Nyzul Isle Uncharted information and feedback

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Monchat

Wow holy shit the devs listen~ Make that and the whole wever will be doing nyzul lol, this looks really good.

---

Am I reading it wrong, it looks like they just did it so you can choose to go to floor 100 but you still need to go from floor 1, and it simply blocks going any higher? (floor 98~floor 4 I hate you.) Which I suppose is still better than it is.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Daniel_Hatcher

Am I reading it wrong, it looks like they just did it so you can choose to go to floor 100 but you still need to go from floor 1, and it simply blocks going any higher? (floor 98~floor 4 I hate you.) Which I suppose is still better than it is.

---

3 things.

1) We can't overshoot 100 Anymore, SO long as we choose 100 as our cap.
2) A "Upgrade" Tier system, Turning in X amount of Shitty (20) armor, into a level 40 piece, x Amount of 40 armor into a 60 piece
3) Beating Floor 100 Boss lets you select 1 piece of Floor 100 Armor, instead of random drop.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Karbuncle

3 things.

1) We can't overshoot 100 Anymore, SO long as we choose 100 as our cap.
2) A "Upgrade" Tier system, Turning in X amount of Shitty (20) armor, into a level 40 piece, x Amount of 40 armor into a 60 piece
3) Beating Floor 100 Boss lets you select 1 piece of Floor 100 Armor, instead of random drop.

---

If I'm reading that correctly then this too:

4) if you select a lower floor (ie floor 80), you can spam the ??? option knowing that the floor you selected is the highest floor you will be taken to.

EDIT: this is very good news. I may actually log in again to try this.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Karbuncle

3 things.

1) We can't overshoot 100 Anymore, SO long as we choose 100 as our cap.
2) A "Upgrade" Tier system, Turning in X amount of Shitty (20) armor, into a level 40 piece, x Amount of 40 armor into a 60 piece
3) Beating Floor 100 Boss lets you select 1 piece of Floor 100 Armor, instead of random drop.

---

Definitely an improvement over the exiting maddness. But on #2, I read it as there are 2 ways that they are thinking of.

Thinking 1:

Beat Floor Boss X times, pick 1 item from Floor Boss. So that you would have something like:

20 X times -> 1 item from 20.
40 Y times -> 1 item from 40.
60 Z times -> 1 item from 60.
80 M times -> 1 item from 80.
100 N times -> 1 item from 100.


Thinking 2 (more progression like to me) would be something along the lines of:

After beating the lower level Boss X number of times, you'll be allowed to pick an item from the Boss that is 1 incremental block higher. So that you have something like:

20 X times -> 1 item from 40.
40 Y times -> 1 item from 60.
60 Z times -> 1 item from 80.
80 M times -> 1 item from 100.
100 1 time -> 1 item from 100.

was really looking for an upgrade feature, so that is great. And the others options seems fine too. :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Karbuncle

2) A "Upgrade" Tier system, Turning in X amount of Shitty (20) armor, into a level 40 piece, x Amount of 40 armor into a 60 piece

---

Might be nitpicking but writing this like that would actually make it possible to get 100 armor spamming 20 floor enough times and that's not true here.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Atoreis

Might be nitpicking but writing this like that would actually make it possible to get 100 armor spamming 20 floor enough times and that's not true here.

---

Aye, it's not technically the armor you turn in. Just the kills. So you can't get floor 100 armor from enough floor 20 spam, only floor 40 armor. If you want floor 100 armor, you have to either farm floor 80 a bunch or beat floor 100. Though if they implement the stopper system as is, floor 100 will actually be doable and since they are also allowing the trade of floor 100 kills to drops at a 1:1 ratio it's pretty much awesome.

