Classic Server

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Originally Posted by Rubicant82

There are no Walmarts in Japan. But that is not even the point they have this awesome tech district in Toyko called Shinjiku that has aweosme electronics stores, but that is not the point.
Servers don't just operate like your home PC. they are a little bit more touche and temperamental. You can't just go buy a one terabite drive and stick it in. Most servers for things like MMOs are part of huge farms that the parent company uses for their whole company. So it is not just oh this one server is for FFXI. Server is a subjective term for allocated area of space for a program that allows others access.
I mentioned in the other post that if you look hard enough you will find plenty of "classic" privet servers. But SE has been cracking down on them hard lately. Which is absolutely silly if the PS was not charging money. I'm sure there are still some out there somewhere.

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Actually I have looked hard enough and know exactly what you are referring to and have been watching projects like this for years. They are not, and will not be what people are looking for, at least anytime soon. And the stability of them is garbage to say the least, let alone the functionality. This is neither here nor there also considering people on the forums could care less what a third party does, let alone the discussion is prohibited on the forums.

Did you just say I don't get the point? While also commenting that Japan doesn't have a walmart without apparently getting my point? On top of it all, servers DO work in terms you can back stuff up, and transfer data. Apparently SE doesn't know how to do such things though?

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Originally Posted by Zarchery

You really think Square Enix is keeping backups of 6+ year old game data for no reason other than possibly appeasing some handful of people who can't stop living in the past?

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These people have this naive feeling that the old Valkrum Dunes and Yhoator Jungle will be filled with noobs again waiting to be MPKed. That they would find constatly people to play with for a whole day in those areas to get 5-10 levels or maybe even delevel at the end of the day.

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Originally Posted by Rubicant82

There are no Walmarts in Japan. But that is not even the point they have this awesome tech district in Toyko called Shinjiku that has aweosme electronics stores, but that is not the point.
Servers don't just operate like your home PC. they are a little bit more touche and temperamental. You can't just go buy a one terabite drive and stick it in. Most servers for things like MMOs are part of huge farms that the parent company uses for their whole company. So it is not just oh this one server is for FFXI. Server is a subjective term for allocated area of space for a program that allows others access.
I mentioned in the other post that if you look hard enough you will find plenty of "classic" privet servers. But SE has been cracking down on them hard lately. Which is absolutely silly if the PS was not charging money. I'm sure there are still some out there somewhere.

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Ease of accomplishing it or not, its regular practice to backup your software even for mmo companies or these kinds of classic servers wouldn't exist anywhere so we cant say they don't have it unless they tell us so.

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Originally Posted by Spectreman

These people have this naive feeling that the old Valkrum Dunes and Yhoator Jungle will be filled with noobs again waiting to be MPKed. That they would find constatly people to play with for a whole day in those areas to get 5-10 levels or maybe even delevel at the end of the day.

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In what way is that your problem? I think the population would be fine but thats irrelevant to you as you don't want the server. If you don't want it, why do you care if people are on it having party troubles? (if your response is that you don't care then why are you here when it doesn't affect you)

this is a great idea and i don't see why people are arguing it, we don't want their current servers to go away...well we do but we're not asking for that, we're asking to make everyone happy

First off, I do want to say that this is a cool idea. I would love to party with people again in the traditional manner. However, I Think it would be risky on their part. A lot of people keep saying, "what if it works, it will be great. People would come back to the game and everything would be awesome." However, no one asks the question of "What if it doesn't work." It would most likely cost them a lot of money. And if it does not work, it could possibly spell the end for ffxi. I would also like to throw out there that they were losing players while the cap was still at 75. Which is why they did a server merge. I believe they did the server merge on the exact update that Abyssea and level 80 cap was introduced.

Now, a little off topic here, but this is directed towards Jblauh. I honestly can't believe you have the nerve to call someone else in these forums an idiot or an asshole when you seem like the biggest one of them all (which also makes you a hypocrite). Let me ask you, does it make you feel like a big man to threaten people left and right to kick there ass over the internet. See there is a name for something like that. It is called "Cyber Bullying." You should look it up. Keep in mind I am not trying to start something with you. You may not even realize what you are doing, but I figured I would point it out.

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Originally Posted by mattkoko

First off, I do want to say that this is a cool idea. I would love to party with people again in the traditional manner. However, I Think it would be risky on their part. A lot of people keep saying, "what if it works, it will be great. People would come back to the game and everything would be awesome." However, no one asks the question of "What if it doesn't work." It would most likely cost them a lot of money. And if it does not work, it could possibly spell the end for ffxi. I would also like to throw out there that they were losing players while the cap was still at 75. Which is why they did a server merge. I believe they did the server merge on the exact update that Abyssea and level 80 cap was introduced.

