Stats are more broken than we thought

[darkstarpoet1]

I never once said that it was worth the gil. I never once said that SE has done a good job with the optimization of stats and gear. The only thing I put my foot down on was the fact there there was a difference between option A and option B. For a min/max player, regardless of how broken the system is, 10pt damage increase is better than nothing at all. Also who buys Silver Arrows anyways? The mats take like an hour to farm and you come out with enough stacks to last a month..

@ Aramil - I will test that in the next batch.

on the gil difference i wasn't arguing with your results i was talking about the damage for the money issue. i'm just wondering if for the money if it would be a smarter idea to use say a higher bow and warped arrows or even a lower bow with warped for farming as opposed to high level gear for nm's and other high level mobs.

just because alot of archers make their own arrows my retainers show that a ton of people are still buying their arrows. that has been my biggest money maker in bazaars for months now. i was more wondering if they would be smarter buying the warped from the npc if they buy them for leves/farming and only use the high level stuff on the tougher mobs. on a mob that's tougher even a minor damage increase could be the difference between life and death.

[Joe_Cool]

I've noticed a pretty big difference in acc in using better bows/arrows.

[Joe_Cool]

I was just doing Ureus with my LS and for fun I decided to use a weathered shortbow and warped arrows over my crab bow + silver arrows. The result? I did the exact same damage to him with autoattack and weapon skills, and had the EXACT same accuracy. That is completely insane, weatered shortbow has 32 attack and 96 accuracy, while a crab bow has 127 attack and 165 accuracy.

Stats are doing pretty much NOTHING in this game! How is it that bad? I thought it was bad, but I didn't know it was this bad! X_X

Food also does nothing, I eat a meat miqabob and my damage stays the exact same.

Sounds like what a person who doesnt want to spend much gil on arrows would say

[Elexia]

Sounds like what a person who doesnt want to spend much gil on arrows would say

Not really. Arrow upgrades literally aren't going to increase your performance so much it's worthwhile to progress past wrapped arrows. It's like how in other MMOs where people will do everything to push the sale of their overpriced junk

[viion]

This is mine so far, I'm getting tired so I think I'll leave it for now, cuse as far as im concerned there is an "attempt" that stats do something but like Yoshi said its so complex and messed up it doesnt feel like a big change. And its getting scrapped anyway so who will care about this stuff soon!

I'm Rank 32 - I didnt change my stats or gear or use any skills only Light Shot and Cure to keep myself alive
10 Mobs per Bow. - Mob: 30-34 Squirrels in Muntuy.
Rk 1 - Weathered - 20687 - 2% Durability Decrease
Rk 34 - Cavalry - 22113 - 5% Durability Decrease
Rk 47 - Crab Bow - 23458 - 7% Durability Decrease

Damage Average
- Weathered, about 170-200 a hit
- Cavalry, about 200-250 a hit
- Crab Bow, About 200-250 a hit (maybe due to not optimal?)


Random - Algoat Bill rank 34 - Tested on CrabBow
Rk 3 - Bronze Arrows did 160-170 a hit
Rk 42 - Blue Coral Arrow did 120-130 a hit
Was surprised by this, could be because I'm not optimal but the damage LOWERED :O unlike the optimal/unoptimal bows which increased. I figured, Maybe due to over levelled bow? Switched to Weathered to receive worse results (Same mob lv and Algoat again)
Rk 3 - Bronze Arrows did 120-130
Rk 42 - Blue Coral Arrow did 80-90

Misc
- Weakened makes no difference on damage dealt or taken. Think this might have been known tho haha

[BlakLanner]

I see a lot of auto-attack damage testing, but not much with your special attacks. I did some impromptu testing on my pugilist (rank 26) against some goats 3 ranks above me. While I could not get my auto-attack damage to change much, if at all (always 50 +/- 2), my counter attacks (Jarring, Haymaker) showed significant differences between weapons.

I used the starter hora, the rank 26 +1 hora, and a pair of disabling baghnaks that I picked up just in case this was really accurate (the procs would be useful). What I noticed after killing 3 goats with each weapon was that the rank-appropriate weapon did about 15% more damage than the high-ranked weapon did (my attack dropped 14 points with the higher-level weapon) and about 25% more than the starter weapon.

I realize that this isn't the most in depth testing, but it makes me wonder if we simply max out/floor the calculations on our basic attacks very easily and only start to really see changes on our specials.

[Physic]

This is mine so far, I'm getting tired so I think I'll leave it for now, cuse as far as im concerned there is an "attempt" that stats do something but like Yoshi said its so complex and messed up it doesnt feel like a big change. And its getting scrapped anyway so who will care about this stuff soon!

