Suggestion: More dynamic gameplay for healing

[darkstarpoet1]

Thank you but the mages in this game are way more exciting and interesting to me than any of the melee. And you must have had bad experiences with poor mages to think we have unlimited mp.

IF you are a mage that doesn't even get close to being out of mp during an NM fight there are 1 of 2 kinds of mage you probably are:

1) A poor mage that only heals and then puts away their weapon, and essentially is not being as big of an asset to your party as you should be.

or

2) You are a wise mage that is efficient in battle and knows how to manage your mp with: Spiritbind, Tranquality, Exaltation, or Siphon MP in addition to monitoring your spells and rationing it appropriately.

Just because YOU do not care for the mage classes in this game, doesn't mean that what you're talking about are actual problems with the system. It's problems with the players.

In a fight I can not just be 'mindlessly' doing anything otherwise I am letting down my team. I have to time doing debuffs or spells to make sure it coincides with the hp loss of my party members. Also, I have to really manage my mp consumption unless I'm in a battle like Dodore. (Which, btw, I find Dodore EXTREMELY fun because I am nonstop spells, healing, debuffs, buffs and I never have to worry about my mp until nearing the end of the battle. I feel like a greater asset in that fight because it actually is a fight where no mage should run out of mp.)

Putting away your weapon in battle as a mage is the sign of a bad mage! Learn to ration your mp correctly because that is part of being a mage. As for you, Shiyo, you're disappointing to other 'real' mages that know what they're doing. We have to be an extremely flexible and alert class to take care of things correctly in a fight. The way you must play your mage MUST be really dull and boring. Another example of people making their own game terrible because they don't realize the potential of the role they could be playing.

completely agree. once they get higher levels in any class they will learn there is more to any class besides what they think at r30. every class gets better at higher ranks. mage actually has more to do in a battle than a battle class does. well let me say if they are doing their job properly there is more to do. the game can only give you the tools to make itself enjoyable, but if you refuse to use the tools then they are worthless.

[DeadRiser]

completely agree. once they get higher levels in any class they will learn there is more to any class besides what they think at r30. every class gets better at higher ranks. mage actually has more to do in a battle than a battle class does. well let me say if they are doing their job properly there is more to do. the game can only give you the tools to make itself enjoyable, but if you refuse to use the tools then they are worthless.

Like anyone can tell you, you should be able to witness a class individualism at any rank. If you haven't noticed, there are no jobs in this game. You do what you wanna do in the game, that's why they are talking about bringing classis name or titles back, because it isn't set in stone what someone should be doing.

[darkstarpoet1]

Like anyone can tell you, you should be able to witness a class individualism at any rank. If you haven't noticed, there are no jobs in this game. You do what you wanna do in the game, that's why they are talking about bringing classis name or titles back, because it isn't set in stone what someone should be doing.

just because some people aren't intelligent enough to get that you need certain roles filled in each party and 3-4 people can fill that role does not make it a bad thing. it just makes it easier to get a group together and have the roles filled.

[Eldaena]

completely agree. once they get higher levels in any class they will learn there is more to any class besides what they think at r30. every class gets better at higher ranks. mage actually has more to do in a battle than a battle class does. well let me say if they are doing their job properly there is more to do. the game can only give you the tools to make itself enjoyable, but if you refuse to use the tools then they are worthless.

Right, only players have the capability of making abilities worthless to themselves. It's there for them to use and be inventive for the best playstyle there is for them. But to me it sounds like these two go into battle as a mage, cure and do an attack and that's all. That's not because of the mage classes being bad. It's because the leve mobs are extremely easy and cranking up the star rating doesn't net you anything, but more work. It's part of the reason I think they should make the sp system work such as : The harder the mob is the more sp you can gain from it. It shouldn't matter if it's not in your 'range' in rank. If you fought it and beat it, the sp shouldn't be less than a mob that would be in your rank range. They probably have it like that now because they don't want people power leveling each other, but that still happens anyway....so I don't think it's a valid argument anymore.

[Shiyo]

completely agree. once they get higher levels in any class they will learn there is more to any class besides what they think at r30. every class gets better at higher ranks. mage actually has more to do in a battle than a battle class does. well let me say if they are doing their job properly there is more to do. the game can only give you the tools to make itself enjoyable, but if you refuse to use the tools then they are worthless.

Just because they have more to do doesn't make them hard, complex, or fun. A roach tastes better than a spider, is that a huge improvement? No, it's not. Both DOW and DOM are boring and easy to play, but mages are a complete joke compared to any real mage in previous video games or MMOs.

In FF11 I played SCH and RDM as my mages, I didn't play the other mages past subjob levels, I love hybrids and don't like specialized roles, but I understand they need to exist for a MMO to work. THM and conj also completely fail in every way imaginable at being a hybrid mage of any kind.

[darkstarpoet1]

Just because they have more to do doesn't make them hard, complex, or fun. A roach tastes better than a spider, is that a huge improvement? No, it's not. Both DOW and DOM are boring and easy to play, but mages are a complete joke compared to any real mage in previous video games or MMOs.

In FF11 I played SCH and RDM as my mages, I didn't play the other mages past subjob levels, I love hybrids and don't like specialized roles, but I understand they need to exist for a MMO to work. THM and conj also completely fail in every way imaginable at being a hybrid mage of any kind.

but on the other side isn't this game in general a joke compared to other mmo's at present? if you fight harder mobs where you would have a reason to have a dedicated healer you go up to mobs that one shot you. there is no grey area where you have tough challenging fights. you either run up to mobs and run over them or run up to mobs and they own your party. that was my whole point as to why mages have to do other things besides just sitting and casting a heal every now and then.

