Controller based gameplay, a suggestion

[Steeled]

Controllers don't have a lot of real estate. 16 buttons doesn't last long, and that's with stacking things inside macros, like having circle of scorn macro'd to flash, something I'm not really comfortable with. I haven't even leveled Marauder yet, doing that next, and I can't imagine where I'm supposed to fit in Marauder abilities.

My paladin just earned stoneskin and am scratching my head for what to remove to put it on my bars.

Speaking for xbox controllers here, but I'd assume that since PS3 controllers aren't so different.

Can L1 and R1 (the bumpers) behave like R1 and R2 (the triggers) and allow to press them in conjunction with another key?

Currently, the layout looks like this

  L2      L2          R2      R2
L2  L2  L2  L2      R2  R2  R2  R2
  L2      L2          R2      R2

Perhaps it could look like this

  L1      L1                                        R1      R1
L1  L1  L1  L1                                    R1  R1  R1  R1
  L1      L1      L2      L2        R2      R2      R1      R1
                L2  L2  L2  L2    R2  R2  R2  R2
                  L2      L2        R2      R2

Or, for something less cluttered, have it when the user presses right bumper, it changes the display to

  L1      L1          R2      R2
L1  L1  L1  L1      R2  R2  R2  R2
  L1      L1          R2      R2

Releasing the bumper, or selecting an action, would put it back to the default trigger view.

The game has just launched and controller-based play already threatens to be inferior to keyboard play, purely for the available combinations. More abilities will probably be coming in the future.

I do realize that on the xbox controller, and probably the ps3, L1 is autorun, but autorun can be an action bound to something nice like L1+Y (or triangle for ps3).

I also realize that pressing R1 opens an alternative set of bars but I feel like that interface is clunky. 0.2 seconds makes all the difference sometimes, as we all know, since 0.3 makes the difference in whether or not the server thinks you're out of red spots.

[Demlix]

If you're using an Xbox controller, I'm guessing you're on PC... so the easiest solution I can think of is use a keyboard.

[Mazi]

(I ran out of post for today so imma just edit this haha)

R1 to switch bars is your best friend, learn to master it and you can do stuff SO FAST.

One of the things that SE promoted with this game was that controller play would work well. They made a big deal about how they'd really thought upon a solution for the limited real estate. Crossbars work well, but there needs to be more. 16 is simply not enough.

Their "system" can't be faltering 2 weeks in, they need to design a solution.

Alternatively, they could implement a third crossbar that's invoked by holding both triggers at the same time. Either would be better.

it is literally one button to switch to your next 16 skills, the system is in place and it works great you just have to actually use it.

I also realize that pressing R1 opens an alternative set of bars but I feel like that interface is clunky. 0.2 seconds makes all the difference sometimes, as we all know, since 0.3 makes the difference in whether or not the server thinks you're out of red spots.[/B]

Saying .3 seconds to move out of something is completely off topic since while we are pressing our bumpers we never let go of our thumbsticks which is the movement aspect, controllers actually are much better for moving around and argueably give us more time to mess with our skills since we can get to where we need to quicker.

That's not what I meant. The 0.2 seconds to press the bumper and then press the key combination is what I meant.

Again, it feels weird at first but once you get used to it you can do stuff that fast, this is a completely foreign layout so it feels clunky to begin but after playing a bit it feels completely natural and I can bust out any move I want almost instantly.

At least give us a way to tone down all the options. One alternate bar is preferable for me. Sorry, but we all have pressed a button combo too fast and ended up completely in the wrong macro set (or at least I have^^) and I dislike the idea. I prefer as much to be readily available as possible.

I feel ya, I've definitely almost used Return in the middle of a fight or forgot I was on my Chocobo/Minion bar when trying to fight something xP

[Steeled]

One of the things that SE promoted with this game was that controller play would work well. They made a big deal about how they'd really thought upon a solution for the limited real estate. Crossbars work well, but there needs to be more. 16 is simply not enough.

Their "system" can't be faltering 2 weeks in, they need to design a solution.

Alternatively, they could implement a third crossbar that's invoked by holding both triggers at the same time. Either would be better.

[Steeled]

R1 to switch bars is your best friend, learn to master it and you can do stuff SO FAST.

I mentioned in my OP that I knew about this, but I'd still prefer something better. I like having things available in a single combination because the .2 seconds can make all the difference, and quite often does.

[ruinedmirage]

By holding down R1, you can bring up any of 8 layouts (even empty ones) by pressing a corresponding direction or face button. As a CNJ, I have my heals and items on one layout, attacks and crossclass skills on another, class switching spread over two layouts, and stuff like mounting, teleport, and random stuff on another. I still have a few layouts that are completely empty still, too.

It seems clunky at first, I'll agree. But after you stop pressing R1 constantly to cycle through them, accidentally skipping the right layout and cycling through them all again .......... and just remember R1 + (relevant button) = specific 16-slot layout, you have essentially 128 hotbar slots accessible within two button presses on a gamepad. It just takes some micromanagement and practice using it effectively.

[Steeled]

It seems clunky at first, I'll agree. But after you stop pressing R1 constantly to cycle through them, accidentally skipping the right layout and cycling through them all again .......... and just remember R1 + (relevant button) = specific 16-slot layout, you have essentially 128 hotbar slots accessible within two button presses on a gamepad. It just takes some micromanagement and practice using it effectively.

Why must we settle for a clunky interface when they could easily give us something superior? It hasn't happened in this game yet, but I'll admit to have getting lost in macros on occasion in other games, and when everything else is going on, it can be quite stressful to find your orientation.

[Steeled]

Saying .3 seconds to move out of something is completely off topic since while we are pressing our bumpers we never let go of our thumbsticks which is the movement aspect, controllers actually are much better for moving around and argueably give us more time to mess with our skills since we can get to where we need to quicker.

That's not what I meant. The 0.2 seconds to press the bumper and then press the key combination is what I meant.

Again, it feels weird at first but once you get used to it you can do stuff that fast, this is a completely foreign layout so it feels clunky to begin but after playing a bit it feels completely natural and I can bust out any move I want almost instantly.

At least give us a way to tone down all the options. One alternate bar is preferable for me. Sorry, but we all have pressed a button combo too fast and ended up completely in the wrong macro set (or at least I have^^) and I dislike the idea. I prefer as much to be readily available as possible.

[evilsohn]

Never touch a running system and this system is pretty damn awesome.
Before Final Fantasy I played SWTOR with my PS3 pad via motioninjoy and my layout was similar to this; a bit better I thought at first, but it turns out that this layout is superior.
I use the functions of R1 and L1 as it is mapped now a lot, but if there is one suggestion I'd have it would be R2+L2 - with motioninjoy I Set my L2 as ctrl and my R2 as shift, so I could go ctrl+1-8 or shift+1-8 or ctrl+shift+1-8.
But other than that there is no need to change it at all.

[Conradus]

That's not what I meant. The 0.2 seconds to press the bumper and then press the key combination is what I meant.



At least give us a way to tone down all the options. One alternate bar is preferable for me. Sorry, but we all have pressed a button combo too fast and ended up completely in the wrong macro set (or at least I have^^) and I dislike the idea. I prefer as much to be readily available as possible.

What you have to do is organize your hotbars for situation. Put everything you may need in .2 seconds on one hotbar. You live on that hotbar. You put stuff you don't have to do on an instant's notice on the other hotbar. You don't need to put up Stoneskin on a second's notice (you *can't* put up Stoneskin on a second's notice). You put Stoneskin on the second hotbar; needing two button presses to get to it is good enough.