Summoner in Colonization Reives = Broken

I think the bigger issue here is that when more people join a reive, points go down for everyone, regardless of job. The walls are taken down faster, mobs don't have time to respawn as many waves, more people are there to compete for healing (on a variety of jobs) and people are taking less damage in general since things are being taken out more efficiently and Unity is procing more often. If you seriously want better points, you have to go find less populated blockades or tackle them at less populated times. "Go somewhere else" is not a solution people want to hear, understandably, but one can't just zone out following the reive train around the first two zones and then be upset when their points start dwindling as the train picks up more people with each pass. You can't stop other people from joining, but you can control where you and your party choose to go. Pick your battles more carefully with bayld gain in mind as the primary focus instead of the general goal of clearing paths to other bayld rewarding objectives and getting some points along the way.

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Originally Posted by OmnysValefor

There are quite a few reives where I seem to get just awful reward, besides turning it in. So this is actually happening. Some flaw in the design allows for it.

Yeah whm could spend the entire time subtargeting and looking for people to cure, but all a summoner needs to do is see an aoe go off in the group and instantly dispatch garuda.

I don't blame the smn's for doing this. I want pld/dnc to campaign because it was the god of campaign, but anyone saying the OP is wrong are actually wrong themselves. Now, like others have said, players who are bothered by it could level summoner or sub summoner etc etc, and there's nothing wrong with that notion.

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Yeah there's nothing wrong in that subbing smn and doing that, its the same thing when people lvl up bst for dynamis currency.

All of the WHMs I know complain because SMNs are sucking up all the heals. I tried whipping out my staff and meleeing as SCH (and spamming haste/pro/shell) but i got super shit rewards.

SMN aoe cure worked in campaign because there were NPCs that had huge amounts of HP, so any healer had plenty of opportunities.

I support the OPer's suggestion that all curagas/accessions should also be able to hit everyone. Would make reives much more fun for me (as opposed to just switching to WAR)

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Originally Posted by Raksha

All of the WHMs I know complain because SMNs are sucking up all the heals. I tried whipping out my staff and meleeing as SCH (and spamming haste/pro/shell) but i got super shit rewards.

SMN aoe cure worked in campaign because there were NPCs that had huge amounts of HP, so any healer had plenty of opportunities.

I support the OPer's suggestion that all curagas/accessions should also be able to hit everyone. Would make reives much more fun for me (as opposed to just switching to WAR)

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But that's what has caused such a ruckus in this thread... the OP was not advocating tweaking other jobs to compensate, but instead calling for them to specifically clamp down on SMN:

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Originally Posted by Malphius

So I was doing Colonization Reives in Morimar Basalt Fields today. I was on WHM having a great time healing my party, buffing, doing my job, etc... when out of no where come 4 summoners and that's when things went down hill.

Because Summoner BP's seem to have no boundaries in terms of party/alliance they are going to completely rain down epic fails on the point gains of other support class jobs. I went from 500~700 Bayld per tally to 100 if lucky because all 4 Summoners were spamming BP's. That was with my trying to spam curaga to keep up.

BP's in Reives needs limited to party only or this is going to become PLD + SMN + DD only event.

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This continued on for quite a while. He/She is still calling for it 129 posts into the thread:

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Originally Posted by Malphius

Again it's been about removing the special ability that SMN's get with their BP's in this event. Because it's an event change it would also impact BST. Try to understand that the SMN job would not be nerfed. Nor would BST. This event actually increases their ability several times fold while leaving everyone else out.

How would SMN or BST respond if in abyssea every one could get atmas or curror buffs but them or in VW that anyone could use atmicite but them? Given the attitude on this board to the things i've said, I expect it would be far worse than mine. I would see several "I'm quitting" posts. I'm not salty about it because I can come on anything but I do think it needs addressed as it provides an unbalanced event. This isn't like Campaign or WoE because those are "open" battle fields. Reives is quite compressed and tight on space. So either they can open up the battle area way more than it already is, or they need to change something else with the way the event plays.