"We are also currently looking into the direction of obtaining the stronger equipment through this method. For example, if you are able to defeat the notorious monster on floor 20 above a certain amount of times, you will be able to receive one of the possible rewards for floor 40."

dear god this needs M bison or Jack Nicholson yes gif STAT

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Glamdring

ok, I've read enough of this garbage on these forums. PvP, u and me anywhere, bring any job you choose and any gear you like, you will still lose. Skill trumps gear every time, and yes, in fact I am that good that I don't need to rely on gear swaps to cover mediocre play, I just do my job better than the other guy. the only thing that would beat me on my chosen jobs is skill AND gear, and I'm familiar with almost all the players with better gear on my server, none of them are better than I am, although some are as good (excepting rng, skilling/gearing that is still a work in progress since I play it just for a change of pace). enough of this, I hate bragging-either listening to it or doing it myself

I do macro a few items, ele staves and instruments on bard, buffoon collar on pup, different ammo on rng, but no, for the most part I don't bother. I have this little measure of success I pay attention to: who's standing at the end of the fight, me or the mob. If it's me then I'm successful.

Incidentally, if you don't remember the days of people playing in SH+1 or Hauby or the like over relic then you either weren't around at 75 cap or you weren't paying attention. The general consensus on every forum was that most relic or AF sucked. Personally, I say if you can get the job done in it then free gear works, but whatever floats your boat. But yes, many people used lower-level gear as their base slot piece because it functioned better than the stuff that was available at cap in actual game play. In fact, they still do. Example, my thf knife and relic +2 hands, yes, i have stuff for the slots that will do higher damage but if I'm on my thief at all it's because I'm after a drop so I use the relic +2 hands and my thf knife on the off chance that TH actually works as claimed (I have sincere doubts about any tier above 3) and not macroing in other gear means i have 2 extra slots for the drops if they actually happen. If I just wanted to do damage I'd come on one of my jobs that hits harder and/or kills faster, like bst, pup, rng or dnc.

---

Congratulations on showing your lack of gameplay knowledge with the community - commence shunning.

Side note: Treasure hunter has been significantly tested; either you haven't looked because your stupid/lazy or you lack reading comprehension to understand math heavy posts?

Bonus Note: Challenging anyone to PvP in any game shows lack of maturity and lack of game knowledge. Beating someone in PvP(much less FFXI PvP) means squat. Good try though bro.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Atoreis

Might be nitpicking but writing this like that would actually make it possible to get 100 armor spamming 20 floor enough times and that's not true here.

---

Yah, sorry, I read it wrong.

ITs a "Beat X boss X times to Get 1 piece of the next floor up". So you can't spam floor 20 for a floor 100 piece, Floor 20 will only reward with floor 40 from this system, Floor 40 Will only allow 60, 60 to 80, 80 to 100, Etc.

Very awesome update :-)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Falseliberty

"We are also currently looking into the direction of obtaining the stronger equipment through this method. For example, if you are able to defeat the notorious monster on floor 20 above a certain amount of times, you will be able to receive one of the possible rewards for floor 40."

dear god this needs M bison or Jack Nicholson yes gif STAT

---

http://i.qkme.me/36d12i.jpg

good news indeed :)

looks like they just layed out the bait 1st to see if ppl do NYUR like it is and realized not enough care for it.. so they make plan b) and make it atleast POSSIBLE to reach a wanted floor and not overshot it and gain gear if you killed it enough times.

I really hope they'll make the way that you kill 80 x times to get a 80 or 100 item, and not just kill 80 x times and get a 80 item. For me it reads like its not decided yet which way they do it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Karbuncle

Yah, sorry, I read it wrong.

ITs a "Beat X boss X times to Get 1 piece of the next floor up". So you can't spam floor 20 for a floor 100 piece, Floor 20 will only reward with floor 40 from this system, Floor 40 Will only allow 60, 60 to 80, 80 to 100, Etc.

---

Actually, the way I read it makes it seem more like Heroes Abyssea Trophy system. I wouldn't mind that at all. It would be a grind to get every piece you wanted, but it would be a progression method that would please everyone given time put into the event.

