What new Jug Pets would you like to see 91-99?

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Originally Posted by xbobx

I guess you cant think. it is ok. Lets see high level nms surrounded by Even to T mobs that repop very fast, Ya, that wouldn't be a bst haven making every NM in abyessa an absolute joke for a group of bsts to destroy. Not broken at all.

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All of Abyssea is susceptible to a group coming in and wrecking everything that moves, not being able to charm anything just neutered our job to the point where it's better to go as something else instead of BST. Simply having the option to use charm would not be abused and broken by BST mains, the real problem would come from /BST by other jobs who would then be even stronger than before and that much more capable.

=( Scorps...
Dang thought it was between ruszor and slimes.
Maybe I missed another post.

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Man, tons of votes up in here!

After looking over each and every one of your posts, it's a super super close call between:

-Ruszor
-Slime

Please vote on one or the other and let's see which pet comes out on top

Close contenders are below:
-Hippogryph
-Karkinos
-Hanuman

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You know what? I want a Fomor Tarutaru jugpet. Give it to me now. >=/

You know, I'm halfway wondering if we're going to get more than one 99 jug. The JP boards at least were asked this same question, so maybe the devs are planning to roll out multiple 99 pets in the event each region polled arrived at a different consensus.

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Originally Posted by Limecat

You know, I'm halfway wondering if we're going to get more than one 99 jug. The JP boards at least were asked this same question, so maybe the devs are planning to roll out multiple 99 pets in the event each region polled arrived at a different consensus.

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Either that or the polls were designed to shut us up.

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Originally Posted by Xilk

i can't agree. slugs were going at 23k/stack on bahamut last night, and there were like 30 stacks available. You won't be able to keep that price high. Hello level 95 replacement of Nazuna.

and double chcking now, I see 58 stacks on ah, and they are 11k/stack...

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I suppose you and I had to disagree sometime.

It is cool that the slug's price is going down. But that doesn't change my opinion that 99 bst is going to be hellaciously expensive, or my opinion that career cooks are demons in disguise.

It is almost as if the entire dev team have characters with 100 cooking, or maybe there is a cook lobbyist who buys them off. All i know is since 76 there has been major boons to cooks.

the change from best gear is bought to best gear is free destroyed most crafts. This was a boon for cooking because now people had more money to throw into consumables.

The dev team decision to atrophy charm and support call beast with updates changed the frequency of pet consumables needed in every bstmasters normal day, a MAJOR boon for cooks in the form of an overnight market.

The refusal to rectify the new cost strain on bst in favor of cooks was a boon for cooks.

The refusal to increase recipe yields and stack sizes of pet items was a boon to cooks.

Meanwhile, almost every other craft and 1 job got a huge dump taken on them. I just can't help but wonder, why all the love for cooks?

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Originally Posted by Ultimare

Yeah, if we get a scorpion, Death Scissors probably will be 3 charges, but with the right set up, that three minutes can be cut in half, or more with gear. I know my charge time is down to 35-40 sec, and I haven't even finished my wish list for sic/ready delay gear. Slimes and Ruszor would be great for soloing, but we already have Yuly and his amazing evasion. I personally want something that can contribute to a group. Something a little more potent that 200-500 damage with 2-3 charge moves. Lulush's Foot Kick is okay, but even with gear and atma, I don't think I've seen it break 1K.

And I think xbobx is right. Pretty much anything could be brought down by an alliance of BST, with an unlimited amount of monsters to throw at it. It could potentially take a while, but it'd get done... except maybe a dragon NM that constantly flies. Smaller groups could encounter various difficulties if portions of the group get knocked out or slept or encounter unlucky charm rates, but a full blown alliance of BSTs could probably hold out through just about anything, so lets just be honest. Who hasn't trioed xolotl with a group back at level 75 cap on bst?

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I've seen foot kick break 1k outside of abyssea.
Inside w/ atma & gear I've hit 2.3k w/ foot kick and 2k w/ whirl claws.

This was before the cap went to 95. So you might want to try a few more things.

Then again i swap in all my pet attack + gear for pet tp moves.

btw, I was using RR, VV, and Savior for atma.

