An Examination of "Vote to Kick"

[Roaminggnome]

Curious how did GW1 do it?

Then change the way skipping works, honestly gw1's was perfect in that regard.

[LiadansWhisper]

OP, I agree 100% with you. We desperately need a Vote to Kick. It might be abused sometimes, but people are already abusing the lack of a Vote to Kick.

It's going to destroy the Duty Finder if they don't get it under control. I'm already completely unwilling to randomly queue for anything because of the horrible experiences I've had with Duty Finder groups at max level. Most of the people I know are saying the same things. So what happens when no one wants to use the Duty Finder? Only those with friends/connections will get to actually complete dungeons in a timely, fun manner. The rest are either going to be SOL or endure truly awful experiences.

If they going to implement vote kick they better give me option to filter out premade group. Here a few thing will happen with vote kick system.

1. Baddie will just premade prevent from getting vote kick.
2. Baddie will blame/vote kick you for them the one who don't know the mechanic
3.Douchbag premade prevent you from vote kick them and you in their mercy instead

I hate being vote kick unfairly.If 3 randomly pple kick me I only got myself to blame. Well i'm saying give me option to filter out premade group from my DF.

WoW solved this by making it so that groups that queued together only counted as "1" vote in a vote-to-kick scenario.

[Ceelo_Mage]

this is a solid Thread

but

there are those that would say they pay their sub so they can play how they choose and it sucks but its true

[Papamax]

::snip::
there are those that would say they pay their sub so they can play how they choose and it sucks but its true

That's only true to a point. Being a screw up because you don't know the dungeon (or how to play your class) is one thing. Being a screw up so you can grief other players is a breach of the ToS. The former can be addressed, providing you're willing to listen and learn. The latter requires an attitude adjustment, usually delivered via GM intervention.

A vote-kick system for the DF may run the risk of being abused, but the alternative is worse.

[Avengedangel]

You make a lot of good points! I'll have to admit, I was one of those "this will most likely be abusedd" people, but taking into account all the trolls we've got right now, I wouldn't mind having the kick at all. Sure it's gonna be abused, but I believe having SOMETHING that allows us to take action against all the annoying behavior that's going on in the DF right now is better than having nothing at all.

[amnie]

it's fairly easy, really.

if a group doesn't WANT you in the run (skipping scenes, speed runs) then you won't ENJOY it anyway. so, they kick you. is that nice? absolutely not. and I'm fairly sure you'll have a right to report that.

but NOT being able to kick anyone... well we KNOW the consequences for that.

heck, the other day I hat a BOTTING tank in a Sastasha run.

[Marael]

- For whatever reason, somebody decides to go. Rather than simply leave the party, they intentionally "disconnect." They are still technically "in" the party, so the party can't even attempt to find a replacement. Everyone is forced to leave, even if they want to continue.

Actually, this is wrong. After someone has been disconnected for a certain amount of time, I forget how long, it's like 5 or 10 minutes, the game gives the party leader a prompt asking if they want to kick the party member and seek another. Have been kicked by pt lead and been pt lead and kicking more than once due to DC.

[Alyko]

One thing to consider is that any NA joining a JP run will instantly be votekicked. Just another argument against votekick.

[Asael]

Would a vote kick system be convenient for giving those nasty players the boot? Yeah it definitely would. Would a system likes this be abused? Sure to some extent although rare it may be (experiences seem to vary here). But the question for me is, are there other viable alternatives that could be implemented to work around all these issues? Another feature that is less likely to be abused and works under more controlled circumstances.

Rather than a vote kick system try implementing cross server black lists. Once blacklisted and you either finish or leave the instance you will never have to see that player again. Sure you might have to suffer that player's crap for awhile, but again once all is said and done it's over. In this situation such a feature works for the community as a whole. A player who continues to be a schmuck is going to slowly but surely alienate themselves from the community at large, and will eventually find themselves with longer and longer queue times. Secondly, if a particular player has been black listed multiple times with in a given time frame it's a cue for a follow up investigation as to why said player keeps getting blacklisted. I'm sure many have heard this idea concerning RMT shout spam and tells.

The odds of this being abused are few and far in between. You would need hundreds if not thousands of people to screw up such a system. Not to mention the amount of communication and coordination such a group of this size would need in order to pull that off (good luck with that). Even then, if such a thing ever happened by whatever miracle, there are thousands upon thousands of players game wide, and more likely than not the group in question would have only alienated themselves. The odds of abuse are virtually zero. Ultimately, does it stop them? No. But it does prevent YOU from ever having to deal with them again.

Though what else is in our arsenal of weapons to deal with these individuals? Well we have one that already exists. The report system. You can find it under the system menu > support > contact us > player harassment, cheating, bots, etc. Now some may already be saying, "But Asael, that will never work. GMs never address these issues because they're too busy/have better things to do." No, they do. The problem is people seem to apply this logic in the same manner as, "my vote doesn't count." Next thing you know, X person doesn't get elected because they were thousands of votes short for a win due to multiple people using this nonsensical logic. If someone is doing something they shouldn't be doing then stop and take a minute to report it. If multiple reports continuously keep popping up on a particular person it gets noticed. The problem is people grin and bear it then say nothing.

My only issue with this is that I would like an augmentation to the report feature. It should be made to where you can right click on a person (either through the party roster or on the character themselves) and have a report option. This makes it easily accessible for players to utilize. Also this should attach a ticket directly to the player in question, and the ticket stays attached until a reviewing GM can close it. In this way the GM will know the character name, the date and time of the report, the home server the player is from, etc. along with a very brief synopsis of the discrepancy. Will this be reviewed immediately or anytime in the near future? Unlikely. It may take days or even a few weeks, but it will be addressed at some point as it must be viewed by a GM at a moment of their convenience in order for the ticket to be closed. Again, the system must be utilized for it to have an effect. The more tickets that are opened the more likely it will be taken seriously and actually receive attention.

As far as the vote kick system itself is concerned; I have played many games with a VK feature, and in my experience very rarely have I ever seen it being abused. Frankely, it's a lot easier for one single individual to be a schmuck than entire groups (especially if the group is indeed random). As others have pointed out as well there are also countermeasures that can be put in place to help reduce the likelihood of said abuse. To top that off, abuse of a VK system is reportable and bannable. If such a feature is ever implemented I would have to have VK abuse reports take a high priority in order for me to be fully on board with it.

Beyond this, as others and myself have stated, the best answer is always going to be to find a LS/FC that you can group with for these events. With that, all these other things really won't even matter.

[VahnValbosce]

Hey guys I thought of a great solution.

How about we all grow up and stop being mean to eachother...?

That works, right?