What new Jug Pets would you like to see 91-99?

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Originally Posted by Dann

Maybe we will get some kind of reasoning around monday when they start posting again. Kinda makes me sad either way though, I liked the idea about voteing for stuff like this..

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Maybe that's what the idea was. People like to vote, so let them vote^^
Maybe they'll be so happy at being allowed to vote that they won't notice that their voting was completely ignored.

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Originally Posted by Vagrua

Rocs - Treacherous Bill

Ruszors - Terrifying Sue

Gargouilles - Soulstealer Jack

Tauri - Hitman Joe

That's all I could come up with. Even though the mobs aren't charmable, I still thought it would be cool to have them as jug pets. A guy can dream.

*lvl99 epic jug to me would be a Caturae, Behemoth, Hydra, Khimaira or Vampyr.

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I think that's some great names for some beast out there waiting to become jugs. I'm also concerned in the wait for extremely useful jugs that will catch me in 'Awe'. Frankly, I'm not a career BST(lv.43) but I'm one day will choose the path of the "Mountain man" and getting more insight of the job.


"Tauri - Hitman Joe" - I love it ^^b


"Caturae, Behemoth, Hydra, Khimaira or Vampyr" are some beast that I'm skeptical about using and primarily because some adventurers could be tempted to abuse these a bit. In similarity to the new summons that were released, I think for epic beast like these to be used, you can make a one-time pack with them, say: A Wyrm or a Behemoth but just like a Blue Mage, I think Beast Masters should be able to tame them through the use of their bst abilities and "Charm the mob down" (if you ever played lolFFXIII, you'll know what I mean).

Another thought that kinda ran through my mind is that being a master Bst, I would guess it should've been possible to call multiple pets for extreme moment at a time. As I recall, a well known TaruTaru bst in the past has the ability to command more than on animal and cause a lot of damage. Wishful think but inspiring, don't you think?

Wow, that's kinda bogus.

I'm kinda glad about the Hippo (supposing they don't cockblock him by gimping his TP moves), I surely like him more than a scorpion (I voted for Slime/Krabkatoa, wanted a new tanking pet like Courier Carrie used to be at 75), but the point here is that it's really disrespectful toward the NA/EU playerbase.
SE has been widely reknown for doing favoritism for their JP player base, it's been like that since the beginning.

Not blaming Bayohne, Camate or anybody else, they have NOTHING to do with this of course, but it's still very frustrating to see how they find all possible excuses to disregard our opinion when it doesn't go in accord with the JP playerbase one.
Of course they would never dare to do something against the JP playerbase opinion, but they seem not to care much when they do that with us.
It's really offending, altough the cynic in me isn't particularly surprised, grew used to these behaviours over the years... they probably do not surprise me that much anymore.

It's my fault, I secretly wanted a Hippo since I couldn't have a Kraken.

I give hippo a win great tp moves and looks cool to boot lol....

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Originally Posted by Karbuncle

I'm happy with getting another THF Type pet. Hippo's are THF.

That said, the Tiger pet is really powerful, The only thing he's missing is something like Sharp Strike, Which face it, Would have been 3 charges, or we just plain wouldn't have got it. I'm happy with Tiger as our "Strong Attacker".

So long as Hippo isn't nerfed, We can expect some decent combat out of it.

Edit: But yah they clearly didn't listen to all forums.

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Also occasionally BRD, so hello BRD pet with no songs and no TH/High Evasion.

For those of you who voted for scorpion, I understand your disappointment. However, please realize that though this was the number one pick for EN players, this selection was based off of all regions. Also, please keep in mind that the dev. team needs to consider all aspects of potential implementation and therefore has to make the final call themselves.

Trust me when I say that your feedback is not a waste of time and you are not being ignored. I make sure that your opinions are properly conveyed to the development as best as I can and I continue to work with them, following up when necessary, to bring them updates and any new suggestions you have.

