[dev1022] Auto-attack system questions and discussion

[Nephera]

Auto attack ruins the other "attacks" each class gets that you purchase with marks. If they add auto attack I hope they don't do away with the flexibility of things like close shot, heavy shot, far shot, heavy slash, heavy swing etc...

A lot of people don't know they exist, and they think all they have for options is "light attack" which isn't the case. If people started using the other optional "standard attacks" you can purchase with marks, they wouldn't be asking for auto attack.

They are attacks that come at a stamina cost greater than "light swing" but have additional effects like generating more TP for the player, reducing the monsters TP each swing, increasing enmity and hitting multiple targets.

These are "standard attacks" that are not TP moves, so if used correctly should make most of the rants about "all I do is push 1 button anyway" moot.

Go buy your class skills, and start using them.

I agree with this, but 6k guild marks can be hard to get. Especially if you keep missing the day they're offering leves for your class.

[Maat]

I agree with this, but 6k guild marks can be hard to get. Especially if you keep missing the day they're offering leves for your class.

I agree that the new options for different battle actions was very innovative and it would be a shame to see it go. But you also have to look at how the auto attack feature was able to set the base for new gear, abilities, skills, and waepons in FFXI. Not to mention how the auto attack can be better regulated.

I also believe that the auto attack feature will help with lack luster battle animations and deal with spamming. It would be a good decision to maybe integrate the two ( battle actions and auto attack) by having different auto attack selections each having there own delay.

[Betelgeuzah]

I agree that the new options for different battle actions was very innovative and it would be a shame to see it go. But you also have to look at how the auto attack feature was able to set the base for new gear, abilities, skills, and waepons in FFXI. Not to mention how the auto attack can be better regulated.

I also believe that the auto attack feature will help with lack luster battle animations and deal with spamming.

I don't see how exactly auto-attack feature would somehow affect battle animations. These kind of improvements can be implemented without auto-attack as well.

FFXI had also very uninvolving gameplay (which admittedly got better as you gained more levels, even though even then it was partly due to failure of the game mechanics), and I don't think the excuse of "the developers can regulate the combat system better" is good enough to bring it back and make the combat of XIV less involving as the result.

If auto-attack comes with some other changes that retain the depth and involving gameplay from before, which also make it so that with these other changes having manual input would be detrimental to the game, I could see why it is being implemented. I do not think that making us spam less attacks without making it so we can be involved in combat in some other ways would be an acceptable solution.

However, I have gained some trust in the new development team and am eager to hear their reasoning for this change, if not sooner, then later.

[northernsky]

Auto attack ruins the other "attacks" each class gets that you purchase with marks. If they add auto attack I hope they don't do away with the flexibility of things like close shot, heavy shot, far shot, heavy slash, heavy swing etc...

A lot of people don't know they exist, and they think all they have for options is "light attack" which isn't the case. If people started using the other optional "standard attacks" you can purchase with marks, they wouldn't be asking for auto attack.

They are attacks that come at a stamina cost greater than "light swing" but have additional effects like generating more TP for the player, reducing the monsters TP each swing, increasing enmity and hitting multiple targets.

These are "standard attacks" that are not TP moves, so if used correctly should make most of the rants about "all I do is push 1 button anyway" moot.

Go buy your class skills, and start using them.

You bring a very good point.

Something I could see is that all attacking abilities that cost no point to equip could be used as auto attack.

Let's say you equip them on your bar, but when you select one of those auto-attack moves, the first hit throws in, then other hits follow at a given interval, that is different for the different moves.

If you hit the same auto-attack move again, it turns auto-attack off, which lets you stack ferocity/bloodbath/hawk's eye/ TP move etc.

If you hit another auto-attack move, it kicks in when the previous move's cooldown is done and this is your new auto-attack.

It could be a nice way to combine the current system with an auto-attack, what do you think?

[Malakhim]

You bring a very good point.

Something I could see is that all attacking abilities that cost no point to equip could be used as auto attack.

Let's say you equip them on your bar, but when you select one of those auto-attack moves, the first hit throws in, then other hits follow at a given interval, that is different for the different moves.

If you hit the same auto-attack move again, it turns auto-attack off, which lets you stack ferocity/bloodbath/hawk's eye/ TP move etc.

If you hit another auto-attack move, it kicks in when the previous move's cooldown is done and this is your new auto-attack.

It could be a nice way to combine the current system with an auto-attack, what do you think?

The problem with this idea is that you don't take the stamina bar into account. There's an action cost, but each action uses different amounts of the stamina bar. Certain abilities are also dependent on the use of others, such as flurry only being able to be set off after a successful heavy strike. At least as a pugilist, auto attack wouldn't make sense. In order for auto-attack to work effectively, they'd need to revise a whole slew of abilities and probably do away with the stamina bar/cost idea, which I'm personally not a fan of. That isn't to say that I wouldn't be in favor of it if they were able to come up with a creative solution that doesn't destroy the game for a subset of players.