Now, a little off topic here, but this is directed towards Jblauh. I honestly can't believe you have the nerve to call someone else in these forums an idiot or an asshole when you seem like the biggest one of them all (which also makes you a hypocrite). Let me ask you, does it make you feel like a big man to threaten people left and right to kick there ass over the internet. See there is a name for something like that. It is called "Cyber Bullying." You should look it up. Keep in mind I am not trying to start something with you. You may not even realize what you are doing, but I figured I would point it out.

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I have considered the impact and I think it would be minimal if done smartly. I've already suggested the idea that, considering pops on current servers are small that they do a merge and use one of the servers people were merged out of to make this classic server. So there would be no added server costs, just the time it takes to set up the server which could vary a bit but I don't think its something that SE can't handle even if the project were a failure which I don't think it will be.

Your second paragraph... not helping, don't pick a fight.

You could be right. Like I said, I think it is a cool idea. I could also see the dev team seeing it as risky if it does cost them a lot money. Right now FFXI is bringing them steady income and I can see them not wanting to risk everything when they are still getting something out of it

As far as my second paragraph goes, maybe I got a little out of hand, but I also feel it was important to point out that he is being a cyber bully. Though I don't agree with everything Zachery and Draylo say, I have never seen them threaten to beat the crap out of someone through the computer. I will behave though lol

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Originally Posted by mattkoko

However, I Think it would be risky on their part. A lot of people keep saying, "what if it works, it will be great. People would come back to the game and everything would be awesome." However, no one asks the question of "What if it doesn't work."

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Speaking for myself, I haven't ignored that possibility. That's why I think it would be a good idea to gauge the amount of interest first before moving forward, with something along the lines of a community poll that anyone could be a part of. No harm in testing the waters to see how interested people would be in the idea.

Besides, on the other side of the community, plenty of Japanese folks have expressed interest in a classic server. Both on 2ch and on the official forums, it's a topic that comes up almost regularly.

I would think that with the combined amount of interest from both sides of the community, there would be more than enough players to support a single classic server (or possibly more, as in Lineage 2's case).

It's no problem. I am not going to claim myself as Mr. Innocent. I have been guilty in the past myself. Not everyone realizes what they are saying or doing until it is pointed out to them. I know I have needed people to point stuff out to me too lol.

The world is full of what ifs. The same could be directed towards what if it does work. What if releasing these servers created so much success SE could develop further FFXI content without any resource constraints. The idea behind this isn't what if it didn't work, but provided success that it did work with our limited knowledge of other companies that have taken advantage of things like this with success, so why not. Of course there is always a realm of possibility that it wouldn't be successful, but we are straying away from that idea because that is a realm of possibility in everything. There is a chance I go outside and get hit by a car at the bottom of my driveway.

I understand this. My point is why risk losing money when they are already making a steady income from the current game. I am not trying to read SE's mind or anything. Just making a point. It is impossible to make an informed decision with out weighing both the risks and the benefits. First comes weighing the risks with the benefits, then comes deciding whether it is worth the risk. There is no way you can possibly say this can be a complete success. I already admit I think it is a cool idea. And I am all for making everyone happy. But if it doesn't work and it does fail and it kills FFXI all together, then no one is happy. I can see SE being worried about something like this.

That is true, why risk it. That's why we try and present situations to kind of remove the risk. Almost give an acceptable certainty that there isn't a risk to take. I strongly feel what it comes down to is the costs to maintain such a server. What would SE have to receive in numbers of players to make such server acceptably viable. I don't know how to go about finding that information, specially more considering our server would most likely be hosted in Japan, what the server costs would consist of roughly. Even more so we don't know how much of their staff it would require to maintain this server(s) which could be detrimental to SE's finances from 11. That is why though we present success that these other companies have had, to almost try and remove that uncertainty. Better yet, I wonder what the best route would be to direct internet traffic to 1 designated poll to maybe better have an understanding of how many people would support such an idea that currently don't play 11 at all, because it's too hard to put like a poll lets say on bg and expect that to be accurate, if that makes any sense what I'm getting at.

That does make sense. And I agree it would be much more helpful to be able to make a pole outside of these forums considering the players no longer subscribed probably don't even bother with forums anymore. But some sort of advertising would have to be made to get those poles public to those that may be interested that don't have connections with FFXI anymore.

