybe. But odds are it'll be one of those procs that you'll see maybe once every 7-10 VW's or so.

yan, I figured thats why you picked Lulu tbh, Just throwing out another possibility :)

So is there ANY news on the ticket system promised by SE?

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Originally Posted by Dawnn

So is there ANY news on the ticket system promised by SE?

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Last word on it:

Its going to be really Terrible, Fix all of nothing, be a giant waste of time, and be completely forgotten due to uselessness within about a week.

Unless somethings changed and its not still the equivalent to finding 6 people who won the lottery twice to get you 1 item.

Greetings, adventurers of Vana'diel!

We have a few details to share with you in regards to the direction that the dev. team is thinking about going in regards to Voidwatch-related content.

Weaknesses and Familiar Pets
We received quite a few opinions in regards to familiar pets and exploiting weakness so we’d like to share what we’re considering based on what we read:

Considering utilizing pets that can reach level 99
Considering choosing pets with abilities that can’t miss (like breath attacks, for an example)

We would like to have more input on this so please continue to send us your feedback.

Weaknesses and Automatons
Similar with the familiar pets, we are considering making an adjustment so the Automaton can utilize special abilities that can’t miss.

We would also like to have more input on this matter so please continue to send us your feedback.

Odds on obtaining loot in Voidwatch
In the final chapter of Voidwatch, usage of ascent item is not taken into consideration when it comes to the odds on obtaining loot. Thus it does not mean that the odds are low since ascent items cannot be used. Instead, the odds are balanced based on the strength of the enemy and the specification of the loot.

Is it possible to obtain the victory key item even if the player get disconnected during Voidwatch?
As a common system structure for all battlefields, there is no way to keep the status of the victory/defeat flag in case a player gets disconnected.

We are currently brainstorming a solution for this and have several options in mind, such as placing an NPC that will maintain the battle status and once the player returns, they can load the status by talking to the NPC to confirm the result. In any case, it will require updates on various parts of the game system and will require some time so we would like to further discuss it internally.

Keep your suggestions and comments coming!

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We are currently brainstorming a solution for this and have several options in mind, such as placing an NPC that will maintain the battle status and once the player returns, they can load the status by talking to the NPC to confirm the result. In any case, it will require updates on various parts of the game system and will require some time so we would like to further discuss it internally.

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This is a good idea, but you should seriously a core system change, even if it's significant work, to accomodate things like connection issues- like not require that the player be logged in in order for any state-based information to be maintained, and to enable the possibility of players remaining part of a party when they get disconnected (Just show an unplugged cable icon by their name or something). In World of Warcraft, players are not removed from a party when they get disconnected. I really, really wish both FFXI and FFXIV could implement this.

Remove pet procs. There's your solution.

THE ODDS ARE BALANCED

Are you guys going to move the revised triggering list employed on Provenance battles to the rest of Voidwatch?

Also, for the love of BLUs everywhere, look into reducing their list of spells so they're not stuck wasting so much time moving spells around and being stuck on their 1 minute cooldown.

0/300+ on Toci's. Balanced.

Watching ls mates drop hekas while i'm 0/107 and counting. Balanced.

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Originally Posted by Washburn

0/300+ on Toci's. Balanced.

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Originally Posted by Raksha

Watching ls mates drop hekas while i'm 0/107 and counting. Balanced.

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Neither of which being the finale.

make meteor and arise more common drops.

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Originally Posted by Granny

make meteor and arise more common drops.

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Make anything from Provenance more common period.

Lovely to know our lvl99 endgame has a worse drop-rate than pretty much anything else in XI's history.

35 pieces from Salvage come close, but only because you couldn't spam the event like you can VW.

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Originally Posted by Tsukino_Kaji

Neither of which being the finale.

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I love me some logs for fighting the mothercrystal's avatar. I really do.

Could you at least make the crafting items drop more? Also, not to change the subject, but when will we get a glimpse of what is beyond Voidwatch?

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Originally Posted by Longshot

Could you at least make the crafting items drop more? Also, not to change the subject, but when will we get a glimpse of what is beyond Voidwatch?

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Legion is the content beyond VW.

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Originally Posted by Longshot

Also, not to change the subject, but when will we get a glimpse of what is beyond Voidwatch?

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We should be getting a new 6-month content roadmap for the test server any time now, since the last on ended in March.

Assuming they'll even do another and not just hold it out until Vana'fest.

Just hurry with the new system for duplicate armor so that folks can buy it and quit bitching.

Yeah they might as well go for free to play route and start selling these gears on micro transaction as options for those who are not willing to do the events for the 500th time.

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Originally Posted by Luvbunny

Yeah they might as well go for free to play route and start selling these gears on micro transaction as options for those who are not willing to do the events for the 500th time.

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Shh don't give them ideas.

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Originally Posted by Granny

make meteor and arise more common drops.