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Originally Posted by Malphius

If we can't change things for SMN can we change them for everyone else? Can I curaga everyone in my area with out restriction to party?

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this is what i was referring to.

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Originally Posted by Raksha

this is what i was referring to.

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I know...but that was like 2 days ago (22nd post). Besides, that statement probably only came out because it's what others were talking about--curing outside the party, doing all you can to maximize your potential by doing other things...basically shifting the onus to balance one's scores to the player that suddenly found them self in competition for getting credits for support activities.

Despite all the alternatives out there (many presented in the thread), Malphius is still digging the heels in and calling for SMN to be nerfed in the events (129th post, late yesterday afternoon).

It's not "either put everyone else on par with SMN somehow, or restrict SMN", it seems to be all about putting the brakes on just one job in the event. That is why people refer to it as nerfing SMN for the event, because in effect that is what it will do because otherwise SMN gets pretty meh rewards without the AOE wards feature.

All non DD jobs get shit rewards in reives. They should fix the event such that all support jobs get decent rewards, not just the one with a hugely unfair advantage.

Are people complaining about smn in reives even aware of BPs drawbacks?

I admit asking for mages' cures to be extended to all reives' players is smarter than asking for smn to be nerfed.
But, what if those extended cures would reset all your cure timers to 45 seconds?

Whm can spam cures. We smn can cure everyone but it's not like we can spam.
Plus, rabbits do huge damaging AOEs and a single BP can't take everyone to full HP.
There's still room for other healing jobs. If there wasn't, you wouldn't see people still dying in reives.

Those dead people would have gotten you some baylds if you've been quicker on healing them.
Remember your cure timers are not shared. Spam those while we wait for whispering wind to be ready.

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Originally Posted by Aezelas

Are people complaining about smn in reives even aware of BPs drawbacks?

I admit asking for mages' cures to be extended to all reives' players is smarter than asking for smn to be nerfed.
But, what if those extended cures would reset all your cure timers to 45 seconds?

Whm can spam cures. We smn can cure everyone but it's not like we can spam.
Plus, rabbits do huge damaging AOEs and a single BP can't take everyone to full HP.
There's still room for other healing jobs. If there wasn't, you wouldn't see people still dying in reives.

Those dead people would have gotten you some baylds if you've been quicker on healing them.
Remember your cure timers are not shared. Spam those while we wait for whispering wind to be ready.

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This x100. Everybody wins!

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I admit asking for mages' cures to be extended to all reives' players is smarter than asking for smn to be nerfed.
But, what if those extended cures would reset all your cure timers to 45 seconds?

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Was wondering how long it would be until somebody would reject the whole "Curagas for everyone!" idea. I knew, to someone, it was never really about what's best for everyone.

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Those dead people would have gotten you some baylds if you've been quicker on healing them.
Remember your cure timers are not shared. Spam those while we wait for whispering wind to be ready.

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Eh, I offer parties to people in Reive where we're short handed. I've been refused. And when people refuse to join me, I don't heal them. Or Raise them in the end. You can't just expect mages to be tabbing around like we've got nothing better to do than scanning for HP bars.

And telling mages to man up and start meleeing is all well and good when numbers are low for a Reive. Like maybe 15. When you've got 50 or so people at roots or crags, your damage is not going to measure up to other dedicated damage dealers. Might as well just come as a damage dealing job and let the 3 or 4 SMNs heal you.

As I've said, I'd be more than happy to sub /BLU on RDM to keep people healed if Healing Breeze would apply to everybody in the area. Bonus, I'll Cocoon and be able to access Sanguine Blade to aid in my own survivability. But as things stand now, Wild Carrot is AoE Cure IV that effects everybody in the area. It's easier for me to heal an alliance worth of people as a BST than as a RDM or SCH. Think about that for a moment.