Sorry this post is kind of rushed and would love to touch up on more but I got to get ready to go to work. It's been fun debating though lol

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Originally Posted by Yadam

first i'd like to say, i posted a thread just like this a few weeks back and didn't get any good feedback, but i am excited to see more people agree , i knew there was more people out there who wanted this! this idea is perfect and i support it 100%, we need SE to hear us! idk how to do that exactly but if you create a petition or anything like that, let me know i will support it and my friends will too

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Well we need to keep the thread alive and support coming with the 1 week free play anyone can post on here so try gathering all the support you can xD

The only way that SE would be able to make this sever work is you have 1200 people who wanted to play on it.
So why not make a petition and get people to sign it. Get enough sigs and maybe SE will listen.
As a corporate officer in a company, I can tell you that they will listen with enough voices. Nothing grabs upper managements attention like paperwork, esp one that has a ton of backing. But arguing back and forth on the forums is not going to give you that satisfaction, nor will it give SE the "warm fuzzy" that they want to get something like this up and running.

I miss the old days to a point, because they have great memories, but I think a lot of people who "miss" them are dewling in nostalgia of how things use to be compared to how they are now... and once they realize how bad it use to be under the tyranny that was the 75 capped World of Tanaka, they will run back to the normal servers and the classic server will do exactly what would have happened to the rest of the game if it had not changed; wither and die.
But! All the more power to you in getting something like it off the ground.

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Originally Posted by mattkoko

I understand this. My point is why risk losing money when they are already making a steady income from the current game. I am not trying to read SE's mind or anything. Just making a point. It is impossible to make an informed decision with out weighing both the risks and the benefits. First comes weighing the risks with the benefits, then comes deciding whether it is worth the risk. There is no way you can possibly say this can be a complete success. I already admit I think it is a cool idea. And I am all for making everyone happy. But if it doesn't work and it does fail and it kills FFXI all together, then no one is happy. I can see SE being worried about something like this.

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I highly doubt it would kill FFXI, considering the fact this would be 1 server while the other current ones would still be running. If charged the usual monthly fee for this classic server as well and it brought people in the gain would be there and even if its not a gain then the current servers would still bring the profit. The costs to run a server such as this is questionable considering it wouldnt really be any different than the others aside from some changes here and there, however it could take some time to add/remove things as needed to get a classic server within an acceptable range adding all the new beneficial things from current ffxi to old ffxi ex: more storage, the changes to dynamis, HNMs, etc (think id keep few warps and do away with all the others lol)

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Originally Posted by Rubicant82

The only way that SE would be able to make this sever work is you have 1200 people who wanted to play on it.
So why not make a petition and get people to sign it. Get enough sigs and maybe SE will listen.
As a corporate officer in a company, I can tell you that they will listen with enough voices. Nothing grabs upper managements attention like paperwork, esp one that has a ton of backing. But arguing back and forth on the forums is not going to give you that satisfaction, nor will it give SE the "warm fuzzy" that they want to get something like this up and running.

I miss the old days to a point, because they have great memories, but I think a lot of people who "miss" them are dewling in nostalgia of how things use to be compared to how they are now... and once they realize how bad it use to be under the tyranny that was the 75 capped World of Tanaka, they will run back to the normal servers and the classic server will do exactly what would have happened to the rest of the game if it had not changed; wither and die.
But! All the more power to you in getting something like it off the ground.

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Nah, this "nostalgia" you speak of isnt there ive heard that term over and over and fact is those who actually would play on a server like this and stay are those who KNOW how hard things were in the past hell i spent 5 years to get a relic and when i obtained it, that was the highlight of my ffxi career was my highest achievement. Things then actually gave that feeling as opposed to now when its handed to you easily and even the hardest parts of current ffxi doesnt make it feel much of an achievement, little separates those who are horrid players to, hate the term but "elite" players who know whats what. Even with top tier gear its not hard for anybody to get the exact same thing even leveling isnt an achievement in current ffxi its a quick rush to fully gear up and move on to the next.

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Originally Posted by Rubicant82

The only way that SE would be able to make this sever work is you have 1200 people who wanted to play on it.
So why not make a petition and get people to sign it. Get enough sigs and maybe SE will listen.
As a corporate officer in a company, I can tell you that they will listen with enough voices. Nothing grabs upper managements attention like paperwork, esp one that has a ton of backing. But arguing back and forth on the forums is not going to give you that satisfaction, nor will it give SE the "warm fuzzy" that they want to get something like this up and running.

I miss the old days to a point, because they have great memories, but I think a lot of people who "miss" them are dewling in nostalgia of how things use to be compared to how they are now... and once they realize how bad it use to be under the tyranny that was the 75 capped World of Tanaka, they will run back to the normal servers and the classic server will do exactly what would have happened to the rest of the game if it had not changed; wither and die.
But! All the more power to you in getting something like it off the ground.

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I've had a discussion about this with several people. A lot of the old stuff revolves around more-or-less the friendships that were created. If I could play FFXI today with the same group of people without a fear of them quitting every other month. Those feelings would still exist. So I'm kind of 2 sided. I legimitely want a server like this so I can have the grind all over because personally, I love grindy stuff. I also want it because I feel like people would potentially stay around longer if they played here. Giving me that "warm fuzzy" feeling. On the other hand, I would also not want to play on it, because I enjoy the idea of how casual the game has gone. I enjoy the fact that I can basically do all the content that a server like this would offer, except solo. I enjoy that there is the idea that I could play the game only a couple hours a day and still be on top (though I play it all day).