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Pretty much this, supply is maybe one a week server wide and they're just sat in people's bazaars for 90 mil. Won't be any "comrades" to join forces with making meteor pretty pointless.

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Originally Posted by Alkimi

Pretty much this, supply is maybe one a week server wide and they're just sat in people's bazaars for 90 mil. Won't be any "comrades" to join forces with making meteor pretty pointless.

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Agreed. Even as more people get access to Provenance, greed comes first for most people over people actually getting the spells to learn them (This is why I wouldn't do Provenance in a pickup group) and everyone will be lotting Meteor/Arise and bazaaring it for millions of gil and thinking someone will actually buy them for that. I get the new item syndrome, but it's still stupid how high people are bazaaring them for (reasonable stuff I get, but ridiculous stuff I do not). Noticed that either Meteor's more common than Arise or WHMs are actually obtaining the spell when looking on FFXIAH item pages.

Either way, they should be more common than what they are.

tl;dr: Hey SE, there aren't going to be BLMs joining each other to destroy a mob when it's that hard to obtain. At least not for a long time.

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Originally Posted by Fredjan

tl;dr: Hey SE, there aren't going to be BLMs joining each other to destroy a mob when it's that hard to obtain. At least not for a long time.

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pretty sure thats the point.. keep them 'busy' keep them paying for as long as possible?

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Originally Posted by Fondle

pretty sure thats the point.. keep them 'busy' keep them paying for as long as possible?

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Seems to be paying off since the population is but a shadow of its former self by now. You'll even notice my Karbuncle is gone. Luckily for me, Darkmessneger still seems to be active. So i can bug you guys more :D

That said, Their gameplan seems to be the death of them. They seem to think pumping out events with 0.1% Drop rates will lengthen how long we stay, betting on the gambler mindset, But in reality, Its just turning people away. Even they should be seeing now that more people are quitting daily due to their terrible plan to drive FFXI back into the dark ages.

You don't want to hand players everything, or the game becomes stale, but you also don't want to make said items so hard to get people lose their minds and motivation going for them. Its not hard to create a balance, But SE is devoted to Bottle-necking over fun or enjoyment or progression.

Legion was an honest attempt at middleground, But i don't know what the NPCs there offer. I think its all that situational "Legion: Buff" gear no one will bother purchasing because its situational to only legion and those armors are never worth keeping because of Inventory issues (See: Salvage/Assault/Beseiged Only gear). But I'll look up that list...

Edit: looked up the list. The +5 Stat rings with enhancements, and the Legion:Only Accessories. So... Pretty much all junk. 1-2 Situational pieces but again... Situational.

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Weaknesses and Automatons
Similar with the familiar pets, we are considering making an adjustment so the Automaton can utilize special abilities that can’t miss.

We would also like to have more input on this matter so please continue to send us your feedback.

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I agree with what others have said, remove the weakness triggers from the Automatons all together.

Though, if that isn't an open idea to the development team, I would suggest of using abilities that target the enemy instead of Weaponskills. These abilities should come from attachments, such as Flashbulb. There is a slight more control over when attachment effects shoot off than when Weaponskills can.

From my personal experience as a Puppetmaster who tried using the job in Voidwatch, I feel at the current state, Automaton Weaponskills does not flow with the quick pace of Voidwatch. From my perspective, the job is a burden on the group more than other jobs. The whole idea of trying to build TP on a pet, making sure the right maneuver is active, and pray to the deity of your choice that the enemy doesn't one-shot your pet before the Weaponskill fires off makes the event less enjoyable than it should be. It adds a layer of "difficulty" that is caused by luck (or bad luck in my case). On top of that, if the Weaponskill isn't the correct one, the process start all over again with a greater risk of killing the pet. Tactical Switch is an option, but that ability doesn't have a short recast timer on it. So, that ability isn't something to fall back on all the time.

If we go with the idea of having attachments that have an effect on the mob, then we have more control over the timing of the hitting weakness. With a specific pool of abilities that are tied to attachments, the Master only has to activate the maneuver, deploy the Automaton, and wait for the ability to fire off. This is much safer and more reliable than the current system. Using attachment abilities to trigger weakness also fits in with the quick pacing of Voidwatch.

Overall, the job itself is not Voidwatch friendly. Other than the subject of trying to trigger weakness with the Automaton, I feel that the Master's contribution to damage and other triggers is not up to par as other jobs. I have successfully triggered more Weaponskill related weaknesses as me playing Red Mage than on Puppetmaster for example. Puppetmaster after a while seems to plateau on damage capabilities that can easily be overshadowed in Voidwatch by other pure DD jobs. One of the few benefits to Puppetmaster is the capabilities to sub DNC without having most of the main job's damage capabilities hampered.