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Originally Posted by Caketime

All of Abyssea is susceptible to a group coming in and wrecking everything that moves, not being able to charm anything just neutered our job to the point where it's better to go as something else instead of BST. Simply having the option to use charm would not be abused and broken by BST mains, the real problem would come from /BST by other jobs who would then be even stronger than before and that much more capable.

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Actually, i think there might be a particular challenge or problem w/ adding atma buffs to charmed pets... just a thought.

Seriously a Scorpion? Did the people that post just abyssea up there BST job? Ever BST that actually played the job before abyssea came out knows that the slime pets rocked every mob they went up against. Scorpions were nice damage wise but defense wise they were average at best. EM slimes were taking out IT mobs and were still kicking. EM scorpions took off a nice chunk of HP but still would need 2 or 3 of them to kill an IT mob.

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Originally Posted by Gotterdammerung

I suppose you and I had to disagree sometime.

It is cool that the slug's price is going down. But that doesn't change my opinion that 99 bst is going to be hellaciously expensive, or my opinion that career cooks are demons in disguise.

It is almost as if the entire dev team have characters with 100 cooking, or maybe there is a cook lobbyist who buys them off. All i know is since 76 there has been major boons to cooks.

the change from best gear is bought to best gear is free destroyed most crafts. This was a boon for cooking because now people had more money to throw into consumables.

The dev team decision to atrophy charm and support call beast with updates changed the frequency of pet consumables needed in every bstmasters normal day, a MAJOR boon for cooks in the form of an overnight market.

The refusal to rectify the new cost strain on bst in favor of cooks was a boon for cooks.

The refusal to increase recipe yields and stack sizes of pet items was a boon to cooks.

Meanwhile, almost every other craft and 1 job got a huge dump taken on them. I just can't help but wonder, why all the love for cooks?

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I agree w/ most of what you say. When the level cap increased, and abyssea gear came out, the economy went into a spiral.

It didn't take anyone long to figure out that consumables (always a stable income source) were even moreso the right place to be.

You are also right that the limitations of charm cause a high demand for jugs amongst bsts. However, this was also the case at level 75. Charm was already being killed off before the level cap increase. It is easy for many newer bsts to forget this if they knew it at all. The demand for bsts in most end-game events at level 75 was a negative number!!

I do agree that BST became an expensive job at higher levels. It was a dirt cheap job all the way up to level 75, then suddenly the tables are completely turned. However, BST has also always been a good job for making gil.

I don't have any particular problem keeping up w/ my jug and petfood costs without even trying. If I took 1 day a week just farming for gil on my bst, i would have a small fortune. Granted, everyone's budget's and playstyles are different.

I think the jug costs at 76+ were all cheap w/ the exception of YULy. I think Yuly has made a nice balance as well. Even though its often 100k/ stack. yuly pays for herself.

I think prices didn't really start getting higher until cap went to 90 w/ Shasra and Broncha. I think this is mainly due that many players have level 60 cooking skill, but far fewer have 100 cooking skill. The newer recipes couldn't be handled by the level 60 cooks anymore.

Don't forget the change to reward as well. I can't decide how that affected prices. Did we start to rely on zeta biscuits more because they were better? or did we need to use less because they were more effective? The number sold went up alot, imo, and the price went up as well. Then again the prices for ninja items have gone up as well. (market-wise I think ninja tools compare very well to bst jugs) I think the demand and supply have gone up also.

I don't think it is any bias in favor of cooks more than the natural stability of the craft and how it is designed originally. The power of food in this game, and the consumable nature of it are what makes cooking such a resilient trade.

I agree that bst has become and expensive job. We have constant Demand for goods in order to stay in business. This used to be primarly the concern of Ninja, Rangers and Corsairs. However, we've jumped on that list as well.

I only disagree in that I think the current market is fully capable of handling it. The rate at which I consume jugs and pet food does not exceed my rate of making gil. (And I don't try to make gil. I don't go out and farm specifically to make gil, I just pick it up selling & Npc'ing stuff along the way of whatever I'm doing. I also typically stay between 300k~500k gil just normally. If I get over 1mil, i tend to buy something bigger, or buy alot of jugs).

