Lack of character "skills" customization...?

[foehnweisz]

Awesome post. I am uncertain how much it will affect the design choices, sadly.

But I agree with OP. Players' familiarity with the game aside, what makes my DRG different from other DRGs? Character building/customization always should be part of the RPG experience.

The 30 stat points in an illusion and an uninteresting one at that. The ability to choose skills from different classes sounds great on paper, and works perfectly with one of the game's main selling points - single character all jobs. But in execution, rarely do we get something besides cooldowns or another DoT which really doesn't add much to the gameplay.

Yes I believe gameplay and choice is key at the end of the day. It is how we choose to interact with our characters to play the darn game. I wish to do more bursts, I wish to lean towards dots, I wish to apply more jumps (as a DRG I can't say much for other jobs). Sure it's just an increase in numbers and such, but we are given the chance to choose what we wish to do more of even if it is just to spam the same keys with slightly different rotations.

Adds flavor to individual jobs. And that's thinking small and doable. On a bigger scale... maybe even a fantasy, I'd wish to shoot a fireball once or twice, potent and viable, as a long cd on my DRG. (Or a large builtup heal on a Pally).

[Snat]

The idea is nice but it's definitely not doable, while just being able to unlock some traits with some stats it's quite easy, changing the ground of the game: WEAPON = CLASS it's a big issue, they can't do it easily from a technical point of view.

Don't see why it would be a problem though. Its clear enough they can bring out two types of weapon for each (such as one handed weapons and two handed weapons) and whatever is equipped in your main hand is your class. Whatever is equipped in your right hand simply does the above. Would also think it would be easy to do if you limit it just to jobs as they would just check = main hand & Soul to see what job you are.

It isn't like a miner equipping a hammer changes their class after all (and I am quite sure they could bring out hammers as a weapon in future without it causing a issue - all it is internally is just IDs). Although I suppose if they couldn't do that, they could bring out a second set of weapons (basically it looks the same and does the same as the sub-class but internally the IDs would be different enough for it not to see it as another class).

Although sorry if I mis-understood you half asleep

[Balaur]

This is not character customization, everyone can have it.
Sorry if we are bored to farm the entire time with no real feedback -.-

I don't understand. Do you want to be a special snowflake, to feel like the choices you can make are so varied there can never be another like you? Or do you want your skills to be useful, that if you didn't pick them, you aren't doing optimal work? Right now, the special snowflake value comes across for crafting classes: there are a LOT of cross-classable skills, but not many have the patience to pick 'em up. 'Tis far easier to want to be a special battleflake and not have it and wish for it to be there.

This didn't work for WoW, though. They tried, but they couldn't make enough skills interesting, useful, without them becoming mandatory. So they were mall rolled it, as everyone was picking them anyway there was no choice. But you still have that choice. There is no difference between having the ability to not choose, and being required to choose. You can NOT pick some skills up for your Job, and it will certainly streamline your play. Your versatility may suffer, but there you go. You still have a choice.

You might say this isn an illusionary choice -- and you'd be correct, from a certain point of view. The needs of a group you play with often mandate some choices, and this means extra work. If you're on your own, you don't have this pressure, this need. You just have yourself. And not picking up these skills? That will make you stand out, just as surely as if you were wearing bright pink gear. You'll be just a special snowflake.

I already see players playing my class not using skills we are given for that class. I already see Black Mages not using Swiftcast, or Monks not using Mantra. So you have the options of simply not using the skills you have to further set you apart.

That is choice.

[Fire-Dragon-DoL]

I don't understand. Do you want to be a special snowflake, to feel like the choices you can make are so varied there can never be another like you? Or do you want your skills to be useful, that if you didn't pick them, you aren't doing optimal work? Right now, the special snowflake value comes across for crafting classes: there are a LOT of cross-classable skills, but not many have the patience to pick 'em up. 'Tis far easier to want to be a special battleflake and not have it and wish for it to be there.

This didn't work for WoW, though. They tried, but they couldn't make enough skills interesting, useful, without them becoming mandatory. So they were mall rolled it, as everyone was picking them anyway there was no choice. But you still have that choice. There is no difference between having the ability to not choose, and being required to choose. You can NOT pick some skills up for your Job, and it will certainly streamline your play. Your versatility may suffer, but there you go. You still have a choice.

You might say this isn an illusionary choice -- and you'd be correct, from a certain point of view. The needs of a group you play with often mandate some choices, and this means extra work. If you're on your own, you don't have this pressure, this need. You just have yourself. And not picking up these skills? That will make you stand out, just as surely as if you were wearing bright pink gear. You'll be just a special snowflake.