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Originally Posted by Camate

For those of you who voted for scorpion, I understand your disappointment. However, please realize that though this was the number one pick for EN players, this selection was based off of all regions. Also, please keep in mind that the dev. team needs to consider all aspects of potential implementation and therefore has to make the final call themselves.

Trust me when I say that your feedback is not a waste of time and you are not being ignored. I make sure that your opinions are properly conveyed to the development as best as I can and I continue to work with them, following up when necessary, to bring them updates and any new suggestions you have.

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I think the only way that you can quiet us is to post the total number of votes from each/all region that made up the final count for each pet.

Also, why put scorpion on the voting list if the dev wasnt' going to implement it if it wins?

Seriously, I would rather you guys just tell us that SE gave each regional players vote 1 choice, for the JP, they got Hippogryph.

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Originally Posted by Dreamin

Also, why put scorpion on the voting list if the dev wasnt' going to implement it if it wins?

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From the post, it sounds like that's a non issue because scorpion didn't win, when the grand total of all votes from all regions (America, Japan, and Europe) were totaled.

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Originally Posted by Camate

For those of you who voted for scorpion, I understand your disappointment. However, please realize that though this was the number one pick for EN players, this selection was based off of all regions. Also, please keep in mind that the dev. team needs to consider all aspects of potential implementation and therefore has to make the final call themselves.

Trust me when I say that your feedback is not a waste of time and you are not being ignored. I make sure that your opinions are properly conveyed to the development as best as I can and I continue to work with them, following up when necessary, to bring them updates and any new suggestions you have.

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The only way you'll coinvince people here that there is no favoritisim is if you show is the vote tallies and break it down by forum section (JP/EN/FR/DE)

Because some people have looked around and it doesn't look like the votes are in line with what you said.

I love ya camate but it shouldn't be that difficult to release the results. If they are tallied even a table of what option got what % of the votes would convince people.

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Originally Posted by Zarchery

From the post, it sounds like that's a non issue because scorpion didn't win, when the grand total of all votes from all regions (America, Japan, and Europe) were totaled.

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Not sure you follow but it was Camate that said Scorpion won in this post: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...867#post200867

Going to go ahead and bookmark this until this is resolved. Don't care about bst, but this is a major PR blunder unless some evidence shows the hippo actually won global voting. There is a large disparity in the amount of total votes in the NA thread vs the JP thread. The hippo would have had to have been practically a unanimous pick in other regions to have canceled out its lackluster finish in the NA thread.

Maybe it was tallied with each regions winning mob getting only 1 vote.

Like NA scorp won so NA's vote would be: Scorp (1) and JP and say German's winning mob was hippo(2), so they tallied it like hippo won 2 to 1 with scorp?

So more regions voted for the Hippogryph.



edit: For clarity

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...556#post192556

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...nb%C3%A4ndiger

In this case it was the Germans that tilted the balance 2-1 in favor of hippo
Lesson learned: Get your German and French friends to outvote the JPs. It doesn't matter how many votes the NA forum has.

wow this is messed up... so what was the point of the poll again if it wasn't used?

why in the world wouldnt the votes be released at the end anyways... you'd think it being posted would just be a given, why is there always something fishing going on when SE is involved lol.

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Originally Posted by Mifaco

In this case it was the Germans that tilted the balance 2-1 in favor of hippo
Lesson learned: Get your German and French friends to outvote the JPs. It doesn't matter how many votes the NA forum has.

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There's a fair amount of interest in the Hippo on the German forums but only 4 actual votes for it. Even if you count the ones that just included it in their top picks it still loses and like I said before the french didn't even cast a single vote lol. It's haggard no matter how you spin it. I think if we could just get an explanation of what these things the dev team had to consider were it would shut a lot of us up if they make any sense at all. This isn't one of those "Take our word for it" situations.

This all could have been solved if they just implemented a forum wide poll on the front page that showed results when this whole thing started. It's not like it's hard to implement or something, considering EVERY OTHER FORUM on the internet has the option to "make a poll"...

