Why complain about balance - recent job changes.

Most played doesn't mean most LFP. The only time I even joined a pt on whm was for exp since it wasn't at level cap, after that the only time it sees light of day is because It's needed for a group I've joined while on another job or during lowman because the dbox whm isn't enough/present for w/e reason.

I'd probably /anon myself too if I ever remembered, dealing with random tells is annoying. You don't even need you flag up for people to be hounding you to join their party.

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Originally Posted by Malamasala

Well, you are uninterested in spirits because they don't work. You would have been interested in them, if SE fixed them. You are a bit bizarre, in that something has to first be useful before you complain that it is useless.

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that made me chuckle a bit thanks =D

Spirits are not useless we suck the MP out of them and I enjoy it.

however you seem to put me in this world where "if" spirits would good I would use them more often.

Incorrect I will not use spirits as avatars, I want my avatars to be standing in the spot light not spirits. I agree again that they should adjust spirits.....its not that they don't work...before you know my reason just ask, don't assume.:cool:

Why complain about balance?

Because SE made a forum so they could get feedback from players...

Spirits are fine as they are, they have useful-on-the-side abilities. They should never be competing with avatars, because these are what summoner is about.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

Spirits are fine as they are, they have useful-on-the-side abilities. They should never be competing with avatars, because these are what summoner is about.

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I don't think it's much about competing with avatars rather than them being able to work alongside avatars. At least, I don't think anyone is looking to have spirits replace avatars...

PS: Spirits being useful only because of elemental syphon is, much like a lot of things in XI, a dumb gimmick that shouldn't be a defining or justifying factor.

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I don't think it's much about competing with avatars rather than them being able to work alongside avatars. At least, I don't think anyone is looking to have spirits replace avatars...

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But that's what making them good in any way other than another sideways use will do. Either they won't be good enough and will never be used (outside of what we already use them for), or they will be so good that they will get used more than avatars.

I would just say hold your breath til they release the roadmap they mentioned about job adjustements. It did sound like they were gonna give us a sneak peak of how they plan on changing each job and working on making it all balanced. It be nice if it's something they show after the bonanza marble purchase closes or even today. I've been curious about the road map ever since they mentioned it at the start of the month and it just makes me wonder what ideas they have in mind for each job.

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Originally Posted by dzero

Why complain about balance?

Because SE made a forum so they could get feedback from players...

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False, SE made this forum because people asked for it, in other forums. Oh wait, how does that work? PARADOX!

Because according to most of the people posting here, SE only reads and takes opinions from these forums (which is far from the truth)

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Originally Posted by Yarly

False, SE made this forum because people asked for it, in other forums. Oh wait, how does that work? PARADOX!

Because according to most of the people posting here, SE only reads and takes opinions from these forums (which is far from the truth)

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I'm sorry, "Because SE made a forum so that they could get feedback from players, provide quick responses and directly interact with the community".

I do agree that the current state of things is set out for an unfinished level cap rise. However, arguing for balance for the first 90 levels probably isn't a bad idea.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

if WHM/BLM/RDM are the most played jobs, how come when I try to form a party all I see is WAR WAR MNK MNK SAM NIN NIN SAM WAR MNK DRG?

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Because all of them were already invited. Welcome to ffxi and enjoy your seeking on melees.

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Originally Posted by Sparthos

You'll never find more COR than BLM because the class is inherently expensive to maintain and was released years after BLM.

Pre-Abyssea, COR was one of the most useful jobs you could use in an alliance setup and worked beautifully alongside a BRD in a party setup. The same will be true post Abyssea as well.

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Lolz. Pup is more expensive than cor just saying. Rdm too. Stop trying to find excuses. Seeing as only einherjar was done in alliances at 75, and after considering how crappy the rewards were, you understand why cor is so bad.

No, PUP and RDM are a one time investment on attachments and Spells. After you make that investment, its done. COR is pricey to keep up on bullet and card cost, if you actually use COR currently and get DD bullets.

I wouldnt take "MarkovChain" aka Pchan seriously, he was the guy that said BRD was useless at 75 esp for Salvage.

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Originally Posted by MarkovChain

Lolz. Pup is more expensive than cor just saying. Rdm too. Stop trying to find excuses. Seeing as only einherjar was done in alliances at 75, and after considering how crappy the rewards were, you understand why cor is so bad.

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PUP pays one time for attachments and some cheap oils.
COR pays continuously for consumable cards, ammo and once for rolls.

Steel Bullets are currently 22k/stack at the lowpoint in desirability for COR today. 2 years ago, that price was more like 30k+/stack. Even if you cheap'd it, NQ bullets have always been around 9-14k/stack.

I won't even bring up Oberon's.

Elemental Cards are about 4-5k/stack from the NPC but are more commonly on the AH for around double that.

Good to know you haven't changed one bit and can't even tell the difference between continuous operating costs and upfront startup costs.

Corsair as a job is useful as far as FFXI goes. It provides buffs, it offers debuff/damage utility through Quick Draw and it can offer ranged damage while doing all this.

It's the mage's Bard.

Goddammit I'm paying 75k for a stack of red curry buns and you complain about a stack that costs 20k at a time where npcing absolutely everything gives money and 20k of today is 2k of yesterday? I think you are really trying to find excuses. You can play cor without card who cares ; most melees or mages do not use food either. The truth is that using a bullet on cor serves no purpose you are here for rolls or else a melee or a mage is doing the job 10 times better. The truth is that putting a cor in the party increases the farming speed by zero and that why nobody wants them before whm blm mnk war nin brd. Because having all of haste, marches, avatars favors, cor rolls, enspells serves no purpose when the best way to farm in a party of 6 is to brew in stacks of 12. Because nothing is "zerked" when you spent most of your time with your back turned until it "procs". After seeing what they did to dynamis (moar procs) I have no hope in cor ever becoming useful.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

But that's what making them good in any way other than another sideways use will do. Either they won't be good enough and will never be used (outside of what we already use them for), or they will be so good that they will get used more than avatars.