On another note, there is nothing wrong at all with nostalgia. I still enjoy my reese's peanut butter cups, not just because they are good, but because I also enjoyed them when I was a child.

Also, we have shown multiple instances of the possible success of a server like this. Can any of the people who claim a server like this wouldn't work, or would provide any proof to those claims? Or do we just keep defending some fabrication? Not saying proof doesn't exist, just merely pointing out that it gets pretty repetitive providing the same defense over and over when people seem to not look at the information already given.

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Originally Posted by PlumbGame

Also, we have shown multiple instances of the possible success of a server like this. Can any of the people who claim a server like this wouldn't work, or would provide any proof to those claims? Or do we just keep defending some fabrication?

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Where have you (or anyone) given proof that this sever would be a success?
You cannot say that another games success at a classic server means this game's would succeed.
Also demanding proof of an opinion from someone is about as worthwhile as using a siv to gather water.
but if you want to use other games as examples here are a few:
Dark Age of Camelot - Classic server was running for about 1 year and then shut down due to low popularity.
World of Warcraft - So concerned about their "classic" zones they tore them apart so that players could have access to flying mounts in them, and update the graphics used.

Now sense I said you can use other games to prove it would work by all rights it makes the examples I have above null as well.

I'm not saying that you shouldn't pursue the idea. But I am saying you are going to need more than a handful of people on a forum talking bout it.
And with supporters calling other people rather inappropriate names in threads, it is not helping.
Hence why I suggested a petition.

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Originally Posted by Rubicant82

Dark Age of Camelot - Classic server was running for about 1 year and then shut down due to low popularity.
World of Warcraft - So concerned about their "classic" zones they tore them apart so that players could have access to flying mounts in them, and update the graphics used.

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Your advice (petition) wouldn't be a bad idea but I chose to do it here for the specific reason that this is considered the "official" place to give feedback for the game. Go ahead and look at SE's website, it tells you to come here for feedback so I did. Your examples however I think are poor as the WoW one is not even remotely close to a 'classic' server and it also was not a failure either. For dark age, I don't recall that ever existing in anything other than free shards.... I mean if it did they must not have gotten the word out at all because litterally on every single game forum i've ever been on do ppl ask for the dark age of camelot experience and Camelot unchained was funded crowd funded to bring the old school dark age of camelot experience back. So, I can't say either one is really much of a strike against this. I also contest that it cant be compared to other games (when the two games are facing similar situations) and in this case I would compare it to everquest as everquest and ffxi are highly similar. Both have similar gameplay, both are very old and have limited dev teams and players and both have been modernized with time yet everquest made classic servers where ffxi has not.

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Originally Posted by Rubicant82

Where have you (or anyone) given proof that this sever would be a success?
You cannot say that another games success at a classic server means this game's would succeed.
Also demanding proof of an opinion from someone is about as worthwhile as using a siv to gather water.
but if you want to use other games as examples here are a few:
Dark Age of Camelot - Classic server was running for about 1 year and then shut down due to low popularity.
World of Warcraft - So concerned about their "classic" zones they tore them apart so that players could have access to flying mounts in them, and update the graphics used.

Now sense I said you can use other games to prove it would work by all rights it makes the examples I have above null as well.

I'm not saying that you shouldn't pursue the idea. But I am saying you are going to need more than a handful of people on a forum talking bout it.
And with supporters calling other people rather inappropriate names in threads, it is not helping.
Hence why I suggested a petition.

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Originally Posted by PlumbGame

Also, we have shown multiple instances of the possible success of a server like this.

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Also, I know for a fact you have no idea about WoW, because they have commented on it being something currently not being worked on, and could be a possibility in the future. Actually I know so for a fact since I was one of the most recent people to make a thread about it on the WoW forums.

You also imply your statements meaning everything anyone says is opinions, so everything is moot and why are we communicating in the first place? You also have 1 person calling someone else a rather inappropriate name in a thread, not everyone which your implication implies. Would you like me to show you people that call people who support this idea names (which still doesn't help the cause that this shouldn't happen)? Just arguing towards your irrelevant comments towards the subject now.

So basically you all want a lvl 75 capped, pre-Abyssea server to play on? All Right here's a couple of things you need to consider...

1. Leveling. a. population. You realize that if you weren't a PLD, WHM,or RDM and <insert DD or magic DD Here> you really had a hard time to get a party?