As much as I like seeing an attempt by the development team to add less than desired jobs to an event. The event isn't friendly to the job at all. It is the equivalent of trying to hammer a square peg through a round hole and trying to make it to where the other children in the play room do the same thing. You can make it work, but the other children are not going to bother with the square pegs and just use the round pegs instead (and use the hammer to mash it through faster).

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I agree with what others have said, remove the weakness triggers from the Automatons all together.

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Only if all other job specific triggers are removed. I don't want my only leverage into an event removed.

Greetings,

Mocchi was able to speak to the dev. team to clarify a few things in regards to the Voidwatch Final Chapter regarding loot and weaknesses.

A player asked whether or not drop rates would be affected by Treasure Hunter, which caused some strategies to be changed around when compared to previous chapters. We can say that yes, Treasure Hunter does have an effect on loot drop rates and we plan on further increasing gear drop rates on top of this as well.

Some players suggested that we remove the low quality drops, or “useless” items, from the rewards at the end. We aren’t providing those lower tier rewards to cause players to be upset, and it is possible for us make it so those drops are removed and no item drops in their place instead.

However, if we were to replace certain items that are perceived as useless, with no drop players may feel that the loot system is bugged when they don’t receive any reward. As such, we would like to provide some sort of drop each time. Also, we have received many comments asking that the items dropped are improved slightly, but we have no plans to make any adjustments at the moment. We feel that we have to draw a line somewhere, or else the requests would begin to get out of hand. As such, we will maintain our current system.

We understand those that would like the drop rates of scrolls to be raised, but we consider gear to be the main aspect of rewards from the final chapter of Voidwatch. Since Arise and Meteor can be obtained through other content, we will maintain their current drop rates.

Weaknesses

• Beastmaster
  It seems like opinions are split on call beasts. Seems like there are bit more calls for Gerard to be used, but we would like to continue to receive feedback.
  
  
• Puppetmaster
  For PUP’s weakness, we’re considering using “Strobe” as their trigger.
  
  
• What about implementing weakness regardless of specific pets, avatars or automaton frames?
  We didn’t touch on this last time, but in terms of this function, it will be implemented. However, we have to consider if it is acceptable to place weaknesses on support jobs when it comes to adding weaknesses to SMNs and PUPs.

To explain what we are trying to accomplish: we want to offer an exploitable weakness from the player’s pet/avatar/automaton at a certain rate if they use a special ability. Basically, we’re not trying to make it so “certain abilities will always result in a weakness trigger.” The reason is that it would be too difficult to manage which abilities are used in which situation when also needing to consider weaknesses in battle.

Even if they added higher tier "Synth" Items to the Loot pools of Final VW, Those items would then become crap-tier because people would be flooded with them. So I guess it doesn't really matter what the fluff rewards are.

Nice Info overall. :D

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Originally Posted by Rukkirii

We understand those that would like the drop rates of scrolls to be raised, but we consider gear to be the main aspect of rewards from the final chapter of Voidwatch. Since Arise and Meteor can be obtained through other content, we will maintain their current drop rates.

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Does anyone have any information on where else this drops? I assume Legion? BG only has Provenance listed, and I do believe those who said Qilin, etc were thought to be trolling. Any other news?

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Only if all other job specific triggers are removed. I don't want my only leverage into an event removed.

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Only if...
I understand your perspective, and that these weakness triggers are the only leverage Puppetmaster has, but until the Voidwatch system either fits the job, or the job fits the system, those leverages are going to be ignored for the most part. When it comes down to it, the system and the player-base feel that Puppetmaster is not a Voidwatch job. Those weaknesses that read across the screen showing an Automaton frame and the intensity of the weakness is viewed more as an inconvenience rather than an opportunity.

I am saying this as a person who tries to campaign to take Puppetmaster to every event and has used every leverage possible. I didn't work to get a Verethragna for the job if I did not intend to use it. I am not anti-Puppetmaster (or anti-pet jobs in general), I am just being realistic.

In my experience, out of 20 kills on Provenance Watcher I've seen more Meteor and Arise then I have actual gear. Why not take one of the material slots and change it to one random Head, Hands, Legs, or Feet abj. This would allow people to get some reward for clearing the final boss, but at same time there is 20 different abjs that can drop in that slot.

The trove would look like this:

Random gear, body abj, scroll, or mat if no gear drops in slot 1.
Random head, hands, legs, or feet abj in slot 2.
Random material in slot 3.

This way you are getting somewhat rewarded, but still not getting everything right away. Getting 2 Red rocks and a Gold ore is pretty sad for the final boss. Also one more slot should be opened up from the direct drop pool. Maybe for a random Body abj.

So the pool would look like this:

Slot 1: Sword, Staff, Helm, Shield, Tes Body, Hat, or nothing.
Slot 2: F:body, S:body, C:body, T:body, L:body, or nothing.
Slot 3: Meteor, Arise, or nothing.

For a final boss of an event, Provenance Watcher has a pretty crappy drop rate.