Relic weapons for all jobs.

giving all jobs access to a relic weapon would not make things equal, jobs such as sam which gets access to two relics or ranger with two relics and empyrean, paladin with two empyrean ect ect.

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Originally Posted by Nala

giving all jobs access to a relic weapon would not make things equal, jobs such as sam which gets access to two relics or ranger with two relics and empyrean, paladin with two empyrean ect ect.

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SAM with Empyrean Bow or Paladin with Great sword and so on is pretty moot since it's by standards that players don't really do it, so really. It's a moot topic. Paladins and SAM still have their relic, empyrean, and mythics. COR, BLU, PUP, DNC, SCH, however, cannot use any of the relics. This is the idea of the thread.

Obviously as follows:

Dancer -> Mandau
Corsair -> Annihilator
Scholar -> Claustrum (Though no one in the right mind would do this unless for the sake of achievement)
Blue Mage -> Excalibur
Puppetmaster -> Spharai (Again, I can see some issues with this due to Counter on Spharai, but frankly, it's a nice bonus for pup)

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Originally Posted by Nala

giving all jobs access to a relic weapon would not make things equal, jobs such as sam which gets access to two relics or ranger with two relics and empyrean, paladin with two empyrean ect ect.

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So, if they can't even things out completely, they shouldn't even out things where they can?

I would argue blu should actually get mjollnir. Not that they shouldn't be allowed to use excalibur too, but I like the idea of adding jobs to some of the relics that are more job exclusive.

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Originally Posted by Yinnyth

I would argue blu should actually get mjollnir. Not that they shouldn't be allowed to use excalibur too, but I like the idea of adding jobs to some of the relics that are more job exclusive.

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Why would a BLU use that?

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Originally Posted by Yinnyth

I would argue blu should actually get mjollnir. Not that they shouldn't be allowed to use excalibur too, but I like the idea of adding jobs to some of the relics that are more job exclusive.

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Mjollnir's a hammer, which are almost all WHM-exclusive; it's not just the relic on that one. In addition, BLU doesn't really have anything to do with clubs aside from a mediocre native skill with the weapon; they don't even get many normal clubs, much less the higher-end ones. No thanks.

Ironically though, while SCH isn't on most hammers either, it -is- on the fake relic club, but not the staff. I can't say I understand that one; usually relics/empyreans are -more- selective on usable jobs than the normal weapons of the same type.

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Originally Posted by Ironside

Mjollnir's a hammer, which are almost all WHM-exclusive; it's not just the relic on that one. In addition, BLU doesn't really have anything to do with clubs aside from a mediocre native skill with the weapon; they don't even get many normal clubs, much less the higher-end ones. No thanks.

Ironically though, while SCH isn't on most hammers either, it -is- on the fake relic club, but not the staff. I can't say I understand that one; usually relics/empyreans are -more- selective on usable jobs than the normal weapons of the same type.

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That is interesting. I thought SCH are more associated with Staffs, and not clubs. SCHs can't even use the empyrean club, but can use the staff. Lastly, their mythic is a staff as well. Oh well, it's kind of moot anyway, since I really don't see how SCH would benefit club, but more so staff if ANYTHING. (Which generally, they...don't.)

Do want. Once they added them there would be a nice little upsurge of people going for relics, at least for a short while

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Originally Posted by Ralos

Do want. Once they added them there would be a nice little upsurge of people going for relics, at least for a short while

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I dunno, I think the only relic that would gain any real demand would be Mandau, since that's useful for DNC. The others mostly have other weapons they'd prefer to use, if I'm not mistaken. BLU and COR will want their Empyreans due to how game-changing they are for those jobs, PUP will probably want Mythic (if possible) or Empyrean (I'm not too familiar with PUP though), and SCH is basically the worst melee in the game, so either relic they could get (probably club, but I wouldn't rule out staff entirely) would be wasted on them.

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Originally Posted by Ironside

I dunno, I think the only relic that would gain any real demand would be Mandau, since that's useful for DNC. The others mostly have other weapons they'd prefer to use, if I'm not mistaken. BLU and COR will want their Empyreans due to how game-changing they are for those jobs, PUP will probably want Mythic (if possible) or Empyrean (I'm not too familiar with PUP though), and SCH is basically the worst melee in the game, so either relic they could get (probably club, but I wouldn't rule out staff entirely) would be wasted on them.

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I doubt even Mandau would go up, since the climactic flourish update Rudra's/Twashtar would be much better than mandau/mercy

COR could easily make use of Annihilator and ditto to PUP on Spahrai.

