Worst end game community ever?

[Kluya15]

Hit 50 about 3 days ago. This weekend is the first chance I've had to play around with some of the end game content. So far I've gotta say the overall dbagishness, eliteness of the end game players has seriously made me reconsider subscribing.


Here's my problem: You have all these "pro" players essentially farming the same dungeon over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over. Putting ungoldy amounts of time into farming their very special gear, then bitching whenever new players come along and disturb their mindless dungeon grind.

Welcome to every MMO. Join or make a FC with friends if other players attitudes are too much for you to handle.

[Tolmos]

Unfortunately, I have to say that I've had more trouble with people in this game using DF than I ever did in other games with random dungeon finders. But then, Asian grinders usually bring out the worst in people here in the States. I dunno why, but they get super anal and every little thing makes them explode.

Eventually you just have to hit a point where you realize: A) Them yelling really only negatively affects them. B) You'll get more done just saying "Get over it and play. Or leave. Your choice" than trying to argue with them C) People with happy out of game lives don't blow up like that, so you probably should give them more pity than anger.

Finally- find a group on your server and run with them regularly. As you learn each others playstyles, you will have a better gaming experience and not have to deal with that kind of issue nearly as much.

[Alavastre]

I find the endgame experience to be about normal for PVE servers. One of the reasons I migrated to a RP server on SWTOR, as it was just annoying dealing with this stuff. However, they are all PVE servers. In all honesty, I've had a pretty positive experience with DF and groups. Maybe my server group is a little less annoying than others.

I did have a Warrior tank yesterday on Ifrit that did terrible. He pulled Ifrit, and then 15 seconds later lost hate, which I have no idea how that happens with one target. Basically, Ifrit turned around, destroyed everything, and us healers were trying to pick up the pieces. We wiped. Then he was complaining about not getting healed. His friend was backing him up. Doesn't matter, I saw him lose hate. The other Pally gets annoyed, and so the next round they are trading tanking the boss, almost killed us again because there was just too much damage.

Anyway, we ended up winning. The point is, you get dbags, then you can be very straight forward with them. Arguments don't really help. But most people tend to be receptive to a let's give it a try attitude. That, and you don't really need armor for a 47 level dungeon. You do however need to be coordinated. And that is what a lot of the elite people miss when making fun of the Pug groups.

[Argentil]

I feel that SE really should halve the ToP count granted at the end of CM and Prae, putting it on par with Wanderer's Palace, which is a fun instance. Personally, after doing CM and Prae once for the story, and suffering the pressure and abuse of speedrunners, WP was a lot more fun to farm. Sure you may get half the amount of tomestones in the same timeframe, but you do have a chance of winning a darklight weapon of item level 55 (as well as iLevel 55 armour). That in itself is worth running WP over CM. Did I mention WP is a fun instance?

In addition to the above, I feel that speedrunners should absolutely NOT be running via Duty Finder. It takes 10 minutes to form a group in Revenant's Toll. 10 minutes to grab a group of people from your own server, who are accountable for their actions because they are from your server. First-timers are stuck with using the Duty Finder to run the place, speedrunners really have no reason to do so outside of being unsociable and lazy.

One final afterthought; I've heard it argued that players doing it for the first time who are progressing through the story should form runs outside of the duty finder. It's this backwards "well if I have to form parties, why don't you?" logic. Please try and get a group of 8 non-speedrunners for CM/Prae and tell me how long it takes you. If you were to combine the assembly time for Dorme Chimera and Hydra, then you would probably be close.

[MagnusMKI]

The most unexpected thing happened to me yesterday - I was actually complemented on helping new players learn AK.

Now, don't get me wrong, I hit 50 very early last week and was busy with work so I was still wrapping up my ToM for the week, and only needed 17 more so I figured I'd DF one more AK run.

Tank and other DPS load in and inform the party it's their first runs, so I reply with a simple no problem and explain the bosses as we get to them. Did it take longer than usual? Sure. Who cares?

I understand the "Pump out tokens to get gear" mentality, but at the end of the day you need to work for that with other people. To put down people who simply have yet to learn the tricks is moronic, and unfortunately all too common.