If you take the exact numbers from the trophy exchanging, it would take 16x Floor 20 to yield 1 KI for a floor 100 piece, or 80 runs for all 5 pieces or 240 runs for all 15. It would be less if people made it to floor 40/60/80, but it would all add up for progression and rewards that anyone would be able to obtain given enough time and dedication and removing the luck factor.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Seankp

Actually, the way I read it makes it seem more like Heroes Abyssea Trophy system. I wouldn't mind that at all. It would be a grind to get every piece you wanted, but it would be a progression method that would please everyone given time put into the event.

If you take the exact numbers from the trophy exchanging, it would take 16x Floor 20 to yield 1 KI for a floor 100 piece, or 80 runs for all 5 pieces or 240 runs for all 15. It would be less if people made it to floor 40/60/80, but it would all add up for progression and rewards that anyone would be able to obtain given enough time and dedication and removing the luck factor.

---

The idea is nice, But frankly Floor 100 Armor is really broken, and floor 20 Is so easy Idiots could do it, you could probably 3 man a Floor 20 with perfect consistancy, even if they had to do it 80 times, that's too easy for the level of epic the floor 100 Armor is.

The idea of 20 Can only be 40, 40 can only be 60, and so forth, Seems to work. You still have to work hard (Floor 80~) if you want floor 100 armor, And so forth.

Who knows though, If it was a 5:1 Trade, It might work. Its tough. I don't envy them in their job to balance this out.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Camate

Greetings!

I’d like to share a message from Director Mizuki Ito in regards to upcoming changes to Nyzul Isle Uncharted Region.

---

http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b2...aisPleased.jpg

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Seankp

Actually, the way I read it makes it seem more like Heroes Abyssea Trophy system. I wouldn't mind that at all. It would be a grind to get every piece you wanted, but it would be a progression method that would please everyone given time put into the event.

If you take the exact numbers from the trophy exchanging, it would take 16x Floor 20 to yield 1 KI for a floor 100 piece, or 80 runs for all 5 pieces or 240 runs for all 15. It would be less if people made it to floor 40/60/80, but it would all add up for progression and rewards that anyone would be able to obtain given enough time and dedication and removing the luck factor.

---

Screwwwwwwwwwwww that. Straight up.

Allowing people to trade up 1 tier is plenty. It still requires that a group hit floor 80 consistently at the absolute minimum in order to get floor 100 armor. This is perfectly doable without any third party tools whatsoever, and I am completely okay with this.

Quote:

---

• Implementation of a “stopper” feature
After entering, we will be changing the system so that you will be able to set which floor you would like to aim for: 20/40/60/80/100.
While we will be removing the feature where you can go past your destination floor, once you reach the destination floor and fight the notorious monster you will no longer be able to progress to the next floor.

---

What's the purpose of this? so that you can't accidentally go past a floor you specifically want to go to?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alhanelem

What's the purpose of this? so that you can't accidentally go past a floor you specifically want to go to?

---

Yes. Seemed kind of obvious.

There have been a few groups who have made it to floor 100, Only to over shoot it (I.E going form floor 94 to 3). The "Stopper" Is there to put a "Maximum Limit" on where to go.

They're likely putting it in place for floor 100, To stop the wrap around. Adding in floor 20/40/60/80 Stopper is probably for symmetry.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Glamdring

ok, I've read enough of this garbage on these forums. PvP, u and me anywhere, bring any job you choose and any gear you like, you will still lose. Skill trumps gear every time, and yes, in fact I am that good that I don't need to rely on gear swaps to cover mediocre play, I just do my job better than the other guy. the only thing that would beat me on my chosen jobs is skill AND gear, and I'm familiar with almost all the players with better gear on my server, none of them are better than I am, although some are as good (excepting rng, skilling/gearing that is still a work in progress since I play it just for a change of pace). enough of this, I hate bragging-either listening to it or doing it myself

I do macro a few items, ele staves and instruments on bard, buffoon collar on pup, different ammo on rng, but no, for the most part I don't bother. I have this little measure of success I pay attention to: who's standing at the end of the fight, me or the mob. If it's me then I'm successful.

