The way Square Enix depicts our characters...are we helpless, or are we heroes?

[Kilta_Firelotus]

From my understanding of mmo ingeneral. We are heros just not the main heros the games are not about us but about every character ingeneral. Unlike most single player games where the story is about your character. Also to not the story only just begun. Our characters are still learning whats going on. And we don't really have an active stance on things yet.

[gifthorse]

Everything about single-player story modes in an MMO is essentially retarded. Even if it makes you feel like a hero, you arent. FYI.

[Betelgeuzah]

Everything about single-player story modes in an MMO is essentially retarded. Even if it makes you feel like a hero, you arent. FYI.

This.

We are ordinary adventurers that find themselves in the turmoil of the world-changing events. We can not be the "heroes" because that would be ridiculous. We are in a world inhabited by tens of thousands of people, and they are all "the chosen ones"? We fight against fearsome bosses with our friends (at least in the future, I hope) and in the end "I" am the hero that saves the day?

If there are true "heroes" or "legends" or whatever, those are chosen by the community. Making us all "heroes" is just part of the Western unique individualized snowflake mindset that does not translate to an MMO at all. Me and my 20 000 friends are all heroes, because there can't be any losers!

It does have great potential for a comedy however.

[Abriael]

This.

We are ordinary adventurers that find themselves in the turmoil of the world-changing events. We can not be the "heroes" because that would be ridiculous. We are in a world inhabited by tens of thousands of people, and they are all "the chosen ones"? We fight against fearsome bosses with our friends (at least in the future, I hope) and in the end "I" am the hero that saves the day?

If there are true "heroes" or "legends" or whatever, those are chosen by the community. Making us all "heroes" is just part of the Western unique individualized snowflake mindset that does not translate to an MMO at all. Me and my 20 000 friends are all heroes, because there can't be any losers!

It does have great potential for a comedy however.

Too bad that you blatantly ignore the undeniable fact that the main storyline is *already* seen from a purely single player point of view.
The "tens of thousands of people" already talk with exactly the same NPCs, the react exactly in the same way, and do exactly the same thinsg, thousands of times. Unless there is some dimensional displacement, that's obviously a single player point of view.

And that's not only for the main storyline quest, but for *ALL* quests in this and every other MMORPG.

Thus, there's absolutely no incompatibility with the current *single player driven* storyline and the player being portrayed as the hero. That's all there's to it.

We fight against fearsome bosses with our friends (at least in the future, I hope) and in the end "I" am the hero that saves the day?

You are. Or at least you should be, on your screen only. What happens on other people's *single player-driven* storyline doesn't concern you and your view of the story. It's that simple.

This even besides the fact that it's absolutely silly to present ANY character as a completely flat and depthless gawking goon in ANY game, let alone the player character.

But ultimately, again, you may have not noticed, but in *every* mmorpg, traditional quests are *all* a matter of single player storytelling.

[Betelgeuzah]

Too bad that you blatantly ignore the undeniable fact that the main storyline is *already* seen from a purely single player point of view.

There is only select few "heroes" in the storyline. Not you and 20 000 people like you. The storyline being portrayed from a "single player game's" PoV is not the potential issue here. The heroes are the same for everyone, thus there are no tens of thousands of heroes, because that is silly. The people you play with and see every day can not all be the heroes. The heroes must be something special and unique, otherwise they cease to be heroes. In single player games this is true. In the storytelling method XI and XIV uses, this is true. In other MMO's, there are tens of thousands of heroes. If you can't see the difference, I feel sad for you, mr. Hero #12548.

This even besides the fact that it's absolutely silly to present ANY character as a completely flat and depthless gawking goon in ANY game, let alone the player character.

nope
just
you.

But ultimately, again, you may have not noticed, but in *every* mmorpg, traditional quests are *all* a matter of single player storytelling.

Single player storytelling in an MMO environment. How hard is it to understand the difference?