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Originally Posted by Sparthos

COR could easily make use of Annihilator and ditto to PUP on Spahrai.

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Maybe because I don't see Coronach much, but wouldn't Wildfire still be kinda heavily superior?

PUP on Spharai's the main one I wasn't sure about; they could use it, but I think -for now- Verethragna is better. Then again, most empyreans are better than most relics right now; the rebalance might make Spharai better for PUP, but I can't really see it making Excalibur beat Almace for BLU, or Annihilator beat Armageddon for COR.

Outside Abyssea, Wildfire isn't going to beat Coronach. Inside w/Fire atmas? No contest.

Armageddon (and Gandiva) are neat weapons for epeen swinging but the relic bow/gun still have their pulls that make them in ways better than their Empyrean counterparts. Enmity is a big a deal and being able to deal damage while delaying dying is crucial on a ranged class.

Annihilator plays right into the hands of a ranged COR. You have access to a huge amount of racc/ratt that the Emp lacks, a reliable WS in Coronach (FU Slug) and it doubles as the best QD gun in terms of base damage.

Fair enough. I should probably not talk about specific weapons for jobs I don't play or really know much about, haha.

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Originally Posted by Finuve

I doubt even Mandau would go up, since the climactic flourish update Rudra's/Twashtar would be much better than mandau/mercy

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It's gonna depend on how the updated Mandau will be like. I will imagine that it would make a significant different there. Plus, the hidden triple damage effect would make it even nicer, melee wise for DNC.

Shameless bumping because I feel the need to raise the awareness of this issue >.>;.

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Originally Posted by Sparthos

Outside Abyssea, Wildfire isn't going to beat Coronach. Inside w/Fire atmas? No contest.

Armageddon (and Gandiva) are neat weapons for epeen swinging but the relic bow/gun still have their pulls that make them in ways better than their Empyrean counterparts. Enmity is a big a deal and being able to deal damage while delaying dying is crucial on a ranged class.

Annihilator plays right into the hands of a ranged COR. You have access to a huge amount of racc/ratt that the Emp lacks, a reliable WS in Coronach (FU Slug) and it doubles as the best QD gun in terms of base damage.

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You do know that while it doesn't have an enmity reduction aftermath Armageddon does have significantly reduced enmity on WS?

There was no BLU PUP COR DNC or SCH Hydra Corp so there wont be any relic weapons for them, get over it.

There's the armour.
Balrahn wasn't a dancer.
Etc...

While we are on the topic... while it prob isn't relevant at the moment, I always wondered why they didn't add SCH to the Morrigans robe set and Dancer to the Skadi set.

Hopefully they will add them before we get to augmenting the gear.

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Originally Posted by Kimble

While we are on the topic... while it prob isn't relevant at the moment, I always wondered why they didn't add SCH to the Morrigans robe set and Dancer to the Skadi set.

Hopefully they will add them before we get to augmenting the gear.

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Sadly to say though, I really don't think there's any point in that anymore, unless the augments are totally decent.

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There was no BLU PUP COR DNC or SCH Hydra Corp so there wont be any relic weapons for them, get over it.

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Moot point. This was discussed earlier. While it makes sense that there wouldn't be any BLU, PUP, COR in theory since they are generally based in the near eastern empire, which had no involvement, not to mention there are really no NPCs in WoTG that are any of the said 3 jobs. However, Scholars and Dancers have heavy involvement with the Crystal War. There was a troop of Dancer soldiers, and several NPCs that are scholars. Therefore, it makes no sense that there wouldn't be any Dancers or scholars in the Hydra Corps.

Finally. At the inception of Dynamis. The said five jobs didn't even exist, so it's really a moot point.

Yes. I'm bumping this in hopes that SE would address this situation. :|

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Originally Posted by Alhanelem

The new jobs don't need the relic weapons. Equanmity is irrelevant.

1. The relic sword is not a scimitar and BLUs only use Scimitars.

2. I'm pretty sure DNC doesn't use the type of dagger the relic dagger is.

3. The relic HTH are cesti and PUP do not use cesti, with only a couple special exceptions.

4. SCH could really not care less if it has access to the relic weapon or not.

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1. Um... you are wrong.

2. Errr... wrong again.

3. http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Heofon_KnucklesYea only a few exceptions like this.

4. I agree with this statement 100%

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Originally Posted by Xellith

1. Um... you are wrong.

2. Errr... wrong again.

3. http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Heofon_KnucklesYea only a few exceptions like this.