2. Dynamis Finding a competent WHM in Dynamis was like searching for the lost Ark of the Covenant. Dynamis was the lynchpin of the endgame @lvl 75, do you really think that you could find about even 20 players that could fit Dynamis into their schedules at the same time on a classic server? and even if you could find those 20, who could guarantee that you'd be able to find at least 1 or 2 competent healers, so the whole thing wouldn't be an even worse death fest than it was.

-Honestly, I miss old school partying in the game, could meet new people and go out and level, It was a great way to meet new people etc. but it's the only thing I miss.

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Originally Posted by Teraniku

So basically you all want a lvl 75 capped, pre-Abyssea server to play on? All Right here's a couple of things you need to consider...

1. Leveling. a. population. You realize that if you weren't a PLD, WHM,or RDM and <insert DD or magic DD Here> you really had a hard time to get a party?

2. Dynamis Finding a competent WHM in Dynamis was like searching for the lost Ark of the Covenant. Dynamis was the lynchpin of the endgame @lvl 75, do you really think that you could find about even 20 players that could fit Dynamis into their schedules at the same time on a classic server? and even if you could find those 20, who could guarantee that you'd be able to find at least 1 or 2 competent healers, so the whole thing wouldn't be an even worse death fest than it was.

-Honestly, I miss old school partying in the game, could meet new people and go out and level, It was a great way to meet new people etc. but it's the only thing I miss.

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PLD, WHM, or RDM? I leveled up several jobs without ever even seeing a PLD. WHM OR RDM, but in some instances I even had a SCH as a healer, a BRD as a healer, even a BLM as a healer. I've seen DRG's do it with pets (this was more of burn parties though that were full of drgs, but just more fuel to the fire that you are incorrect), SMN's sub whm and do it, implementation of DNC, people just do it themselves. Even had parties where everyone was /nin and would just try to burn stuff before you couldn't keep shadows up.

You also imply that dynamis was an all day event. I bet you spend more time spamming delves than you do in dyna (even more so given it was what, every 3 days that you could go in for a couple of hours).

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Originally Posted by Teraniku

1. Leveling. a. population. You realize that if you weren't a PLD, WHM,or RDM and <insert DD or magic DD Here> you really had a hard time to get a party?

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Rarely did I ever have difficulty getting a party, and Dragoon was the first job I took to 75. If you weren't getting invites, you should have taken the initiative to form your own groups. That's what I did, and I got to 75 relatively easily. This was on top of my 40 hour work schedule.

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Originally Posted by Teraniku

2. Dynamis Finding a competent WHM in Dynamis was like searching for the lost Ark of the Covenant. Dynamis was the lynchpin of the endgame @lvl 75, do you really think that you could find about even 20 players that could fit Dynamis into their schedules at the same time on a classic server? and even if you could find those 20, who could guarantee that you'd be able to find at least 1 or 2 competent healers, so the whole thing wouldn't be an even worse death fest than it was.

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My linkshell at the time specialized in Sky/Sea/Dynamis/Limbus. Not having enough people was never an issue, because everyone who had joined the shell was aware of the times we did those events. That's why they joined in the first place, because it worked well with their schedules. We never had any issues clearing content either.

Removed because of trolling.

this is a great idea and i'm going to get my old ffxi buddies to sign this petition!

And what about all the clear improvements that have been made? like checking prices of the items you want to sell on the AH? things like home points added on maps, trusts, new jobs, gearswap macros, menu improvements, getting around, increased inventory size, tied AH, some HMN's are now pops and more i expect i have forgotten.

There are many things i miss about the old FF11, but in many ways it always was a bit backwards and had a lot of un-needed fat. And if this happened i really doubt you would get as many people as you think you will.

I just realized... You would need to make sure WotG isn't included, since its updates bring you smack dab into the middle of the level cap increase (the reward earring is lvl 90).

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Originally Posted by Bamph

I just realized... You would need to make sure WotG isn't included, since its updates bring you smack dab into the middle of the level cap increase (the reward earring is lvl 90).

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As stated originally, the point I would like the server locked at would be the last patch before abyssea (and/or before fields of valor/grounds of valor was repeatable back to back, I remember this was added right around the same time but it may have been slightly before abyssea and it needs to not be on the server). So everything up to that point is ok, sadly wings would just have to be in with an incomplete storyline unless extra work was to be put in to add it back but scaled down to a lvl 75 which I am not willing to ask for at the moment and push my luck.

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Originally Posted by Makenshi

And what about all the clear improvements that have been made? like checking prices of the items you want to sell on the AH? things like home points added on maps, trusts, new jobs, gearswap macros, menu improvements, getting around, increased inventory size, tied AH, some HMN's are now pops and more i expect i have forgotten.

There are many things i miss about the old FF11, but in many ways it always was a bit backwards and had a lot of un-needed fat. And if this happened i really doubt you would get as many people as you think you will.