Incidentally, if you don't remember the days of people playing in SH+1 or Hauby or the like over relic then you either weren't around at 75 cap or you weren't paying attention. The general consensus on every forum was that most relic or AF sucked. Personally, I say if you can get the job done in it then free gear works, but whatever floats your boat. But yes, many people used lower-level gear as their base slot piece because it functioned better than the stuff that was available at cap in actual game play. In fact, they still do. Example, my thf knife and relic +2 hands, yes, i have stuff for the slots that will do higher damage but if I'm on my thief at all it's because I'm after a drop so I use the relic +2 hands and my thf knife on the off chance that TH actually works as claimed (I have sincere doubts about any tier above 3) and not macroing in other gear means i have 2 extra slots for the drops if they actually happen. If I just wanted to do damage I'd come on one of my jobs that hits harder and/or kills faster, like bst, pup, rng or dnc.

---

Omg... this is comedy GOLD! You, sir, are a genius. Bravo.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Greatguardian

Screwwwwwwwwwwww that. Straight up.

Allowing people to trade up 1 tier is plenty. It still requires that a group hit floor 80 consistently at the absolute minimum in order to get floor 100 armor. This is perfectly doable without any third party tools whatsoever, and I am completely okay with this.

---

I have to agree here. 1 Tier trade up definitely would lessen the randomless of having to try to hit that lucky roll of 7-9 on every floor jump to get to Floor 100 without the use of tools and at the same time keep the event challenging. Now, just pray that SE doesn't make X = 1000 like the freakin metal upgrade.

This is a fantastic adjustment, you'll be able to farm the floor that your group can reliably hit (in a static you can identify this quickly), and then try for the next tier. It actually offers a loose form of progression whilst not making it easy mode.

I like how being able to overshoot floor 100 was considered a feature. It amuses me quite a bit.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Camate

Greetings!

I’d like to share a message from Director Mizuki Ito in regards to upcoming changes to Nyzul Isle Uncharted Region.

---

Those changes sound like the perfect middle ground. Perfect.

http://www.gdirectory.org/articleimages/good-chef.png

I wonder if they'll drop the ball on this like the VW Ticket system

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Karbuncle

I wonder if they'll drop the ball on this like the VW Ticket system

---

They wouldn't be SE if they didn't.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Karbuncle

I wonder if they'll drop the ball on this like the VW Ticket system

---

I had the same thought roughly two seconds after I posted. I guess I should open up Paint.net and make a version of the chef I posted earlier holding a bottle of poison, to post if the "clarifications" about the changes come.

Interesting but SE still hasn't addressed the fact that since the last time I checked fl100 nyzul is impossible without outright cheating. At least there might be actual interest in nyzul now.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Khajit

Interesting but SE still hasn't addressed the fact that since the last time I checked fl100 nyzul is impossible without outright cheating. At least there might be actual interest in nyzul now.

---

With the stopper it is possible to get to f100 without any cheats.

INB4: It requires luck

I agree with this post

As long as its a system like the dominion battle trophy with no ability to exchange them, it is fine, and keeps a requirement to win at floor 80/100 to get the lv 100 versions.

I'd also like to suggest that the nyzul boss key items be exchangeable for cotton coin pouches, at a somewhat lower rate of trade than the armor (2 for 20/40, 1 for 60/80/100). This would give some meaning to key items that groups might accumulate by randomly landing on a boss floor while aiming for a higher target floor (e.g. landing on floor 20 when aiming for floor 80). It could add maybe 50ish alexandrite per group if they all trade in, so it would still be less than a single salvage run, but would provide a much-needed boost in the alexandrite supply.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Khajit

Interesting but SE still hasn't addressed the fact that since the last time I checked fl100 nyzul is impossible without outright cheating. At least there might be actual interest in nyzul now.