[northernsky]

The problem with this idea is that you don't take the stamina bar into account. There's an action cost, but each action uses different amounts of the stamina bar. Certain abilities are also dependent on the use of others, such as flurry only being able to be set off after a successful heavy strike. At least as a pugilist, auto attack wouldn't make sense. In order for auto-attack to work effectively, they'd need to revise a whole slew of abilities and probably do away with the stamina bar/cost idea, which I'm personally not a fan of. That isn't to say that I wouldn't be in favor of it if they were able to come up with a creative solution that doesn't destroy the game for a subset of players.

I think auto-attack could just be taken out of the stamina system, and readjust the cost of the moves that consume stamina accordingly.
Higher stamina cost of existing base attacks (that would be converted into auto-attack) could translate into higher delay between strikes.

Why do you think it would not work with your pug reflex moves?
I think it gives you even more time to focus on these types of moves. Also, I can throw in a feint even after I have launched a successful attack after having missed as long as my ~3 seconds feint timer is not over

[Madrox]

Auto attack ruins the other "attacks" each class gets that you purchase with marks. If they add auto attack I hope they don't do away with the flexibility of things like close shot, heavy shot, far shot, heavy slash, heavy swing etc...

A lot of people don't know they exist, and they think all they have for options is "light attack" which isn't the case. If people started using the other optional "standard attacks" you can purchase with marks, they wouldn't be asking for auto attack.

They are attacks that come at a stamina cost greater than "light swing" but have additional effects like generating more TP for the player, reducing the monsters TP each swing, increasing enmity and hitting multiple targets.

These are "standard attacks" that are not TP moves, so if used correctly should make most of the rants about "all I do is push 1 button anyway" moot.

Go buy your class skills, and start using them.

QFT

I don't honestly want to see Auto-Attack, I haven't even been enjoying myself in-game as much ever since the possibility was brought up. Chatting should be done for tactics before-hand, and if needed in middle of attacking it needs to be worked around(like during skills).

If they want to do something, maybe figure out another alternative for the battle system..

[Dreamer]

Auto attack ruins the other "attacks" each class gets that you purchase with marks. If they add auto attack I hope they don't do away with the flexibility of things like close shot, heavy shot, far shot, heavy slash, heavy swing etc...

A lot of people don't know they exist, and they think all they have for options is "light attack" which isn't the case. If people started using the other optional "standard attacks" you can purchase with marks, they wouldn't be asking for auto attack.

They are attacks that come at a stamina cost greater than "light swing" but have additional effects like generating more TP for the player, reducing the monsters TP each swing, increasing enmity and hitting multiple targets.

These are "standard attacks" that are not TP moves, so if used correctly should make most of the rants about "all I do is push 1 button anyway" moot.

Go buy your class skills, and start using them.

The above quote is very, very true. I've never feel as though I'm spamming attacks in game. As others have said, I feel that adding an auto-attack will severely impact the interactive feel that the game currently has. Though there's certainly room for improvement with the current battle system, there are better ways to do it than adding an auto-attack.

[Seikninkuru]

The above quote is very, very true. I've never feel as though I'm spamming attacks in game. As others have said, I feel that adding an auto-attack will severely impact the interactive feel that the game currently has. Though there's certainly room for improvement with the current battle system, there are better ways to do it than adding an auto-attack.

Yeah instead of tweaking it, add auto-attack add delays to all weapons(make sure you balance this with damage and everything else), tweak stamina bar to reflect this also... Sounds like the rational solution right? *rolls eyes*

[Shikyo]

Auto attack ruins the other "attacks" each class gets that you purchase with marks. If they add auto attack I hope they don't do away with the flexibility of things like close shot, heavy shot, far shot, heavy slash, heavy swing etc...

A lot of people don't know they exist, and they think all they have for options is "light attack" which isn't the case. If people started using the other optional "standard attacks" you can purchase with marks, they wouldn't be asking for auto attack.

They are attacks that come at a stamina cost greater than "light swing" but have additional effects like generating more TP for the player, reducing the monsters TP each swing, increasing enmity and hitting multiple targets.

These are "standard attacks" that are not TP moves, so if used correctly should make most of the rants about "all I do is push 1 button anyway" moot.

Go buy your class skills, and start using them.

Every thread i see you in i see that you are there ranting about not changing this failing game, and telling anyone that doesnt agree their whining and complaining ect. Man if they listen to you they may as well pack it up and shut it down.
Dude this game is failing ppl have different opinions why it is, but i think all but a select few non final fantasy fans that just like mmo's, can agree that something needs to change. Again we all think different things are more pressing on the list than other things but the majority of the true series fans agree things need to change.
SE i think knows this as well. They listened the fans and felt it in their pocket, thats why there is a new devo team prod. forums polls ect, you think these things were made cause the game was recieved with smiles cheers and open arms+wallets?
So idk to what extent but i think its safe to say you are sol in wanting to keep this subpar offering (from what i rate as the #1 rpg maker in the industry) unchanged i know ppl like what they like but man SE showed better if you played XI it confuses me even more how you keep saying "dude this game is fine the way it is". To each their own, but man i am SOOOO happy you alone dont hold the fate of this game cause i for one want it to survive and thrive