4. I agree with this statement 100%

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1. Not to mention that BLU has access to Almace, which isn't even a scimitar either, so that is moot.

2. Also, it should be pointed out that Mandau is very similar design to another dagger that dancer can use. That is Heart Snatcher, which again throws this point out of the window.

3. It makes sense, in a way, but there's no reason why they can't make a special exception with puppetmaster, and giving them access to Spharai. If they have special exceptions to other kind of cestis. (IE, HEafon Knuckles, and Furor Cesti's, then why not Spharai, especially since it is an incredibly difficult weapon to obtain.) Other than the potential issue that could come up with Counter and Puppetmaster, why shouldn't puppetmaster have access to Spharai.

4. Frankly, all things considered any of the mage weapons (Claustrums and Mjollnir) is considered as epic waste of money/currency. Only reason to go after these is for the sake of achievement. That said, I would argue that Scholars should be allowed to equip Claustrum in this sense, even though it's almost entirely meh.

Yes I'm going to keep bumping this in hopes for answers from SE. Deelgeed with it. >.>

I'm going to bump this thread because I feel SE still needs to address this issue and it shouldn't be ignored. At least hearing the explanation on why they shouldn't is good enough for me.

Again, I'm aware that we have the mythic and the of course the empyrean, but as said before, it shouldn't be the reason to prevent the five newer jobs from being able to wield these weapons. I can't really think of an excuse why they shouldn't be able to wield these weapons at all.

"It would piss all the THF that have Mandau off."

Maybe so, maybe not. THF is the first job I took to level 75 (and 90), and will always be my main job. THF performs so well with Twashtar as opposed to Dancer. (Hi Sneak Attack and Trick Attack), and of course, the same can be said for Mandau and Mercy Stroke. I believe that allowing DNC to wield Mandau won't necessarily 'steal' the show from THF. Even with the upcoming changes that THF will get (The upcoming changes to Bully).

With all many of the other questions, some that are even trivial being answered, it bugs me that I feel that this subject is being ignored, since there has not been a response to this at all.

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Originally Posted by Suirieko

I'm going to bump this thread because I feel SE still needs to address this issue and it shouldn't be ignored. At least hearing the explanation on why they shouldn't is good enough for me.

Again, I'm aware that we have the mythic and the of course the empyrean, but as said before, it shouldn't be the reason to prevent the five newer jobs from being able to wield these weapons. I can't really think of an excuse why they shouldn't be able to wield these weapons at all.

"It would piss all the THF that have Mandau off."

Maybe so, maybe not. THF is the first job I took to level 75 (and 90), and will always be my main job. THF performs so well with Twashtar as opposed to Dancer. (Hi Sneak Attack and Trick Attack), and of course, the same can be said for Mandau and Mercy Stroke. I believe that allowing DNC to wield Mandau won't necessarily 'steal' the show from THF. Even with the upcoming changes that THF will get (The upcoming changes to Bully).

With all many of the other questions, some that are even trivial being answered, it bugs me that I feel that this subject is being ignored, since there has not been a response to this at all.

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Climactic Flourish says no.

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Originally Posted by Kimble

Climactic Flourish says no.

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I suppose all things considered, it puts them on even footing, but given the way Bully looks, I think Bully will outshine with climatic flourish, given how strong SATA already is with THF.

Would most likely be about the same, doubt it would be higher as DNC also gets a 20% damage boost with Climactic Flourish.

Reverse Flourish dagger!

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Originally Posted by Atomic_Skull

We don't need to give DNC any more of THFs stuff.

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^this


Also not quite sure why anyone wants to use excal/would do excal

I want to use Aegis. (*'-')|"'

I dont see why THF is all like "nuh uh" on Mandau as if that'd somehow change the situation. There is no reason the newer jobs shouldn't be on relic. The notion of being overpowered has been a laughing joke since before Empyeans were released.

If you had a Mandau, the odds are you'd be a THF main anyway.

I just hate dancer

Dont see why.

The job has extremely limited application and only truly shines in lowman play. As much hate as TH/THF gets, people still crawl back to the class when the time comes. Mandau would do nothing to change the status of both.

@ the Coronach vs Wildfire argument.

Outside abyssea, with MAB and AGI gear, Wildfire will still dominate Coronach.

Unless the mob takes no fire damage or reduced magic damage (more than 1/2) WF wrecks shop in VW. Unresisted should net ~22-2600