The way Square Enix depicts our characters...are we helpless, or are we heroes?

[SilvertearRen]

As it is now, I've noticed this in a near-constant basis with FFXI and XIV:

Our characters are not depicted in an actual battle against the antagonists in cutscenes. We often are shown standing around helpless, staring onwards in shock and awe. By the measure of any self-respecting warrior, that would be weighing a real warrior down.

Example Cutscenes:

The intro cutscene at Limsa Lominsa where you stare in awe and shock at the Leviathan jump.

Spoiler: Rank 46 Futures Perfect Storyline Quest, when the Garlean Legatus shoots your Path Partner.

What I want to see from Square Enix in the future, is our characters past Rank 50 being proper Adventurers, and not slack-jawed gawkers.

Here's an example of what I'd like to see, using a hypothetical scenario:

You're a R70 Dragoon, and you're fighting against the big-bad Garlean Legatus. Instead of being a pansy and letting other "key NPCs" do the fighting for you, your character actually locks blades with that Legatus and fights competently, even going as far as to actually whup his ass. Complete with badass fighting techniques similar to those exhibited by the NPCs in the Futures Perfect storyline quest.

While this would take more work animation-wise in regards to the various different classes there are (due to the different weapon types and combat styles), I think the payoff would be a more satisfying visual experience in the Crystal Tools Engine.

Plus, it would make people feel a little more payoff for having gotten a character up to that rank.

It's pointless to have a Rank 50+ DoW character standing around doing jack-all in a major storyline cutscene. It's like Square Enix is telling us that we're just an accessory to the stories they're doing. :P


--New Addition--
And worst of all, the cutscenes as they are now doesn't give the sense of reward a player wants to experience for having completed a storyline quest (or even reaching the rank required for that quest) - Square Enix's cinematography for the cutscenes in FFXIV in regards to the player character's role and actions in the context of the story has been extremely lacking, in both FFXI and XIV.

In short, while our characters are hailed as heroes of the realm by the NPCs and the storylines, we don't feel that way at all, because the cutscenes do not give us the cinematography that a real hero would be given. Think of a cutscene involving Lightning from FFXIII. She's executing acrobatics, she's shooting as she flies. She's pulling off aerobatic moves against her opponents.

Do we see our characters doing that in FFXI or XIV? No. And that is a crying shame, because the Crystal Tools Engine is designed specifically for this kind of thing.

My solution would be a necessary change in cinematography direction by the team responsible for cutscenes and storyline quests in FFXIV, to change the stories from a "We need you! Come with us." perspective to, "You've got to beat the enemy's ass down, and we will sing your praises if you pull it off -- by showing your character dishing it out on that enemy, Final Fantasy style!"


Edit: C&P from one of my later posts in this thread, for convenience's sake:

If you've beaten the R46 Futures Perfect cutscene, pretend that your character is the one that actually fights the Garlean Legatus in that cutscene, rather than simply being off-screen...only then can you really see what I am trying to describe here.

Here's what I imagine about 6 months from now if Square Enix listens to this thread: My character as a R70 Dragoon, getting a chance for a rematch against that Garlean Legatus, and after a "normal" combat sequence, a regular combat cutscene ensues, showing the gunsword vs. lance battle in close quarters, with sweeping camera angles and highly animated movement. The battle shows a great deal of carnage, environmental destruction, and intense fighting. Towards the end, the Dragoon pulls out the ace-in-the-hole move (could be the equivalent to Chaos Thrust for Lancer) and finishes off the Legatus.

Then a normal cutscene begins with the Legatus uttering his last words. :3

This isn't about simply fighting the enemy as a hero of the realm, it's about Square-Enix's methods in presenting our characters in the cutscenes.

POTENTIAL SOLUTION

It would be fairly simple for them to have "special characters" that could be replaced with yours during an epic fight cutscene depending on what class you are.

That's an idea! Look at the R46 Futures Perfect combat sequence against the Garlean Legatus. We have NPC characters that are Thaumaturges, Conjurers, "rogues" (technically doesn't count as a class-specific character for now), and so on. If your character was a pugilist in that cutscene, she could take the place of Yda.

That's an interesting idea that could be conceptualized further...

-Addenum-

An example! Let's say we have a core group of NPCs that are part of the main storyline quest as the central characters. They are backed by a squad of generic NPCs from each DoW and DoM class. A cutscene ensues against an epic enemy, and each and every single one of those NPCs are depicted attacking that enemy in accordance with their skills.

So let's say you went into that quest as an Archer. You'd be replacing the Archer NPC in the cutscene. You'd be depicted firing off a barrage of arrows in a stylized "Arrow Helix" move. As a Lancer? You'd replace the generic Lancer NPC. You'd be depicted jumping into the air and bringing down your lance upon the enemy.

It works! In fact, this model of cutscene approach could be applied to party-based storyline quests, too!

[Randis]

i have to agree. Unlike in the offline titles playing the MMO you feel like cannon fodder rather than a hero.

[Corrderio]

I do need to agree since I feel like my companion is the main hero and I'm the sidekick.

I'm pretty much the Vaan of FF14...

[Captaindownsyndrome]

I do need to agree since I feel like my companion is the main hero and I'm the sidekick.