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Well for one, I imagine a lot of people who want this kind of server haven't even stuck around to notice your improvements. I personally don't consider most of them improvements, such as your quick travel. Sure, for you maybe you don't care about it at this point but I never hated the travel and actually enjoyed it from time to time. Right now the game suffers the same problem ffxiv does, you just teleport everywhere and it removes the worldliness of the game. To explain, I felt a lot of the improvements broke immersion and turned ffxi from a fantasy world into an 'arcade' if you will (you just pick your activity shoot there and jump to the next activity) which is not what I look for in my rpgs. There are other kinds of games that do that kind of thing better imo, I come to rpgs to get into their worlds.

WOTG wasnt finished when aby came along? O_O

I agree there has been some quality of life improvements to the game which have definitely been welcomed, but nothing that would be detrimental for me in terms of playing on a classic server.

you're just experiencing nostalgia fever. Even with such a server, you'll go back and play it and discover its just not the same as when you did it all the first time.

The only thing I want from 2009 or earlier is the server player counts. I don't want to go back to waiting hours for a 6 man party to gain EXP etc while idling in town most of the time. At least now if I want to do something I can usually just go do it.

The reasons that put me off from playing now are not the content design or anything, but rather simply the fact that they don't seem to be willing to do certain things to improve and polish the game systems, and when they do try to do something, they keep going about it the wrong way. That plus the 23458345 "we have no plans to do this" posts.

I'm not really even sure if this suggestion is even possible. It assumes that they still have the game code/assets/data from the game in a state from several years ago. I actually highly doubt they've retained that.

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Well for one, I imagine a lot of people who want this kind of server haven't even stuck around to notice your improvements. I personally don't consider most of them improvements, such as your quick travel. Sure, for you maybe you don't care about it at this point but I never hated the travel and actually enjoyed it from time to time

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There are tons of improvements. Things like showing the price history when you're listing items makes a huge difference and saves time that I could be spending killing evil monsters and doing quests etc. And having more travel options doesn't prevent you from traveling the old fashioned way if you want.

Also, if the people who want this kind of server haven't stuck around to notice these improvements, that raises an important question: Why didn't they stick around? If they left before all this new stuff, then there were problems with the game, which you want to go back to, that made them leave. I have thousands and thousands of hours of game play time. a HUGE chunk of it was spent doing nothing but waiting. That combined with people hating the jobs I enjoyed playing made me almost quit several times, long before abyssea, WOTG or Audolin ever came along.

The reason there are fewer players around now really just boils down to the fact that this is a really old game at this point. Many people have had their fun, came and gone. In many cases, it's the friendships made that keep the current people playing, they're here to socialize. It really has little to do with how much "better" or "worse" you feel the game has become in the last several years. Honestly, I think there are a lot of good things about the game right now, the only reason I've not held a continuous subscription recently is ismply because after 10+ years, I have a ton of games I want to play and I just moved on. It's not because i don't like the game now or liked it more years ago.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

you're just experiencing nostalgia fever. Even with such a server, you'll go back and play it and discover its just not the same as when you did it all the first time.

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Your line of reasoning is based on what, exactly?

"Nostalgia" is an excuse that gets thrown around commonly, but the only ones being influenced by "nostalgia" are the ones exaggerating about how awful the game used to be with hyperbole.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

I don't want to go back to waiting hours for a 6 man party to gain EXP etc while idling in town most of the time. At least now if I want to do something I can usually just go do it.

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Okay...? Then you don't have to. We're not asking for every server to be reverted back to the way they were. We're asking for the inclusion of a single classic server for those that want it.

If you're having fun with the way the game currently plays, then kudos. Enjoy the main servers. But why deny a classic server for those that prefer the way the game used to be played, when it's not going to impede your enjoyment of the game at all?

Look at the success of the Lineage 2 classic servers. They're currently the most populated servers in the game, and it's helped improve Lineage 2's overall development and longevity. What if this game was able to share that same success?

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

Also, if the people who want this kind of server haven't stuck around to notice these improvements, that raises an important question: Why didn't they stick around?

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I can only speak for myself, but I disagreed with the direction the game was heading in. I played until Abyssea was released, and then stopped. Up until that point, I was enjoying myself. I'm pretty sure the others feel the same way, but I won't speak on their behalf.

I can only say that before Abyssea came along, this game's population was at its highest point, and then it began to decline after it was released.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

you're just experiencing nostalgia fever. Even with such a server, you'll go back and play it and discover its just not the same as when you did it all the first time.

The only thing I want from 2009 or earlier is the server player counts. I don't want to go back to waiting hours for a 6 man party to gain EXP etc while idling in town most of the time. At least now if I want to do something I can usually just go do it.