---

Eh, even if basic things like seeing through walls is too much, players can accumulate the exact same gear by doing Floor 80 a bit more - which is perfectly doable in vanilla FFXI.

I wonder if the option to not use the 'stopper' feature will remain.

If I'm reading it right, just set the "stopper" to F100 and you'll have basically achieved the same thing, unless you enjoy going 94 > 3.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Atoreis

With the stopper it is possible to get to f100 without any cheats.

INB4: It requires luck

---

When I'd last semi thoroughly checked nyzul info(just before a group actually discovered you could overshoot it was calculated something along the lines of a 1.6~0.6% chance to win.(I cant seem to find the actual number calculated anymore for some reason). As such you are not filling me with confidence in your words at all and have actually ended up pulling a Mussolini wherein you have the opposite effect.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Greatguardian

Eh, even if basic things like seeing through walls is too much, players can accumulate the exact same gear by doing Floor 80 a bit more - which is perfectly doable in vanilla FFXI.

---

Uh.. GG you completely missed the point in my statement there which is honestly a new one for you. The point was that they aren't fixing the fact that cheating is effectively(since when you get into fractions of a percent on an event with limited access it effectively can be) it was that they still haven't made it legitimately possible to to the best of my knowledge. If back when the 18 hour PW news came out SE had said you could trade in 30+ sarameya/khim/tinnin hides for a single PW drop it wouldn't have been considered fixing the problem so I don't see why it is considered fixing the fl100 problem in Nyzul.

And really the fact that you think having X-ray vision like Ka-el of the Planet Krypton is a "basic thing" says alot about the state of Nyzul right now.

Nice changes... except now I got to change my sig again >_<

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Greatguardian

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Seankp

Actually, the way I read it makes it seem more like Heroes Abyssea Trophy system. I wouldn't mind that at all. It would be a grind to get every piece you wanted, but it would be a progression method that would please everyone given time put into the event.

If you take the exact numbers from the trophy exchanging, it would take 16x Floor 20 to yield 1 KI for a floor 100 piece, or 80 runs for all 5 pieces or 240 runs for all 15. It would be less if people made it to floor 40/60/80, but it would all add up for progression and rewards that anyone would be able to obtain given enough time and dedication and removing the luck factor.

---

Screwwwwwwwwwwww that. Straight up.

Allowing people to trade up 1 tier is plenty. It still requires that a group hit floor 80 consistently at the absolute minimum in order to get floor 100 armor. This is perfectly doable without any third party tools whatsoever, and I am completely okay with this.

---

They could implement the system as Seankp suggested without breaking the game. It just wouldn't be 2x kills per upgrade, it would be much more. Knowing SE, there's no way they'd make it 2x kills to upgrade anyway.

Even if it was only 5x kills on a floor to get a piece from the next one up, figure that's 25 floor 20s to get a floor 60, 125 floor 20s to get a floor 80, and 625 floor 20s to get a 100.

And that's only a single piece of gear. Make it 8x kills per floor to upgrade, and you'd still need 64 floor 60 kills to get one piece of floor 100 gear. I don't care how awesome floor 100 gear is, 64 successful floor 60 runs for one piece of gear isn't really game-breaking. And even if you think it is, they could just make the multiplier higher.

In any case, a system like that would give players exactly what they want, a sense of progression where the best gear isn't hopelessly impossible to obtain, it just takes a long time.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Greatguardian

Nope. If a group can't hit floor 80, they shouldn't be wearing floor 100 gear. Period. Don't care how many years they've played, or how many F20 bosses they've killed. I don't care if it takes 2 years per piece. Anyone, and I mean anyone can hit floor 80. They just can't hit it with Glamdring's attitude, or Rosina's attitude, or Naturebeckle's attitude.