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I don't think you thought that through. If something being better than something else means it replaces it, why does more than one melee job still exist?

People are silly, and pick jobs based on what they like. Same would be with spirits and avatars. People would use the ones they liked the most. Us versatile players would use both, because we like to mix our play styles.

Besides, there are already different content for different pets.

- Spirits: Fast nuking on mobs that do not AOE too much, and have no absorb damage.
- Avatars: Controlled damage, great on absorb monsters or AOE stun/silence monsters. Extra good against magic resistant. Allows MBing for extra damage.

We just miss that actual "fast nuking" part on spirits. Fix that and suddenly we are a strategic job, instead of a "toss more predator claws at it" job.

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Originally Posted by MarkovChain

Goddammit I'm paying 75k for a stack of red curry buns and you complain about a stack that costs 20k at a time where npcing absolutely everything gives money and 20k of today is 2k of yesterday?

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2 years ago when that census came out, you weren't eating Red Curry Buns because up until Abyssea only a handful of people would even touch Red Curry when Colibri were more than happy to take it away from you.

In '09 COR was expensive to maintain relative to other classes like dirt cheap BRD, dirt cheap SAM and other popular classes of the day. For the average player, why pick up a job with financial burdens when BRD plays close enough to it?

This doesn't mean COR isn't a good class.
It means people rather take the path of least resistance.
Surprise, Surprise.

Corsair in 2011 isn't played because Abyssea has completely undercut the power of buffs. When BRD is in the toilet, its obvious the more expensive BRD-variant will also be in the toilet.

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I think you are really trying to find excuses. You can play cor without card who cares ; most melees or mages do not use food either. The truth is that using a bullet on cor serves no purpose you are here for rolls or else a melee or a mage is doing the job 10 times better. The truth is that putting a cor in the party increases the farming speed by zero and that why nobody wants them before whm blm mnk war nin brd. Because having all of haste, marches, avatars favors, cor rolls, enspells serves no purpose when the best way to farm in a party of 6 is to brew in stacks of 12. Because nothing is "zerked" when you spent most of your time with your back turned until it "procs". After seeing what they did to dynamis (moar procs) I have no hope in cor ever becoming useful.

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Except I was never talking about Corsair in today's FFXI up until my commentary above.

If you dont quick draw on COR you're are pretty useless. Armaggddon changed COR DD for much better. Guess what? COR uses food as well so add that to even more costs.

Sorry Gimpchan, COR was good at 75, and is still good at 90, even for things outside of abyssea. COR rips Voidwatch.

Everyone knows once SMN gets to use spirits better they're just going to raep the entire game. Better level that SMN up guys!

spirits sucked when SMN was new, they suck now, and they'll suck forever. Forget about them, just steal their MP and move on.

My bad on COR it managed to beat PUP this year lolz. Seems I was correct with the 6 winners and the 3 losing jobs too. And to kimble bard lost like 6 places so yeah completely useless.

Well according to your cenus, Formless Strikes and Invigorate are the 2 best Group 2 merits for mnk.

Oh and I guess the Sand Sweeper is the 2nd hardest mob in the game since it has the 2nd highest rate of KOing a player.

All monk merits II suck you have to choose. Inbefore penance is useful. I don't see "a hardest mob in the game ranking".

So you're saying, slow a mobs rate of TP gain is uselss? Remember, the whole game isnt Abyssea and even INSIDE abyssea, its useful to slow a rate of tp gain a mob gets.

But I forget, Pchans world is just the one friend that can stand him and his whm mule.

Yes mobs TP gain is useless, cure VI etc. Not to mention that 98% of the crap dies before getting TP and the other 2% is basically bewed. Only BG noobs try to min/max abyssea right now.

Im pretty sure most +2 and empy weapon NMs TP a few times before they die....

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Originally Posted by MarkovChain

Do you want to take bets on SMN's position in the census that will come soon ? Noone played it at 75 and there are no more reasons to play it now. Simple. MNK, WHM, brew or bust = the game as of now.

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I love that SMN actually increased lol

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Originally Posted by Olor

I love that SMN actually increased lol

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I know...

We've all been talking about how bad summoner is lately, and how PUP has gotten better, but what a rank reversal.

That said, both jobs actually have a higher percentage- It's the decrease in the percentages for the top values- e.g. the number of people on each job is more balanced than before.

Wasn't the #1 spot like 14% last year, and the 20th spot just over 1%? As SE noted, the range between the most and least used jobs has decreased significantly.

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Originally Posted by Olor

I love that SMN actually increased lol

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It's 10th and there are 20 jobs. Still far from being useful.

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Originally Posted by MarkovChain

It's 10th and there are 20 jobs. Still far from being useful.

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The world isn't black or white. The job is less useful than others in a party situation, and very useful for solo or zerg strategies. Apparently we do a lot of solo and zerg these days, for getting to 10th place. In parties we are still below PUP in popularity.

No you don't do any kind of zerg nowadays, you spend your time procing, not killing. If I was going to solo something It would be either BLM or RDM for yellow !! or ninjar for red !!! or <insert staff job> for brew.

The whole game isnt Abyssea.

Because you don't spend your time procing outside too.

Well if you want to talk about procing IE, Dynamis and Voidwatch, guess what? Those use JA and Magic from all jobs so your point is moot in those instances.