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Originally Posted by Franklyn

Seriously a Scorpion? Did the people that post just abyssea up there BST job? Ever BST that actually played the job before abyssea came out knows that the slime pets rocked every mob they went up against. Scorpions were nice damage wise but defense wise they were average at best. EM slimes were taking out IT mobs and were still kicking. EM scorpions took off a nice chunk of HP but still would need 2 or 3 of them to kill an IT mob.

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...reread the thread. the supporters of scorpion know exactly what its strengths and weaknesses are. W/ all the damage reduction gear and curing abilities bst already have, we have many good tank options. We don't NEED a better physical tank nearly as much as we need a superior DD. Thats EXACTLY why it was chosen.

I have always wanted a slime! and i know the community has wanted this a long time.

We also need a caster, so i hvae to vote for a hecteye.

Alltho, an opo, crab, bat would be good too. make it a mob we havent got from before.

top two is slime and hecteye!

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Originally Posted by Xilk

...reread the thread. the supporters of scorpion know exactly what its strengths and weaknesses are. W/ all the damage reduction gear and curing abilities bst already have, we have many good tank options. We don't NEED a better physical tank nearly as much as we need a superior DD. Thats EXACTLY why it was chosen.

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Well said!

I still stand by a cactaur for 99.

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Originally Posted by Xilk

Actually, i think there might be a particular challenge or problem w/ adding atma buffs to charmed pets... just a thought.

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Who said they should benefit from them in the first place? You're likely correct though. Shotgun remedies are SE style.

I hope everyone realizes we don't care how good Scorpion is, it's just a lot cooler to use a big ass Scorpion than a pile of slime or some overgrown mutated boar.

You realize a Ruszor is a Walrus right? :p

You know we have been discussing the differences of scrop < slime quite a bit. Why not they implement both into the game, one for 96 and the other for 98 pet. It would be nice so that way both sides of the debate wins.

I'm curious if all the slime people remember not so long ago when they nerfed pets pdt, because inept Beastmaster's were holding up other groups (and pink power rangers who do the same thing) with excessively long fights. You guys really want a pet that makes Beast's go out, and start holding up other players again. How long would it take for the playerbase to get out the torches, and the pitchforks again you think?

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Originally Posted by Zaknafein

I'm curious if all the slime people remember not so long ago when they nerfed pets pdt, because inept Beastmaster's were holding up other groups (and pink power rangers who do the same thing) with excessively long fights. You guys really want a pet that makes Beast's go out, and start holding up other players again. How long would it take for the playerbase to get out the torches, and the pitchforks again you think?

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Uhmm.. YOu are grossly mistaken in your assumption that this is why they nerfed the 100% pdt on pets.

I promise you I can still hold any NM that could be held before the patch now, indefinitely.

There is nothing making these fights quicker if I wanna solo them. I still can, pet only, and take forever. that is not at all why it was nerfed.

it was alot easier to keep hate on pet in a group though, when physical hits all did 0 on pet. It didn't allow mobs to reduce hate on pet w/out a reset really. That never mattered much for solo, but it made a big difference tanking in a group.

What Xilk said. If anything it could make us kill slower by swaping the 2nd -PDT and RR for 2 regen atma.
Just imagine a DG/MC/Stronghold pet on a NM in abyssea.

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Originally Posted by Xilk

Uhmm.. YOu are grossly mistaken in your assumption that this is why they nerfed the 100% pdt on pets.

I promise you I can still hold any NM that could be held before the patch now, indefinitely.

There is nothing making these fights quicker if I wanna solo them. I still can, pet only, and take forever. that is not at all why it was nerfed.

it was alot easier to keep hate on pet in a group though, when physical hits all did 0 on pet. It didn't allow mobs to reduce hate on pet w/out a reset really. That never mattered much for solo, but it made a big difference tanking in a group.

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actually, all the -pdt nerf did is make me hold mobs longer. Because the pet can still take damage, albeit slower, I use either a regen atma or a defensive one, which naturally means 1 less DD atma, meaning longer kills. Since the community demanded the nerf, when they complain I just give them more of the consequences of their request... I sit down (litterally) and watch the show, doing NOTHING to speed the battle, and not inviting anyone outside a few buddies to share in the spoils. Old proverb, "be careful what you wish for..."