Some gimps need to get their ego toned down a few dozen bars before they'll ever be able to improve. I'm still cracking up at Glamdring being the best player on his server.

---

I'm not trying to arguing with you, one, because I greatly respect you and your contributions to the community, and two, because the FFXI player in me totally agrees with what you just said.

But you have to look at this from SE's perspective. The fact is that gimps make up a hefty portion of the playerbase, and each of the people you mentioned is worth the exact same 12.95 a month to SE as people like you. If you were SE, would you rather implement an event where the gimps basically give up and ignore it, and eventually quit in frustration? Or one where you can dangle a carrot in front of them that they can realistically (eventually) obtain, but only if they play (and pay a subscription) for those two more years per piece of gear?

You don't maintain subscriptions by alienating the gimps. You maintain them by giving the gimps a reason to play (and pay) for much, much longer periods of time. This way, anyone with half a clue can still get their gear reasonably quickly, and show it off all they want, while those without a clue have a VERY long road ahead of them, but it's a road they are still capable of traveling.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Divinius

I'm not trying to arguing with you, one, because I greatly respect you and your contributions to the community, and two, because the FFXI player in me totally agrees with what you just said.

But you have to look at this from SE's perspective. The fact is that gimps make up a hefty portion of the playerbase, and each of the people you mentioned is worth the exact same 12.95 a month to SE as people like you. If you were SE, would you rather implement an event where the gimps basically give up and ignore it, and eventually quit in frustration? Or one where you can dangle a carrot in front of them that they can realistically (eventually) obtain, but only if they play (and pay a subscription) for those two more years per piece of gear?

You don't maintain subscriptions by alienating the gimps. You maintain them by giving the gimps a reason to play (and pay) for much, much longer periods of time. This way, anyone with half a clue can still get their gear reasonably quickly, and show it off all they want, while those without a clue have a VERY long road ahead of them, but it's a road they are still capable of traveling.

---

I don't think there's very much for people to feel good about with an event that anyone can beat, however. Just look at the overwhelming response from this community towards Abyssea and you'll see what I mean. Most old-school, HNM/Endgame players loved it while most of the people who had still not worked their way out of sky in 2010 absolutely abhorred it (barring a few exceptions).

It's all a matter of the ego. Of course people are going to be unhappy if they can't beat an event, because that challenges their ego. They'll come up with any excuse they can, be it "I only lose because I'm not a cheating botter scumbag who rapes children", or "I'm more skilled than any of those guys, I just don't RMT all my gil and suck pee-pee for gear because I have my dignity". In the end, that's all it really boils down to. Events that are beatable by anyone don't stroke the ego, so even if it's made accessible to them it immediately becomes unwanted.

The real carrot isn't supposed to be the gear. It's supposed to be the increase in skill, teamwork, and tactics required to get said gear. The goal is for people to be improving themselves as players, and frankly no one who hasn't already done so will bother if they're able to get everything while maintaining a horrendously gimp attitude.

It doesn't take spectacular gear or 3PP to hit floor 80. It just takes a basic understanding of game mechanics and teamwork. Of course, everyone thinks that they have that, even when they don't, and thus blame their inability to hit floor 80 on external factors like bots and hacks. Note that I'm specifically talking about 80 here. I know plenty well that hitting 100 without even basic Windower is going to still be a crapshoot, but I don't much care as that's just what people have to deal with when they choose not to use a superior interface in 2012.

What people like Glamdring need to learn is that they aren't as good at this game as they think they are, they don't know as much as they think they do, and the real reason they're losing isn't because of bots/hacks/RMT/ but because they're just not good, and the only way to prove that is to have an event that'll give them a swift kick in the ass if they go in with their current mindset.

At the same time, even for gimps, F60 gear is probably better than what they're wearing now, so with the changes, even subpar players can do the event and get better gear, they just won't get the best gear. They just need not to be braindead.