Summoners useless in 24mans?

[Elima]

GW2 and Rift I believe both had this same ridiculous limitation.
It makes dot classes completely worthless, and there is no need for such a minuscule limitation.

[Naunet]

GW2 and Rift I believe both had this same ridiculous limitation.
It makes dot classes completely worthless, and there is no need for such a minuscule limitation.

Rift's limit, if it has one, is way more than 30: http://i.imgur.com/8tkv0nF.jpg

On topic, 30 does seem extremely low.

[Gwendolen]

Ridiculous limitation?

Idk but 30 separate DoTs happening to a mob at the same does not sound like that ridiculous of a limitation to me.

To each his/her own, though.

Oh, okay. So then to be fair, if more than 13 people are attacking a mob, then all archers cant attack until someone else cancels auto attack. Does that sound fair to you?

[Rage89]

Oh, okay. So then to be fair, if more than 13 people are attacking a mob, then all archers cant attack until someone else cancels auto attack. Does that sound fair to you?

psssst bards rely heavily on dots for dps to so your arguement is.... VALID lol. but ya mostly smn/bard/blm will be effected by a drop in dps if 30 debuffs on the foe. however this is a 24 man RAID. use organization to prioritize certain dots and count them out telling which classes can use which debuffs and just dont take all summoners for dps.

[Rochetm]

psssst bards rely heavily on dots for dps to so your arguement is.... VALID lol. but ya mostly smn/bard/blm will be effected by a drop in dps if 30 debuffs on the foe. however this is a 24 man RAID. use organization to prioritize certain dots and count them out telling which classes can use which debuffs and just dont take all summoners for dps.

Monks will generally have 3 dots and 1 debuff on the boss. Debuff increases their damage. War has a similar debuff... Drg has a similar Debuff.

This is an all classes problem.

[necrosis]

Ridiculous limitation?

Idk but 30 separate DoTs happening to a mob at the same does not sound like that ridiculous of a limitation to me.

To each his/her own, though.

Do we really need reasons to ostracize jobs from fights? Especially because of a hard coded game mechanic? The player base does this on their own well enough as it is. Anyone who has played FFXI fully knows this.

[Vmage]

Ridiculous limitation?

Idk but 30 separate DoTs happening to a mob at the same does not sound like that ridiculous of a limitation to me.

To each his/her own, though.

crystal tower.

24 people

as a paladin i can place 3 debuffs on bosses myself, as a monk another 3, as a dragoon 4, as a summoner there's 5-6, and bard and blm dps would suffer quite a bit without their dots applied

basically in crystal tower, summoner's just won't do damage to any boss where all 3 parties meet up

[Krisan]

it's not a display error, it's actually a limit

and this isn't just summoner

tanks put up 2-3 debuffs, melees put up 3-4, bards another 2, blm 1, summoner 5-6

summoner's have it worst, but 30 debuff slots into 24 people means every class but black mage is performing sub-par

which means to have the best chance at killing things, you tell your dragoons and monks and summoner to come as black mage today, or sit out

Bio, Bio 2, Miasma, Miasma 2 (sometimes, it's radial and requires going in, also is one of our shorter debuffs so it's not always worth it), Virus doesn't do damage and doesn't last very long regardless so ignore that one.. so yeah, roughly 18 debuffs at any one time if there's 1 SMN per group. BLM and BRD should be able to stack their debuffs in the remainder - if there's three BLM that's about 21 debuffs, that leaves 9 for BRD's and misc - the other jobs aren't as vitally needing to stack debuffs (nor are they likely to pop them in the first few seconds, meaning they shouldn't interfere with the cap). This also assumes you have 3 SMN's at all, you might not, you might just bring two, or even just one. It's not that big a deal, it just requires people to actually pay attention and let the SMN's do their job first, rather than spam skills ASAP for the sake of spamming them. (SMN DoT stacks do tons of damage, there's no reason at all not to let them take priority after the tank initiates)

Also.. our DoT's refresh upon recasting em, as long as we keep them up, they shouldn't get pushed off the list. (Not to mention we can spread all our debuffs to every nearby target, we'll virtually always have our stuff up on SOMETHING)

[Vmage]

so yeah, roughly 18 debuffs at any one time if there's 1 SMN per group.

don't forget thunder

it may not affect fester, but it's a lot better dps than ruin, same goes for shadowflare which may or may not be taking up a debuff slot with slow (although this is probably the best debuff there is so it should absolutely have priority)

I don't attribute ruin II to summoners as the tank is probably (should be) flashing anyways

but yeah, if you wanted to count defensive debuffs that may or may not be important depending on the fight, we could look at virus taking 2 slots, eye for an eye proc taking another

[Yamimarik]

same goes for shadowflare which may or may not be taking up a debuff slot with slow (although this is probably the best debuff there is so it should absolutely have priority)

Shadowflare is actually showed up as a "buff" on the Summoner. Not as a debuff on the mob, so Shadowflare is safe from the cap.

EDIT: Ignore me I'm not all here today @.@ Yes the slow takes a slot up I'm sorry. ; ;