That is not what it says. Read carefully. Scorpion probably did win, but SE nixed it and made the final call.

"so, please keep in mind that the dev. team needs to consider all aspects of potential implementation and therefore has to make the final call themselves."

So basically I bet Scorpion won, then SE said, nah, Hippo will be easier to implement. Why make a comment like that anyways, its like a legal disclaimer.

Honestly, each region getting a vote makes sense. If you have one region with a lot more feedback and "voice" then another, it would then be exactly what you are saying "Thats not fair! most of voted for this, so why should this area have a say in it?"

Its the same has how larger states don't have as much of a voice as smaller states because it would be unfair due to larger states having more people.

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Originally Posted by Camate

For those of you who voted for scorpion, I understand your disappointment. However, please realize that though this was the number one pick for EN players, this selection was based off of all regions. Also, please keep in mind that the dev. team needs to consider all aspects of potential implementation and therefore has to make the final call themselves.

Trust me when I say that your feedback is not a waste of time and you are not being ignored. I make sure that your opinions are properly conveyed to the development as best as I can and I continue to work with them, following up when necessary, to bring them updates and any new suggestions you have.

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Was it? Because Hippogryph didn't win overall - it was fourth - and that's exactly why we're upset. We didn't expect our favorite to win, we expected the overall favorite to win. Instead, the Japanese favorite won. Is this not the case?

Also, if the final answer is that the development team made the call- Tell us why they chose the Hippogryph specifically, instead of the Scorpion, Ruszor, and Slime (all of these had more overall votes than the Hippogryph).

Thank you for responding, but understand that this doesn't have anything to do with us being upset that we don't get the Scorpion- it's purely an issue of fairness. I believe that you do put a lot of work into conveying our feedback to the development team, but I think we're all beginning to seriously question what happens to it after that.

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Originally Posted by Kimble

Its the same has how larger states don't have as much of a voice as smaller states because it would be unfair due to larger states having more people.

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You actually have that kind of backwards.

House of Representatives gets members (ie: votes) proportional to the state population. Senate gets 2 votes per state, regardless of population.

And yeah, this was probably an override of scorp for some reason, and they took the next most popular, or something.

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Originally Posted by Motenten

And yeah, this was probably an override of scorp for some reason, and they took the next most popular, or something.

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It was the fourth most popular overall.

You see what happemed there? We all should have remembered our high school french and voted for scorp on french forums. But of course we didn't know the poll rules did we? Just vote for your favorite and we'll put it in! Can't believe anybody working for SE would be surprised you have a bunch of pissed off NA when it was worded as it was.

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Originally Posted by Selzak

It was the fourth most popular overall.

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You still aren't getting it. I don't know how many more times you need to have it explained to you.

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Originally Posted by Anathiel

Just vote for your favorite and we'll put it in! Can't believe anybody working for SE would be surprised you have a bunch of pissed off NA when it was worded as it was.

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It was never worded that way.

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Originally Posted by Camate

Trust me when I say that your feedback is not a waste of time and you are not being ignored. I make sure that your opinions are properly conveyed to the development as best as I can and I continue to work with them, following up when necessary, to bring them updates and any new suggestions you have.

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Nobody accuses you of not listening to us and conveying our wishes to the dev team, Camate. In fact I'm sure everyone here believes that you're doing as much as you possibly can.

But it's the development team that isn't listening. There was a democratic vote, our choice had the most votes, and you did your part conveying that fact to the development team. But what did they do? They ignored you, and all non-JP players. In spite of the fact that the JP players' pick was not voted the winner by a majority of players from all regions, they chose it anyway.

It's a clear example of what many people have suspected since the forums were created: the developers ultimately don't listen to you when you convey our opinions. Our opinions, for the most part, don't matter in the end.

If its so hard to implement a scorpion jug, why was it in the voting list in the first place?