The reasons that put me off from playing now are not the content design or anything, but rather simply the fact that they don't seem to be willing to do certain things to improve and polish the game systems, and when they do try to do something, they keep going about it the wrong way. That plus the 23458345 "we have no plans to do this" posts.

I'm not really even sure if this suggestion is even possible. It assumes that they still have the game code/assets/data from the game in a state from several years ago. I actually highly doubt they've retained that.

There are tons of improvements. Things like showing the price history when you're listing items makes a huge difference and saves time that I could be spending killing evil monsters and doing quests etc. And having more travel options doesn't prevent you from traveling the old fashioned way if you want.

Also, if the people who want this kind of server haven't stuck around to notice these improvements, that raises an important question: Why didn't they stick around? If they left before all this new stuff, then there were problems with the game, which you want to go back to, that made them leave. I have thousands and thousands of hours of game play time. a HUGE chunk of it was spent doing nothing but waiting. That combined with people hating the jobs I enjoyed playing made me almost quit several times, long before abyssea, WOTG or Audolin ever came along.

The reason there are fewer players around now really just boils down to the fact that this is a really old game at this point. Many people have had their fun, came and gone. In many cases, it's the friendships made that keep the current people playing, they're here to socialize. It really has little to do with how much "better" or "worse" you feel the game has become in the last several years. Honestly, I think there are a lot of good things about the game right now, the only reason I've not held a continuous subscription recently is ismply because after 10+ years, I have a ton of games I want to play and I just moved on. It's not because i don't like the game now or liked it more years ago.

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Yeah you are right. Thank you for telling us how we feel. Without you I have no idea how my life would go on.

Gullibleness aside really assuming you think they haven't backed up anything let alone being able to recreate anything. You completely misinterpreted the said person you quoted. They said that comment to imply that a lot of players that want the classic experience haven't experienced any of the new quality of life improvements making it a moot point for someone wanting to play this era.

You also try to validate your argument by implying that all quality of life changes that currently exist in the game have been there since said era that players want. When that is completely fabricated and not true at all. Better yet, you don't even know what said problems are that you are referring to. Said quality of life improvements COULD be the reason players quit.

To your last paragraph, that is one reason these servers could prove successful, and why many of the people for them have posted examples of other companies doing such things and them being successful, so people can re-experience the game at a point they felt it wasn't too "old" or "boring".

You yourself admit to not even having an active subscription at this time, also negating any real opinion you have since I can just assume you have no idea what you are saying about current FFXI. I also do know you have moved on because I have had the pleasure of fixing your mistakes or misinformation and just general fail on FFXIV.

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Okay...? Then you don't have to. We're not asking for every server to be reverted back to the way they were.

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Unless everyone got on board with it, you'd have exactly the same problem that I had back in the day.

There just aren't enough like minded people to populate a server and not have the problem of waiting too long to be able to do something.

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You also try to validate your argument by implying that all quality of life changes that currently exist in the game have been there since said era that players want. When that is completely fabricated and not true at all.

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That's... not what I said at all? In fact, I was quite sure i said the exact opposite? that many QOL changes have been introduced since said era, not that they already existed before the end of it?

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You yourself admit to not even having an active subscription at this time, also negating any real opinion you have since I can just assume you have no idea what you are saying about current FFXI.

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Way to make assumptions and find excuses to invalidate my opinions. My opinions are my opinions, you can't just say something and invalidate them.

I played almost continuously up til just before the release of audolin. Even after audolin I've been playing on and off. CURRENTLY AT THIS PRESENT MOMENT i am not subscribed, but I am playing the free week and am playing as I write this.

Why are you so anxious to tear apart anyone who doesn't agree with the premise of the thread? How about you just let me and anyone else who might be in my position have their opinion and agree to disagree? How about base your criticisms on real issues rather than your judgement of my playtime?

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To your last paragraph, that is one reason these servers could prove successful,

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My las paragraph describes why they probably wouldn't be successful- Because the reasons that people are playing or not playing right now wouldn't be fixed by sending the game through a time machine.

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Gullibleness aside really assuming you think they haven't backed up anything let alone being able to recreate anything.

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I wouldn't be so sure about this. Even in FFXIV they apparently don't keep some of their data very long (when "Savage" version of Second Coil of Bahamut was released, people asked if they'd do it for the first one and the Producer said that he wasn't sure if they still had the original data from when coil was being developed). Even if they did, it would be no simple matter to introduce a server like this. It would take development resources and would slow down progress on updates for the current game. You're basically asking them to have two development branches- and unless the "old server" branch gets some kind of updates and new content, you're going to get bored with it eventually. So lets say they do make new content for the old version- now we have fewer resources spread across two development branches. I really don't see how this is feasable, even if playing devil's advocate and regarding this idea as more popular than I think it is.