I'm Rank 32 - I didnt change my stats or gear or use any skills only Light Shot and Cure to keep myself alive
10 Mobs per Bow. - Mob: 30-34 Squirrels in Muntuy.
Rk 1 - Weathered - 20687 - 2% Durability Decrease
Rk 34 - Cavalry - 22113 - 5% Durability Decrease
Rk 47 - Crab Bow - 23458 - 7% Durability Decrease

Damage Average
- Weathered, about 170-200 a hit
- Cavalry, about 200-250 a hit
- Crab Bow, About 200-250 a hit (maybe due to not optimal?)


Random - Algoat Bill rank 34 - Tested on CrabBow
Rk 3 - Bronze Arrows did 160-170 a hit
Rk 42 - Blue Coral Arrow did 120-130 a hit
Was surprised by this, could be because I'm not optimal but the damage LOWERED :O unlike the optimal/unoptimal bows which increased. I figured, Maybe due to over levelled bow? Switched to Weathered to receive worse results (Same mob lv and Algoat again)
Rk 3 - Bronze Arrows did 120-130
Rk 42 - Blue Coral Arrow did 80-90

Misc
- Weakened makes no difference on damage dealt or taken. Think this might have been known tho haha

Not surprising, since using gear higher than your level is generally worse than using something at your level. you can even see that its not giving teh right stats in the stat screen, and decide which is actually more effective when used.

Non optimal is fail, we have known that for some time, though usually if your close, its not so bad.

but even from your data, the bow is substantially more effective damage, and versus an actual high defense mob, i bet the damage would be even more noticeable.

now why did the level 22 mob show no results? probably because your base attack is completely effective.
As far as brew, this is apparently from research some new buff item which buffs all your stats, most notably, your actual stats, which are directly used in weaponskill calculations.

heres what ffxiah says


* HP +999 (not confirmed)
* MP +999 (not confirmed)
* Store TP +999 (not confirmed)
* Strength +999
* Dexterity +999
* Agility +999
* Vitality +999
* Intelligence +999
* Mind +999
* Charisma +999
* HP recovered while healing +999 (not confirmed)
* MP recovered while healing +999 (not confirmed)
* Attack +999
* Accuracy +999
* Defense +999
* Evasion +999
* Regen +300/tic
* Refresh +300/tic


the noticeable thing there is teh boost to your strength, which increases your max/minimum damage, and attack determines how much the defense effects your max/minimum damage. Also weapon skills have their own modifiers based more directly on your Stats then your attck, this has been known for some time.

Basically my educated guess says that the reason you arent seeing much difference in attack on some monsters is because you have already overcome thier defense, and since the effect of str is capped in this game (from what people say) you have no way to increase your damage beyond a certain point.

[Joe_Cool]

Not really. Arrow upgrades literally aren't going to increase your performance so much it's worthwhile to progress past wrapped arrows. It's like how in other MMOs where people will do everything to push the sale of their overpriced junk

As a 50 ARC I can tell a difference in acc and dmg from the arrows being used. But the dmg part comes from the ws's and such and not really the regular attacks

[Physic]

As a 50 ARC I can tell a difference in acc and dmg from the arrows being used. But the dmg part comes from the ws's and such and not really the regular attacks

I was wondering about this is as well, since skills that supposedly enhance attack have a very noticeable effect on weaponskills, i wonder if in this game, unlike FFXI, there isnt an extra modifier on weapon skills for your attack, that doesnt go with defense.

Its also possible that there is a cap on the effect of attack on regular attacks but not on WS.
another possibility is that even though the skills say they boost attack, they really just boost your damage. remains to be seen for me.

[Xatsh]

I am questioning if we are just missing one part of the stats. In XI Str did next to nothing without the Attack to back it up, which was limited by the weapons base attack.

Sort of the str gave the dmg a maximum, the weapon gave it a ceiling, and the attack was how much dmg we actually deal.

Right now almost no one uses food and very little armor has attack on it so I question if it could just be we are missing a whole part of the equation.

The change from level 1 weapon to endgame weapon was about 50dmg on the screen. Which is an increase of 20% dmg these attacks where all without attack buffs.

What I want to see is does the weapon make a difference if you use food (attack+ food) and Attack buffs. Compared to level 1 weapons.

My archer is only 36 but I was messing around with 2 bow tonight and the dmg difference was about 20 a shot on non-leve mobs we where parting on. Dmg with ferocity II + multishot went up by about 20 a shot same level I just updated my bow from the day before averaging 290-300 a arrow from 270-290 the day before.

I have a feeling on those NMS their Def is so much higher then our attack we are almost at the bottom of the dmg curve on them.