A lot of older MMO players don't have this overbearing attitude, but sadly the ones that do leave a far more powerful impression.

[Furio]

But then, Asian grinders usually bring out the worst in people here in the States. I dunno why, but they get super anal and every little thing makes them explode.

When a game forces you to repeat the same 1 or 2 dungeons hundreds of times, it's only normal you get like that. You want those 100 tomes so you can get out of that ill designed, boring, ugly fucking dungeon asap.

Is it right? Of course not. But it is expected.

If you want to blame anyone, blame SE for releasing a game with hardly any content to gear you up for Coil.

[kazaran]

Ignore negative people. These are people who wouldn't survive the business world, end up in prison for poor business ethics, and not a viable part of a community.

On story the one dungeon you do need to speed it up to get all those parts done, but some parts trigger after the cs is done.

Work together and you succeed. Act rude, and harass, and you aren't going to get done, so why bother and destroy the chance at a successful run?

Being rude just gives you a bad rep. You may think you are a bad ass but in reality you piss off far more then you think you are impressing.

[Rhymelark]

In addition to the above, I feel that speedrunners should absolutely NOT be running via Duty Finder. It takes 10 minutes to form a group in Revenant's Toll. 10 minutes to grab a group of people from your own server, who are accountable for their actions because they are from your server. First-timers are stuck with using the Duty Finder to run the place, speedrunners really have no reason to do so outside of being unsociable and lazy.

..... I'm sure calling people unsociable and lazy helps a lot. The Duty Finder is there to be used.

I'm sure people would be complaining then that they wait to long in the duty finder to find a group instead of the quick pops you get now. I have heard quite a few complaints of people waiting for Praetorian groups.

Porting to Revenant's Toll costs quite a bit of gill and if you have not realized it yet gill is pretty tight once you hit lvl 50 and start doing runs to gear up with repair costs etc. So using the Duty Finder saves from porting to Revenant's Toll to get a group.

[Tsalmaveth]

This thread makes me sad. It also encourages me to keep doing what an FC-mate and I decided to do last night. A friend trying to finish game on his WHM needed to do CM and Praetorium, so I asked my pet tank to help him do a 'story run' and not have to rely on Duty Finder. No one else in the FC was free at the time, so we went up to the quest hub area and looked for people wanting to run it slow, gathered a group and led them through. He single tanked it perfectly well and I was able to solo-heal Preatoruim after the first boss when our WHM friend had to go for a home emergency. Stressful, but incredibly rewarding to let people relax and have fun, revel in the epic scenes and music of Preatorium... and we even gave them hits and showed them strats for when they DO end up with speed run groups for CM. It was a great time and I hope S'lade and I can do it again.

[Argentil]

..... I'm sure calling people unsociable and lazy helps a lot. The Duty Finder is there to be used.

I'm sure people would be complaining then that they wait to long in the duty finder to find a group instead of the quick pops you get now. I have heard quite a few complaints of people waiting for Praetorian groups.

Porting to Revenant's Toll costs quite a bit of gill and if you have not realized it yet gill is pretty tight once you hit lvl 50 and start doing runs to gear up with repair costs etc. So using the Duty Finder saves from porting to Revenant's Toll to get a group.

Oh? That's strange, I see so many 50's gathered in Revenant's Toll forming groups. I go there daily myself. I have it set as a Favourite Point, my teleport's only cost 155 Gill from Limsa Lominsa, which is my home point. Why is this an argument? It's widely understood that RT is a group-finding hub, you also purchase your upgrades and crafting mats there.

As for "calling people unsociable and lazy;" I can only imagine you have a horse in this race, to take it so personally and in the worst possible way. I was making a point that finding a group is so easy, and often times faster than queueing as DPS, that you would have to be averse to making conversation, or browsing LFG text, which would make you unsociable, or lazy. Once people realise that DF speedrunning isn't the optimal way to go, things would improve all around. This is all if SE keep the tomestone reward the same. If they reduce the tomestone count by half, speedrunning would be a non-issue, but people would still run it for an easy reward.