TBH, I just got the -pdt set-up recently, before that I had pet pour on the damage instead and used a good reward set-up and a couple temps to make the fights quick so I didn't NEED -pdt. I changed mostly because of all the whining I read on these forums from every job about why they weren't the #1 job in the game. Duh, there isn't one! It's all battle-dependant what works best.

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Originally Posted by Vizardx

What Xilk said. If anything it could make us kill slower by swaping the 2nd -PDT and RR for 2 regen atma.
Just imagine a DG/MC/Stronghold pet on a NM in abyssea.

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LOL, done that! Funny to watch, even when the mobs rage it's laughable.

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Originally Posted by Xilk

Uhmm.. YOu are grossly mistaken in your assumption that this is why they nerfed the 100% pdt on pets.

I promise you I can still hold any NM that could be held before the patch now, indefinitely.

There is nothing making these fights quicker if I wanna solo them. I still can, pet only, and take forever. that is not at all why it was nerfed.

it was alot easier to keep hate on pet in a group though, when physical hits all did 0 on pet. It didn't allow mobs to reduce hate on pet w/out a reset really. That never mattered much for solo, but it made a big difference tanking in a group.

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So you're saying the multiple threads on this website, and ffxiah where people were crying about 5/5 perle bst's holding mobs indefinitely, then the nerf happens shortly after those threads was just a coincidence. I'm not buying that for a dollar. Was it the only reason they made that move? Of course not, but to say it didn't factor into the decision is silly.

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Originally Posted by Zaknafein

So you're saying the multiple threads on this website, and ffxiah where people were crying about 5/5 perle bst's holding mobs indefinitely, then the nerf happens shortly after those threads was just a coincidence. I'm not buying that for a dollar. Was it the only reason they made that move? Of course not, but to say it didn't factor into the decision is silly.

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A 5/5 perle bst wouldnt be holding a mob indefinitely with pet getting hit for 0 physical dmg.

It wasn't meant in a literal sense... holding them for an unreasonable amount of time. Happy now?

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Originally Posted by Xilk

Uhmm.. YOu are grossly mistaken in your assumption that this is why they nerfed the 100% pdt on pets.

I promise you I can still hold any NM that could be held before the patch now, indefinitely.

There is nothing making these fights quicker if I wanna solo them. I still can, pet only, and take forever. that is not at all why it was nerfed.

it was alot easier to keep hate on pet in a group though, when physical hits all did 0 on pet. It didn't allow mobs to reduce hate on pet w/out a reset really. That never mattered much for solo, but it made a big difference tanking in a group.

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Total bull. With a set up that allows pets to take 0 damage, neither you nor your pet could accumulate enough hate to be tanking in the first place because you've got no/only 1 damage dealing atmas equipped.

And every single enemy has either an instant death move, a hate reset move, a throat stab, casts magic, or simply one shots the pet with a ws when the regen takes it to 51% hp, so it's a moot point anyway. Your pet will still take very impressive amounts of damage and lose hate right quick, or die outright. It was, at best a good tank when the two real tanks you brought are both weakened. And with Mijin Gaikure that rarely happened anyway.

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Originally Posted by Zaknafein

It wasn't meant in a literal sense... holding them for an unreasonable amount of time. Happy now?

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Uhmmm the disagreement wasn't about holding it for a long time... it was about a 5/5 perle bst doing it. You need 2x pdt- axes upgraded, ferine quijotes +1 or 2, and anwig salade, at least to do it....

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Total bull. With a set up that allows pets to take 0 damage, neither you nor your pet could accumulate enough hate to be tanking in the first place because you've got no/only 1 damage dealing atmas equipped.

And every single enemy has either an instant death move, a hate reset move, a throat stab, casts magic, or simply one shots the pet with a ws when the regen takes it to 51% hp, so it's a moot point anyway. Your pet will still take very impressive amounts of damage and lose hate right quick, or die outright. It was, at best a good tank when the two real tanks you brought are both weakened. And with Mijin Gaikure that rarely happened anyway.

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and you obviously misunderstood my post.