I already see players playing my class not using skills we are given for that class. I already see Black Mages not using Swiftcast, or Monks not using Mantra. So you have the options of simply not using the skills you have to further set you apart.

That is choice.

A choice is when you do one thing and doing it implies you CAN'T do the other (or you can do with a lot of hard work, like respeccing).

You are basically telling me that my choice is NOT play my character with all my skills I have (and can't be removed!).

That's like saying, play Devil May Cry without autoattack, yea you can do it but it's meaningless because actually you are choosing a different playstyle, not a different specialization for your character, indeed you can actually use the autoattack.

I don't need to be a special snowflake, I'm ok with being similar to other guys, however I'm not ok being identical to ALL other summoners.

I'm on an RPG and I expect a good variety on my character even between same class.

Actually my choice is this:
ARCHER:
- Cooldown increase damage
- Cooldown reduce thread
THM:
- Swiftcast
- Surecast
- Thunder

This is what they thought as the system that should actually make every player different.
Please now, count the slots available (5) and the skills (5) this is the difference available to us.
Not to mention the fact that only ONE skill has short cooldown, the others are just long cooldown skills

[Daragust]

Actually my choice is this:
ARCHER:
- Cooldown increase damage
- Cooldown reduce thread
THM:
- Swiftcast
- Surecast
- Thunder

Eh, you forgot you can choose to raise your dex and accuracy via archer as well. You do have the choice to not be like everyone else. But you won't use that, because it doesn't make sense.

[Fire-Dragon-DoL]

Eh, you forgot you can choose to raise your dex and accuracy via archer as well. You do have the choice to not be like everyone else. But you won't use that, because it doesn't make sense.

A choice is when you would like to take both things but you can have only one.
There isn't a single reason you would like to have dex on arcanist because you can't attack in melee.

If this is not enough for you, I'm sure you understand the logic and are just trolling, so I'll simply ignore those posts.

[AjoraOak]

Did the people that say, "your job is your customization" drop by this thread yet? Because zzzzzzzzzz...

[BubblyBoar]

If you want to be technical, there ARE specs in the game. They are just designed to not look like it. ACN can "spec" to be a healer or continue being DPS by choosing SCH or SMN. But instead of a tree with choices, the game is designed to have it spelled out more clearly and have them defined in roles. It's techincally exactly what you want, and in the future only classes will have "specs" for them aside from the one they have now.

You don't have to like it, but that's just how it is. That's how the game is designed. And honestly, it's not much different, just given a clear label.

For example, let's say in some other MMO, your knight can spec as a tank, the normal tree, but with certain skills and gear, he can forgo his tankiness for straight up DPS. That's what you want as customization. But everyone that decides to make a Tank Knight will have the same gear and builds, as it fits that "spec" better. And everyone that goes DPS will have the same skills and gear, because it fits the DPS spec better. So what FFXIV did, instead of leavign that ambigous, made them into CLEARLY defined jobs. They each have different skills and gear, but come from the same class.

It's actually exactly the same, except your spec is given a clear name.

[Welsper59]

A choice is when you would like to take both things but you can have only one.
There isn't a single reason you would like to have dex on arcanist because you can't attack in melee.

If this is not enough for you, I'm sure you understand the logic and are just trolling, so I'll simply ignore those posts.

Choices are not exclusive to good things. What would you call a situation of "choosing" someone dying or someone living? And to be clear, anyone can attack in melee. Heck, even DoL and DoH can attack in melee, they just don't have abilities for it... but they can still auto-attack. You seem to be too selective in your own understanding of word choice.

In regards to the first post though, this is an established franchise. You're going to be limited, unlike fresh titles/series of MMORPG. There's nothing disappointing about it. It'd be the same as classes in WoW being able to do such things. Why would a Paladin be able to utilize abilities that a Death Knight has? That sort of thing. The core of the class/job must keep itself established.

Besides, if there's a need to get more into the gameplay side, I (as well as many others) would never trust the general player base with total freedom. You would have to be the most ignorant (aka naive) person to ever work in the gaming industry. Your peers are among the most clueless of gamers imaginable, and mixed into that are the groups whose sole purpose in life is to mess with other people.

[JamesX]

Isn't this the same as saying 2 artist with the same brush and same palette will perform the same?

The difference is how you use the tools. You don't have to have different skills/equipment to be differentiated.