Sorry SE, but endgame won't work if you don't fix something.

[TheRac25]

server polls your data every 0.3s

just a technicality but its the client sending pos update to the server not the server asking for one, you have the right thinking otherwise
this is sort of the same "mechanic", if you can call it that, in xi that allowed your utesemi casts to not be interupted after about 80-90%
xi server code says hello

[Sunarie]

Well, people read a fix as 'nerf to content', and to be fair, if lag was magically gone tomorrow, Titan is going to be pretty darn trivial since the lag is the only thing that made him hard. But you shouldn't have difficulty based around flaws in design. I remember there was an encounter in EQ1 where half of your raid would reliably get disconnected halfway due to a bug. That bug was eventually fixed and then the guys who beat the encounter in the bugged state complain about how content is nerfed for the whiners. It's pretty much the same thing here, people arguing difficulty as the result of broken mechanism should somehow stay in as a badge of honor.

Right, and I can understand what they mean to some extent. It does make the fight easier if you suddenly have some wiggle room for hesitation, or don't have to memorize boss mechanics.... assuming you can get that far. The problem really comes in when people have mid-to-high latency on top of the .3 second positional update delay. Where other games are playable, in this one you literally can't dodge anything. By the time you see the cast and move, the cast has already gone off according to the server, and you were standing in it, regardless of what your screen says.

To me, that isn't skill at all. Same with the EQ example you gave. That's being lucky that you're not being hit with the disconnects or lag issues that others are, which has nothing to do with skill. I understand there are some people that always have the "I'm better than anyone attitude" and have to pull the "I did it before it was nerfed/fixed" card in any game. The thing that gets me here, is, as I've noted before, I believe this issue is the only one I've seen with true potential to kill the game in the long run if unfixed.

[Velo_Vandore]

But aren't people posting videos where they are out of the AOE zone for much more than 0.3 seconds? I don't think it's the only problem, otherwise every player would be affected to the same extent, which (despite what many want to believe) is not the case.

Also, if adding time to the cast bar to account for lag is the only available solution, I would say please don't bother. Players that are not experiencing issue will then have even more time to dodge AOEs. Imagine how unfair that will be in PVP.

[Amiantos]

But aren't people posting videos where they are out of the AOE zone for much more than 0.3 seconds? I don't think it's the only problem, otherwise every player would be affected to the same extent, which (despite what many want to believe) is not the case.

It's a mix of the .3 delay and as much as they don't want to admit their internet. I feel EU and AU players are the worst off because of this. The "EU" datacenter is in canada, and there's no real oceanic server for AU and the other countries that would encompass an oceanic server. I'm in the military playing from Japan using a mobile internet device that averages from 240-290 but can be a bit worse time to time. So I can notice the delay on quite a few things. On Tuesday I plan on going to Tonberry with an AU friend as we tried a more populated US server in hopes of being able to do more stuff during our time but that didn't work. Not to mention the sub 100 delay from pinging the JP datacenter for us is another bonus. I feel this is something that does need to be addressed as it is an issue for many and most other MMO's use a .05 or a .1 poll rate.

[Dhex]

I just sat through and did about 12 hours worth of Titan as a tank; tried DF/FC/Shouts. Not a single win. Several close; 3-8% but HP bar rubber-banding was pretty common; frequently people wiped to WoL . Landslide is interesting. Watching people fly off when they were just on the opposite side from the side they are now flying off certainly affirms there is something either not structured properly with either the way the server records position or with the priority and execution/calculation of skills.


ISP Verizon FiOs 60/30Mbps

Nvidia GTX660ti
Intel i7-3770k @3.4~ Ghz
16GB (Corsair) RAM
Corsair SSD (200GB)

Being a tank in this fight is utterly depressing.

[Namko]

Getting sent in the wrong direction by Landslide is because they were in the red zone when cast bar completed and moved after. We know animation and cast bar is not in sync.

There is something wrong for some people. But also, some fail can be accredited to players not watching the cast bar properly.

Couple more vids for the guy with bad eyesight:

http://youtu.be/NwIX7TgiKq8
http://youtu.be/mCPszbk8ve0

If you still think my lag is as bad as everyone else then I don't know what to say.