Pre-nerf tanking Ningishzada was very easy. RR + Lion both counted towards DD. Triple attack is nice to have on pet afterall. and when pet was taking 0 damage its really hard for NM to reduce hate on it. Especially when I snarl after every rampage.
Also, pre-nerf, I was not using a regen atma.. that would be silly. It only allowed mobs to do more damage on pet. pet goes down ot 50% hp and stays there indefinitely unless there were a good DoT or spell.

This is kinda moot now anyway, but I had no trouble tanking for a SMALL group or party before the nerf. I kept hate ON the pet. well, until my war friend got Ukko's fury anyway... I couldn't keep hate from that going off..

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Originally Posted by Xilk

Uhmmm the disagreement wasn't about holding it for a long time... it was about a 5/5 perle bst doing it. You need 2x pdt- axes upgraded, ferine quijotes +1 or 2, and anwig salade, at least to do it....

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Which is exactly what I said. Pre nerf anyone with Ducal & Lion could burn their bst to 90 make two pdt axes (which is shockingly easy) go buy some jugs, and pet food then proceed to whittle away at a variety of NM's. Was that zero pdt? No. However it was plenty to get the job done in most cases.

People started bandwagoning this because instead of having to level <insert solo job here> and skill up/gear a job all they had to do was make that minimum time investment into bst. That is what people were raging about in those threads I spoke of. Then within 2 weeks of those discussions the nerf was handed down. Seems fairly cut, and dry.

Post nerf can you still have excellent pdt on a pet? Absolutely, but you have to at least make some effort to do so. Not just burn a job to 90. Buy jugs, and pet food. Stir in 2 atmas, and wa la you're a god.

>.> Dam would Vote god dam Slime

vote : Buffalo

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Originally Posted by Geebee

vote : Buffalo

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There's still never been a jug of anything that wasn't previously charmable though correct?
We need a squid.

I think it would be funny if SE gave us a wyvern jug pet, mob wyverns not DRG wyverns, because then we would get to troll the DRGs.

I'd also settle for a Mithra NPC jugpet. =D~~

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Originally Posted by Ultimare

I'd also settle for a Mithra NPC jugpet. =D~~

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Eh? don't you already have that?

Maybe SE should implement a series of Familar based mobs we can choose from at 99.... Like maybe an HNM type mob but smaller... Like a Baby Behemoth... Make it like our NPC where it levels up and we can make it stronger in certain fields, like make it a tank, damage dealer, or just support. It might ruin the whole Jug Pet concept though, but maybe feed the pet jugs to keep him out and grant certain bonuses? I think something like that could work out and it would be interesting if they gave us a WIDE variety of mobs to choose from.
Thoughts?

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Originally Posted by firelurker456

Maybe SE should implement a series of Familar based mobs we can choose from at 99.... Like maybe an HNM type mob but smaller... Like a Baby Behemoth... Make it like our NPC where it levels up and we can make it stronger in certain fields, like make it a tank, damage dealer, or just support. It might ruin the whole Jug Pet concept though, but maybe feed the pet jugs to keep him out and grant certain bonuses? I think something like that could work out and it would be interesting if they gave us a WIDE variety of mobs to choose from.
Thoughts?

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Sounds like making a bst more like a pup.

Also, they did say there were going to give us a smaller adamantoise.
I don't really tin the call beast ability needs to change so much. i think its a good ability.

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/th...555#post212555

So does this mean for 99 we'll get an Adamantoise, Apkallu and Hippogryph?

Thank you all for your suggestions, and often heated debate. I'm glad I get to be the one to post up our results after all the hard work Camate did leading up to it.

Based on numerous discussions, we have decided to implement the following pets along with the new level cap of 99.

Pets that we have been planning all along
Adamantoise
Attachment 884
*The smaller type from Abyssea. Don't worry, they won't cause the ground to rumble non-stop!

Apkallu
Attachment 885
　
And... based on your feedback!
Hippogryph
Attachment 886

We will continue to reference your feedback when we consider adding more pets in the future. We hope you're all looking forward to the next round of pet additions once the cap is raised!

Thats not a scorpion :( Could do worse though. Hope the penguin has some things to set it apart from the mandy mnk jugs.