I don't feel like this idea is realistically doable by the development team, even if I did want it. It would come at the expense of all the people currently playing the current game.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

Unless everyone got on board with it, you'd have exactly the same problem that I had back in the day.

There just aren't enough like minded people to populate a server and not have the problem of waiting too long to be able to do something.

That's... not what I said at all? In fact, I was quite sure i said the exact opposite? that many QOL changes have been introduced since said era, not that they already existed before the end of it?

Way to make assumptions and find excuses to invalidate my opinions. My opinions are my opinions, you can't just say something and invalidate them.

I played almost continuously up til just before the release of audolin. Even after audolin I've been playing on and off. CURRENTLY AT THIS PRESENT MOMENT i am not subscribed, but I am playing the free week and am playing as I write this.

Why are you so anxious to tear apart anyone who doesn't agree with the premise of the thread? How about you just let me and anyone else who might be in my position have their opinion and agree to disagree?

My las paragraph describes why they probably wouldn't be successful- Because the reasons that people are playing or not playing right now wouldn't be fixed by sending the game through a time machine.

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Just like to make sure people aren't swayed based off misinformation if someone came in here maybe wondering if this was a good or bad idea and where people stand. I've had lovely discussions with many people for and against. I would expect people to point out where I'm wrong also, just like people have, and I have to others responses, and start a debate on an issue that could be presented as a valid issue with these server, and some have been brought up. Your comments have already been brought up not only several times, but you are just plainly either misinformed, or giving misinformation. I'm a bit biased towards your comments though because I have seen you here and there in both games and the crap you post, (and even had to deal with personal attacks from you in tells back in the days when I said you were wrong in a shout about the pvp info you were preaching) so although my post wasn't intended to be blunt except the very last sentence, I can see how it would come off that way.

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Your comments have already been brought up not only several times, but you are just plainly either misinformed, or giving misinformation.

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I'm not "misinformed," nor am I giving misinformation. I am sharing my opinion on a forum topic, nothing more.

You aren't even on my server, I don't know who you are, and I've never made personal attacks against you (nor have I ever intentionally made personal attacks on anyone in general- I'm very defensive [a personality flaw I wholly admit to] and pretty much every negative thing ive ever said about anyone has been a defensive reaction to an attack against me)

So how about we just drop the personal biases for one moment and try treating each other respectfully? Your previous post (above this one you made) came off as extremely condecending.

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I can only say that before Abyssea came along, this game's population was at its highest point, and then it began to decline after it was released.

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FFXI's population peak was a few years after it's release. Not right before abyssea by a long shot. Just like any game, the population will gradually decline over time as fewer new players come in (because they're off playing whatver latest new game comes along). No MMO or other is excempt from this.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

Unless everyone got on board with it, you'd have exactly the same problem that I had back in the day.

There just aren't enough like minded people to populate a server and not have the problem of waiting too long to be able to do something.

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Again I'll ask... your line of reasoning is based on what, exactly? Rather than basing your reasoning on evidence or research, your feelings are dictating your assumptions. I've already mentioned this before, but more people are in favor of the idea than against it, both in this thread and the other one.

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

I'm not "misinformed," nor am I giving misinformation.

You aren't even on my server, I don't know who you are, and I've never made personal attacks against you (nor have I ever intentionally made personal attacks on anyone in general- I'm very defensive [a personality flaw I wholly admit to] and pretty much every negative thing ive ever said about anyone has been a defensive reaction to an attack against me)

So how about we just drop the personal biases for one moment and try treating each other respectfully?

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Just cause my character name is Dravidian here, doesn't mean it is that in FFXIV. I'm not personally attacking you, I'm pointing out that I quote people like you to fix any misinformation being present. You seem to be taking it personal like you would think everyone just agrees with you or no one would ever point out you are wrong. Just because I'm using other stuff to validate you being wrong, doesn't mean I don't respect you. It's part of removing any credibility.

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I've already mentioned this before, but more people are in favor of the idea than against it, both in this thread and the other one.

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You're making just as many assumptions. Only a handful of people that play the game read and post on the forums. Just because some people post in your thread and like your idea does not mean everyone does. You also really can't speak for anyone who hasn't played the game in years as they might not read this forum either, nor can they post on it to say whether or not they want it.

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I'm pointing out that I quote people like you to fix any misinformation being present.

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It only seems to be misinformation if it doesn't paint your idea in the brightest light. I'm not saying this to be mean, but that's the impression I get based on how passionately you react to criticism of the idea.

Please correct my "misinformation" when you've conducted an extensive scientific survey consisting of a meaningful percentage of the current playerbase. Until then you can't just discredit me by saying I'm relying on assumptions, because you don't have a lot of data yet you act like you have all the information.

I do appriciate you being more respectful. Please understand that while I may not be backing your idea I do not intend any hostility and I do respect your position even if I don't agree.