[Abriael]

There is only select few "heroes" in the storyline. Not you and 20 000 people like you. The storyline being portrayed from a "single player game's" PoV is not the potential issue here. The heroes are the same for everyone, thus there are no tens of thousands of heroes, because that is silly. The people you play with and see every day can not all be the heroes. The heroes must be something special and unique, otherwise they cease to be heroes. In single player games this is true. In the storytelling method XI and XIV uses, this is true. In other MMO's, there are tens of thousands of heroes. If you can't see the difference, I feel sad for you, mr. Hero #12548.

You can feel sad for anyone you like (lol at this completely empty flamish statement), but you continue to purposedly miss the point. Those "tens of thousands of heroes" do *not* exist in each player's personal questing world. You don't have "tens of thousands" of people talking exactly with the same NPCs, doing exactly the same things, acting in exactly the same way, visiting exactly the same place. It does't make the slightest sense in a shared world, wether they are "heroes" or not.
That's why, for every traditional quest in every MMORPG out there, the "tens of thousands" you continue to bring forth as a mantra simply do *not exist* in the storytelling. They are completely inconsequential.

nope
just
you.

You don't have very clear the difference between "any" and "every". Portraying *any* character as a dullard that has absolutely no pesonality is simply bad storytelling.

Single player storytelling in an MMO environment. How hard is it to understand the difference?

There's no difference at all. The storytelling in *every* traditional quest in *every* MMORPG is seen from an *exclusively* single player point of view. It exists and develops in each player's screen completely detached from everyone else's. There's no way to make the story make the slightest sense otherwise (and that's why developers never even waste resources trying).
Take any traditional quest in any MMORPG and you could easily transition it to a single player RPG without making any change. The same goes from the other way around. The distinction you're trying to make to prove a rather false point simply does not exist.

Mind you, it's much more fun and involving to be mr. Hero #12548. tha to be mr. Passerby random dullard #12549.

[Cendres]

Everything about single-player story modes in an MMO is essentially retarded. Even if it makes you feel like a hero, you arent. FYI.

That's pretty much the main problem with starring you as the hero, this is an MMO you and everyone else that's an adventurer defeats the very same baddies? No, I always liked that it made more sense for adventurers to assist the actual heroes of the game, the NPCs. It even bothers me that we are referred to as the prophesized hero in the easter event I just see it as tongue in cheek but I have a feeling they might do exactly what the OP wants regardless if it makes any roleplay sense because people think it's cool.

[PikachuLink]

Duh We're Helpless Heroes

[InuraBera]

Well, minus the fact that we travel around the region armed and kill animals and the occassional bandti, we aren't very much yet are we? Be that you are a high Ranked Archer, or merely a Botanist, compared to a well organised and disciplined foe made ready for a true war, you are but a bug to be squashed.

Heck, at the beginning you have effectively just jumped off the back of a turnip truck and now you expect to be the Hero? Even in the main story they keep letting you know that there is plenty of others like yourself on The Path - you are not any more powerful or special than anyone else in the world, minus the ability to use the Echo - yet.

Saying that, my character hasn't appeared to be a 'slack jawed gawper', generally taking things in her stride and being generally pretty stoic - at least compared to my Path Companion, who is a bit of a coward (Lalafell Male). Once we truly begin reaching power above that of your average person, I would agree with you, but as of now we are merely 'Adventurers' getting paid to bring beasts to heel and keep the City-States generally secure.

With the story ongoing, I believe we will get our chance to truly shine, rather than just be caught up in the transition from peace to war, I truly feel that the current Story-Quests are pure foundation work (even though we can't reach the next ones unfortunately). Also, I doubt you would see your character ever actually do anything in a cutscene - even World of Warcraft, with your nigh untouchable power, has you beaten like a small child and cower whenever anything happens, plus, the fight is your fight when you play, rather than standing toe-to-toe in a cutscene then getting instantly beaten down in the actual gameplay.

Not that I wouldn't like to see it mind, I just don't see it happening!

[Demacia]

Why even fight the enemies when you can play a little mini game that wins the fight for you. I will agree that FFXI never made you feel like the hero until the very end of CoP and throughout most of WoTG. At least in WoTG the cutscenes show your character fighting (with the limited animations they were able to use).