About WotL, the ability is a 1.7 second cast, to travel from the centre to the safe zone takes no more than .7 secs. You should be able to react in under 300ms. Is your lag worse than 400-700ms?

It's not broken for some people. You might help by posting videos of you NOT being able to avoid WotL along with your specs/internet etc. Then SE may be able to reproduce the error.

Yes, I have been in coil with that fire move thing and also able to avoid it.

Edit - Oh and why does pingzapper fix it for some people?

[Bixby]

Slightly evil thoughts here.

I wonder, since pos hacks exist, if it would be possible for some clever programmer to develop a 3rd-party hack that would just read your current location according to the client and force it along to the server more often. Say, 25-100 ms instead of 300 (only when position values are actually changing; it'd be stupid to ramp it that high when you're standing still).

I'm sure if that were possible, it would be very problematic if it became popular (the increase in incoming traffic would likely not be good for their servers). But if it helped alleviate the issue, it would also be pretty clear evidence that 300 ms is far too long a wait.

[Goreth]

Slightly evil thoughts here.

I wonder, since pos hacks exist, if it would be possible for some clever programmer to develop a 3rd-party hack that would just read your current location according to the client and force it along to the server more often. Say, 25-100 ms instead of 300 (only when position values are actually changing; it'd be stupid to ramp it that high when you're standing still).

I'm sure if that were possible, it would be very problematic if it became popular (the increase in incoming traffic would likely not be good for their servers). But if it helped alleviate the issue, it would also be pretty clear evidence that 300 ms is far too long a wait.

Since the problem seems to be server side, the "hack" would have to involve writing proper netcode and somehow forcing SE to implement it.

[Amberion]

Edit - Oh and why does pingzapper fix it for some people?

It does not "fix" it, it just lower the ping or fix bad routing. It just makes it isn't as noticeable, but the problem is still there. You should not have to use a proxy service to be able to play a game.

And as you said, it only helps some people, no all. Helps me a lot during prime time, since routing from my ISP to the servers suffers major packet losses and lag.

[Altena]

http://youtu.be/NwIX7TgiKq8
http://youtu.be/mCPszbk8ve0

If you still think my lag is as bad as everyone else then I don't know what to say.

About WotL, the ability is a 1.7 second cast, to travel from the centre to the safe zone takes no more than .7 secs. You should be able to react in under 300ms. Is your lag worse than 400-700ms?

Those videos are probably the first & only videos I have seen that display what everyone should be seeing. Unfortunately, as you can see in this thread - that is not the case. Pretty amazed that you actually seem to have great response time to be honest.

Without Pingzapper my connection to SE servers is 340ms. With Pingzapper it is around 250. (Cannot confirm as the way the proxy works, does not have a solid way to check).

I also live on the other side of the world. I expect 250ms and would be fairly fine if that was the only issue personally.

As mentioned in previous posts, at about 250ms, I am able to cast & land Esuna while running continuously (not stopping), provided I use PoM. This reduces the Esuna cast time down to about 750ms.

I can live with latency that is simply due to my geographical location - because I have had to deal with that in practically every online game I have played. However what I can not fathom is latency that is pre-built into the game.

I will also point out that a friend that is literally on the other side of the world to me (UK) is able to do the exact same thing as me - Esuna lands with the message saying it has no effect (meaning it did not interrupt).

If you don't mind revealing this information - where are you located? Or at a minimum, what is your avg ping?

I think the real issue here will be when PvP comes. There will evidently be people with a clear advantage over others, despite this game officially being supported all over the world.

If out of curiosity you wish to know my internet service & PC specs:

ISP: 90Mbps downstream / 2.5Mbps upstream

CPU: Intel i7 3770k @4.6ghz
GPU: GF GTX680 2GB
RAM: 16GB
Installed on an SSD

It's not specifically my internet service (aside from my geo location).
If I were to not use my proxy, I would evidently be getting bad routing, and while a proxy improves this slightly - it does not solve the issue entirely.
It evidently isn't my PC.
It isn't simply my human reaction time.
Finally - I believe you are actually in the minority here. Most people that I speak to, including those in my FC, friends from other FC's and shout or DF groups there are always a very very large portion that are having these issues.