I'm pretty much the Vaan of FF14...

yeah i hate that we seem to have more of a part in 11 then we do in xiv ( but they both kinda left you on side lines) they really need fix this in the later story arcs

[Elexia]

Well since you exampled XI, thing you forgot is:

In the CS, we're merely there and also supporting the main characters of the expansion pack, however we've always fought against the antaganists of the storyline in the actual battles:

Zilartian brothers
Shadow Lord..3 three times.
Twilight God, Promathia
Bahamut..twice.
Omega (Twice)
Ultima (twice)
Odin
Alexander
Diabolos
Fenrir
Lady Lilith
"Altana"
Sentient Crystal
Shanttoto
Kuporich (God father moogle).

So, we aren't helpless, it's just our fight is the actual fight rather than the cutscene, since even in offline FF games the majority of our use is in actual combat rather than CS which is usually just progressing the storyline itself.

[SilvertearRen]

Well since you exampled XI, thing you forgot is:

In the CS, we're merely there and also supporting the main characters of the expansion pack, however we've always fought against the antaganists of the storyline in the actual battles:

Zilartian brothers
Shadow Lord..3 three times.
Twilight God, Promathia
Bahamut..twice.
Omega (Twice)
Ultima (twice)
Odin
Alexander
Diabolos
Fenrir
Lady Lilith
"Altana"
Sentient Crystal
Shanttoto
Kuporich (God father moogle).

So, we aren't helpless, it's just our fight is the actual fight rather than the cutscene, since even in offline FF games the majority of our use is in actual combat rather than CS which is usually just progressing the storyline itself.

I'm talking about cutscenes, not actual battle sequences. The battle sequences are from our third person perspective, not from a cinematic camera perspective.

What I want to see is the depiction of our characters in the vein of an actual protagonist. You know all these cutscenes and battle footage of Lightning from FF13, right? It's very awe-inspiring and attention-grabbing.

We need that for our characters in the cutscenes. Not simply standing around, emoting, or otherwise getting hit like a whack-a-mole!

Edit: In other words, making the player character the central character in a storyline arc, as opposed to being a set-piece for a story.

[GabbaGabba]

yeh i think right now in the storyline, we're still adventurers. i think they want to build up the story as to where we start out as helpless then given the opportunity and time, we become heroes. taking ffxi's storyline for example, the first missions that you got to do around lv50 basically revolved around you being caught in a story and heroes all around you (lion and that batman galka looking guy) once they revealed who the bad guy was, you then were given the chance to become heroes by defeating the shadowlord.

i also think that they want people to feel heroic in groups. everything you did in ffxi was with groups (talking about storyline missions) so instead of making you yourself feel like a hero, you accomplished a lot of heroic things with your group. i really hope thats how it turns out in ffxiv

[SilvertearRen]

yeh i think right now in the storyline, we're still adventurers. i think they want to build up the story as to where we start out as helpless then given the opportunity and time, we become heroes. taking ffxi's storyline for example, the first missions that you got to do around lv50 basically revolved around you being caught in a story and heroes all around you (lion and that batman galka looking guy) once they revealed who the bad guy was, you then were given the chance to become heroes by defeating the shadowlord.

i also think that they want people to feel heroic in groups. everything you did in ffxi was with groups (talking about storyline missions) so instead of making you yourself feel like a hero, you accomplished a lot of heroic things with your group. i really hope thats how it turns out in ffxiv

Yes, you could become heroes in the later storylines, but this isn't about JUST being a central character. It's also about depicting our characters visually as a central character. I want our characters to be fully animated in combat cutscenes against the enemy. And I don't mean like standing bolt upright still with your weapon sheathed and acting all shocked when the enemy character does something "powerful"...

If you've beaten the R46 Futures Perfect cutscene, pretend that your character is the one that actually fights the Garlean Legatus in that cutscene, rather than simply being off-screen...only then can you really see what I am trying to describe here.

Here's what I imagine about 6 months from now if Square Enix listens to this thread: My character as a R70 Dragoon, getting a chance for a rematch against that Garlean Legatus, and after a "normal" combat sequence, a regular combat cutscene ensues, showing the gunsword vs. lance battle in close quarters, with sweeping camera angles and highly animated movement. The battle shows a great deal of carnage, environmental destruction, and intense fighting. Towards the end, the Dragoon pulls out the ace-in-the-hole move (could be the equivalent to Chaos Thrust for Lancer) and finishes off the Legatus.

Then a normal cutscene begins with the Legatus uttering his last words. :3

See where I'm trying to go with this thread, now? This isn't about simply fighting the enemy as a hero of the realm, it's about Square-Enix's methods in presenting our characters in the cutscenes.

[Kaedan]

I agree. I would like to see my character actually act like a hero in the cutscenes. That was the one thing I never enjoyed about FFXI... even though ultimately my character was a hero (since I actually had to fight the NPC after the cutscene), the cutscenes never made me feel like a hero. And it's the same way in FFXIV so far.

[zaviermhigo]

I hate the helpless, eyes wide open, "huh?!", face they give me in every cut scene, I can increase my rank but I can't get that stupid look off my face... :[

edit: they may of made you feel helpless in some cut scenes but I liked it when it was funny, like in FFXI the mithra (sorry names fleeting) from the Aht Urhgan cut scenes treats us like we're the worst possible recruit, and that anyone would be better than me (or you), it was hilarious.