Our Representative is doing the best he can. I am not picking sides or anything of the sort but I was a little hurt the our top pick on these forums were not added at all to the list. I was thinking why couldn't the top picks from all the forums be implemented. ANYWAYS square enix made its decision based on what their developers could handle in the beastmaster pet department. Sadly I do think we should of been given a prechoice of what they could and could not handle to make as pets. Hippo is going to be interesting and yes I was one of the few who did ask for scrop. I thought that bug would be a fun one to have out and around but the idea of a hippo following is just creepy and giving evil ideas of trying it out on notorious monsters.
I am glad though we are at least even getting any jug pets at all for the update. They could of just said no new pets and just gave us gear instead. I do understand this forum is upset with the out come at least a good portion but try to think positive. I do think that our Representative hears us loud and clear but (in my opinion) due to their customer service is having a hard time trying to give us a straight answer.
Please I know people are upset but lets at least find out what what the pets they did choose abilities will be and the new pets names.

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Originally Posted by Sasaraixx

You still aren't getting it. I don't know how many more times you need to have it explained to you.

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Everyone is wrong, you are right.

Look at what has happened in context. The Hippogryph is being implemented, why? The significance of the Hippogryph being fourth is that he said the decision was based on all of the regions' votes together and not just the EN forum, yet the overall votes have Hippogryph at fourth, so why Hippogryph and not the three ahead of it?

Because of a mysterious development team decision that has absolutely nothing to do with it being the Japanese forum's top pick? The fact that you don't see why everyone around you is upset and are just sitting here pretending like everything is fine and we're all confused is laughable.


We're not saying that we expected our winner to be implemented. We're not saying that we were promised that they'd even implement the overall winner (although this was definitely expected, and should have been). The problem is that it wasn't the first overall choice, it wasn't the second overall choice (because, maybe the first choice wouldn't work), it wasn't the third overall choice (hell, maybe neither the first nor the second choices worked- but then you have to ask why they included them in the vote in the first place), but it was the fourth overall choice...the one that the Japanese posters picked.

You have to be wearing some very thick glasses not to see a problem with that.

I think this shows us that we need to put our votes not in the NA thread but in the JP one instead.

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Originally Posted by Gannon

I think this shows us that we need to put our votes not in the NA thread but in the JP one instead.

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Im pretty sure we are linked to our accounts and those accounts have some info where we live so that wont work.

My guess is much simpler. They didnt count the number of votes for each pet at all. Camate did and gave a report of Scorp won. Someone from german forum made a report and said hippo won. Someone from French forum made a report that none voted. Someone from JP forum made a report that Hippo won. Then someone who is responsible for summing up those reports and give final report to devs just ignored the numbers of vote but just took the winners from all regions (maybe even he had instruction that he should just pass the winners for each regions). SO in the end even that Camate passed the number of votes it didnt need to be in final report that devs got. They could only get German Hippo EN Scorp JP hippo French none so they decided ok lets make a hippo. Blame the system and flow of information in big corporations :)

Or to put it very simply: The Dev team made a "decision" to implement what they wanted. Simple. Camate asked for our "opinion", we gave it, it was asked for in the form of a vote.. we voted.. our opinions were noted... the Dev team made a decision... end of story. I think everyone needs to chill.

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Originally Posted by Selzak

Everyone is wrong, you are right.

Look at what has happened in context. The Hippogryph is being implemented, why? The significance of the Hippogryph being fourth is that he said the decision was based on all of the regions' votes together and not just the EN forum, yet the overall votes have Hippogryph at fourth, so why Hippogryph and not the three ahead of it?

Because of a mysterious development team decision that has absolutely nothing to do with it being the Japanese forum's top pick? The fact that you don't see why everyone around you is upset and are just sitting here pretending like everything is fine and we're all confused is laughable.


We're not saying that we expected our winner to be implemented. We're not saying that we were promised that they'd even implement the overall winner (although this was definitely expected, and should have been). The problem is that it wasn't the first overall choice, it wasn't the second overall choice (because, maybe the first choice wouldn't work), it wasn't the third overall choice (hell, maybe neither the first nor the second choices worked- but then you have to ask why they included them in the vote in the first place), but it was the fourth overall choice...the one that the Japanese posters picked.