[Daedae]

Apparently i failed to get my point across. The 'mage' classes in this game thus far, are not difficult, they are boring. My point was to offer some tips to make the healing portion of the game, more dynamic and interactive, like tanking and damaging have. I find this jack-of-all-trades on every job very silly, and what I am asking for are more direct class roles, and more faucets to these roles. Going 85 or whatever into each stat allocation may work for your frankenstein play-style, but its that type of homogenizing I dislike in this game. In short, a larger arsenal of spells for healing and survivability that would require more of a challenge than 'Oh no, A got hit by Buffaro, *Cure III* ok he's good for 20 seconds, while I stand here and try aimlessly to get poison to stick, only to have it overidden by a more damage oriented caster.'

I didn't even play XI, but I know how detailed the class system was, and how the jobs were tailored to individual wants and a number of roles. If you wanted to debuff, claim, and assist, play a BRD, if you want to be able to evade tank, deal damage, play a NIN, if you want to be a jack-of-all-trades, play a RDM. Those roles are so patchwork and muddled in this game, that my desire to heal and assist doesn't exist. Tank's have to make sure their defense abilities are up, and manage their timers, they have to be alert and taunt when they need, they have to pay attention to when to run and when to brace for damage. DD's have to make sure they input the correct actions into a BR, they have to manage TP so that they can do maximum damage for the next round, they have to watch their placement, their hate, they have an incredible arsenal of attacks they can mix and match from, and if you want to heal....You can cast cure every so often, and then pretend you are a DD. Healing has been nearly snuffed out in this game as a role specific thing, and obviously you can see from the latest trend of FF games how job emphasis has been diminished and how fusing all the jobs in now the norm. I'm just hoping with the new job changes and traditional jobs returning(fingers crossed) that some of my issues are addressed, and please can we cease with the name-calling and bitter retorts? We're all hoping this will be a masterpiece one day, and it will only get there if SE takes in considerations both ends of the spectrum, and comes to a balanced solution.

[Eldaena]

Apparently i failed to get my point across. The 'mage' classes in this game thus far, are not difficult, they are boring. My point was to offer some tips to make the healing portion of the game, more dynamic and interactive, like tanking and damaging have. I find this jack-of-all-trades on every job very silly, and what I am asking for are more direct class roles, and more faucets to these roles. Going 85 or whatever into each stat allocation may work for your frankenstein play-style, but its that type of homogenizing I dislike in this game. In short, a larger arsenal of spells for healing and survivability that would require more of a challenge than 'Oh no, A got hit by Buffaro, *Cure III* ok he's good for 20 seconds, while I stand here and try aimlessly to get poison to stick, only to have it overidden by a more damage oriented caster.'

I didn't even play XI, but I know how detailed the class system was, and how the jobs were tailored to individual wants and a number of roles. If you wanted to debuff, claim, and assist, play a BRD, if you want to be able to evade tank, deal damage, play a NIN, if you want to be a jack-of-all-trades, play a RDM. Those roles are so patchwork and muddled in this game, that my desire to heal and assist doesn't exist. Tank's have to make sure their defense abilities are up, and manage their timers, they have to be alert and taunt when they need, they have to pay attention to when to run and when to brace for damage. DD's have to make sure they input the correct actions into a BR, they have to manage TP so that they can do maximum damage for the next round, they have to watch their placement, their hate, they have an incredible arsenal of attacks they can mix and match from, and if you want to heal....You can cast cure every so often, and then pretend you are a DD. Healing has been nearly snuffed out in this game as a role specific thing, and obviously you can see from the latest trend of FF games how job emphasis has been diminished and how fusing all the jobs in now the norm. I'm just hoping with the new job changes and traditional jobs returning(fingers crossed) that some of my issues are addressed, and please can we cease with the name-calling and bitter retorts? We're all hoping this will be a masterpiece one day, and it will only get there if SE takes in considerations both ends of the spectrum, and comes to a balanced solution.

Personally, I enjoy the fact that we get to determine our own roles in this game and not tunneled into a preset role. I'm sorry that you need SE to hold your hand and tell you how to play your role in this game, but right now it's just not that way. Hopefully, SE will come up with more classes and abilities that offer more support to roles that are not adequate at this time (such as healing only or nuking only mages), but at current you are a better asset to your team by taking on all the the things you can do as a mage that you find work best for your playstyle. Again, hopefully the armory system will eventually allow you to specialize more in the healing you so desperately want to do, and allow it to be more dynamic, but right now it's just not. (Not that I could say that strictly healing or nuking could be considered "dynamic" by any means anyway, lol.) Best wait it out and see what the new job system is going to bring for you. In the meantime if you don't enjoy being inventive, observant, and an asset to your team, then by all means take a break. =)

[DeadRiser]

Personally, I enjoy the fact that we get to determine our own roles in this game and not tunneled into a preset role. I'm sorry that you need SE to hold your hand and tell you how to play your role in this game, but right now it's just not that way. Hopefully, SE will come up with more classes and abilities that offer more support to roles that are not adequate at this time (such as healing only or nuking only mages), but at current you are a better asset to your team by taking on all the the things you can do as a mage that you find work best for your playstyle. Again, hopefully the armory system will eventually allow you to specialize more in the healing you so desperately want to do, and allow it to be more dynamic, but right now it's just not. Best wait it out and see what the new job system is going to bring for you. In the meantime if you don't enjoy being inventive, observant, and an asset to your team, then by all means take a break. =)

It's not about holding our hands... Look at all the other successful MMO's that have preset classes... they sure are working towards their benefits unlike the red-mages everyone is now in this game.

Being inventive- yes we can all use spiritbind and bind but doesn't really bring anything to the table with how useless they are

Being observant- isn't that what healing and mp management is all about.... Some might like to watch others health than always attacking

Being and asset to your team- healing and buffing is being an asset...