Job Adjustments manifesto Discussion

RDM is still an adequate healer outside of abyssea, which I personally despise people that want their jobs adjusted based on that big old mess that nearly destroyed FFXI in the first place(and before you argue that it helped, no it really didnt, we need more players to join the game to keep it going not a big old mess that gives a crap load of EXP that is the only thing most people want to do), RDM has 2 main weapons, sword and dagger, they should have better weapon skill sets and stronger ability to hit, that should be addressed before anything else, and screwing us by making it so we are forced to take less enmity was not a smooth move on SE's part, they went and screwed over one of the few things front line that RDM could do, tank, you all seem to think that RDM was designed to back line, that was not the original idea of RDM, RDM was supposed to be able to effectively take on almost any role in the party, not to be better than those roles but to be proficient at them

There's a difference between not having first rate melee and being worse or equal then a Whm.

White Mage has always been a powerful melee job (for a mage). You say that like you expect something different from a mage class that's incapable of casting half-decent offensive spells.

The worst meleeing mages are Blm and Smn anyway, can't even cap haste (without using a gimp staff/sub/lolRune Choppa).

Exactly. When SE designed the game, they made sure that there weren't going to be any classes that absolutely relied on a group to kill anything. Bard was given basic proficiency with Daggers, melee gear, and Evisceration because they're a support class with absolutely no other offensive capabilities. White Mage was given proficiency with Clubs, access to Maul class weapons, and Hexa Strike because they're a healing class with absolutely no decent offensive spells.

Why can't Summoner, Black Mage, and Scholar melee super effectively with staves then? Simple. They have nukes/Avatars. They have offensive capabilities, so they don't need melee proficiency in order to solo. They can actually bring something from full HP to 0 on their own. The only reason Whm and Brd have those Melee options is so that they can do the same if they absolutely have to.

It's not some sort of insult to say that a mage is less melee proficient than White Mage. It simply implies that the Devs thought the job was strong enough without it.

I also think that SE somewhat had a vision of previous FFs where daggers would be the "mage" + thf melee weapon (explains daggers crappy damage ratings until that one update) while sword was actually a DD weapon along with one handed axes and 2h weapons.

Mind you back then I can't exactly say SE knew exactly what they were doing and sword eventually became the crapfest of a weapon it is today.

Really, I bet there's plenty of choices that they wish they could have taken back if given a second chance.

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Originally Posted by Greatguardian

Exactly. When SE designed the game, they made sure that there weren't going to be any classes that absolutely relied on a group to kill anything. Bard was given basic proficiency with Daggers, melee gear, and Evisceration because they're a support class with absolutely no other offensive capabilities. White Mage was given proficiency with Clubs, access to Maul class weapons, and Hexa Strike because they're a healing class with absolutely no decent offensive spells.

Why can't Summoner, Black Mage, and Scholar melee super effectively with staves then? Simple. They have nukes/Avatars. They have offensive capabilities, so they don't need melee proficiency in order to solo. They can actually bring something from full HP to 0 on their own. The only reason Whm and Brd have those Melee options is so that they can do the same if they absolutely have to.

It's not some sort of insult to say that a mage is less melee proficient than White Mage. It simply implies that the Devs thought the job was strong enough without it.

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I think your confused. When this game first came out and in fact being designed the whole purpose of FFXI was group activity. They didn't want another MMO that was pure solo everything was made for group content. Now if you meant to say SE never intended any job to be defenseless then your right, SE made sure that each job could at least defend itself if needed. Aside from that I agree with your post.

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Originally Posted by StingRay104

I think your confused. When this game first came out and in fact being designed the whole purpose of FFXI was group activity. They didn't want another MMO that was pure solo everything was made for group content. Now if you meant to say SE never intended any job to be defenseless then your right, SE made sure that each job could at least defend itself if needed. Aside from that I agree with your post.

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That is exactly what I'm saying. FFXI has always been a group oriented game, but at the same time it was quite clear that the Devs did not want to leave any single job unable to defend itself or fight off aggro if they absolutely needed to. For mage jobs with no native offensive spellcasting proficiency, melee options were added.

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Originally Posted by Neisan_Quetz

The worst meleeing mages are Blm and SCH anyway, can't even cap haste (without using a gimp staff/sub/lolRune Choppa).

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fixed. Not to say I'm a huge SMN melee fan, but it is considerably more relevant than SCH melee.

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Originally Posted by GreatGuardian

When SE designed the game, they made sure that there weren't going to be any classes that absolutely relied on a group to kill anything.

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Nitpick, but when SE designed the game Holy was stupid powerful. Then again, the nerf on Holy was before or as they released Hexa. That's not to say that your point invalid, however (in fact it sort of strengthens it).

Potentially, they're still mostly in the same boat. Although At least Smn can self haste/buff their melee I guess.