You have to be wearing some very thick glasses not to see a problem with that.

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The problem is that you are being stubborn to the point of being childlike. You tell me to look at context but you are completely unable to do so. I've already told you that no where in any of Camate or Mocchi's posts did they say that the pet with the most number of votes would be selected. You cling onto this fourth place ranking like it proves something. It doesn't.

You then hear that the hippo was the winner on the German forum as well and you still don't seem to care. Since numbers seem to matter so much to you, here are two for you: 2 to 1. That is the report that was probably sent by community reps. The dev team didn't know/care that scorpion had 44 votes or however many you think it did. They only know that the hippo was the clear winner in 2 of the 3 forums. End of story.

I also told you that the dev team had other considerations when they made the decision and that your feedback (which is all it was. Feedback.) was considered among them. What did Camate tell you? The exact same thing.

And I've already asked why you continue to rant and complain about favoritism for the Japanese players in a Japanese game that is played primarily by Japanese if you really think that is the case. It's actually a bit ironic because you wanted the dev team to base their decisions on the most votes cast, but are upset because you think they are playing favorites to the largest player base.

If you want to continue to be upset about something that I really think you shouldn't be then that is your prerogative. I was just trying to help you see the bigger picture but you have decided that you are mad and you want to stay mad. Have fun with that. I can only watch a person bang their head against a wall for so long.

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Originally Posted by xiozen

Or to put it very simply: The Dev team made a "decision" to implement what they wanted. Simple. Camate asked for our "opinion", we gave it, it was asked for in the form of a vote.. we voted.. our opinions were noted... the Dev team made a decision... end of story. I think everyone needs to chill.

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At least someone is being reasonable.

"Sadly I do think we should of been given a prechoice of what they could and could not handle to make as pets."

Actually they did do that, they gave us a list of pets that SE was willing to include as a jug, scorp was on that list.

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Originally Posted by Camate

For those of you who voted for scorpion, I understand your disappointment. However, please realize that though this was the number one pick for EN players, this selection was based off of all regions. Also, please keep in mind that the dev. team needs to consider all aspects of potential implementation and therefore has to make the final call themselves.

Trust me when I say that your feedback is not a waste of time and you are not being ignored. I make sure that your opinions are properly conveyed to the development as best as I can and I continue to work with them, following up when necessary, to bring them updates and any new suggestions you have.

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This has nothing to do with getting what we want, and everything to do with the JP side getting exactly what they want despite the actual votes from all regions. In other words, if you come in here today and say, "Hey guys, we're going to add the scorpion too since you wanted it so bad!" I don't think a single person would be appeased. It's just not the issue.

Camate, on your end I fully believe that we're being listened to. You do a tremendous amount of work for us and you can trust me too when I say that it doesn't go unacknowledged. However, we do need for the actual problem here to be acknowledged and addressed regardless of whether or not you personally are listening to us.

The question remains:

Why did the development team choose the Japanese favorite despite it being the fourth overall pick? What happened to the three choices that had more overall votes than the hippogryph?

"NA" forum also has a little problem, French forum mostly attracts French people, German forum mostly Germans, Japanese mostly Japanese. "NA" forum has a HUGE ammount of Europeans and other people in it too. So this isnt even about 4 regions. Considering the French and German forums to be equal to "NA" is just weird.

From now on official votings should just have 1 central topic in either Japanese or English (NA) forum, and seperate topics in the other languages to redirect to that central voting topic. Discussions can happen in the seperate topics, official central topic just for votes and nothing else. Will make things easier and a lot more fair.

Not going to help with this current situation but might be a handy system for the future.

Occupy Vanadiel!!!!

The Japanese big LS corporations making billions of gil of profit every year are running our game. We only have the illusion of a vote as we don't have the monetary power to actually make a difference.

The mog bonanza has been bailing out these big LS corporations lining their pockets with millions of gil every year!