Time Limit In Dungeons

[Solragor]

If they build their own group with likeminded people I don't care what the damn they're in doing in those 90 minutes they get. For all I care they can slow walk and RP their way through there if they want to.
If they're using the duty finder tool without a full party though, that's different.
I don't waste your time - you don't get to waste mine.

[Xbob42]

*snip*

Ugh. If I had a smug bastard like you in my group I'd be glad to slowly walk around and waste your precious time. We all paid for the game, we can play the game as we like. If you're so concerned with goddamn efficiency run with your Free Company. And if you don't have a decent Free Company it's probably because you talk to people like a dick. Running without knowing the strat is what a person who loves video games does. A person willing to die and willing to fail in order to have more fun. You're trying to force someone to go outside of the game to gain information they wouldn't otherwise have. They're just trying to play the game and learn -naturally- how to get better at seeing signs of what bosses do and build a strategy on their own.

Not only are they in the right and you in the wrong, but they're clearly better players than you because they at least have the balls to go in and figure things out.

[Solragor]

le snip

Yeah, right.

I have -NEVER- said that this playstyle is not valid. However, if you do choose to do this, it's your own fault if you do run into problems with the timer. And you don't get to complain if you choose to walk the way of most resistance.
The first solo instance fight of the game introduces you to the timer, everybody knows time is limited in dungeons, so if want to make it harder for yourself, because it's more fun to you that way, you don't get to also whine about it.
Correct, I have said that there is no valid reason to not read a guide. There is not, as long as we're talking about random groups. Neither of us does get to impose their playstyle on the whole group. If I don't like that my random group wants to do things slowly and learn on their own, I'm free to leave. If you don't like to get flamed for not preparing and knowing nothing, you're free to leave as well.
I generally don't leave, because I'm okay with getting first timers through their dungeon, and don't flame and don't care about the time I spend there and if I get to finish or not.
First timers who are willing to learn, of course.
I really don't give a damn what you're doing with your premade group of friends or your FC. Things change when you involve people in your choice of playing the game who may not agree with you.

Secondly, I am not concerned with anything. I have stated above that I don't expect anything from random groups, that would be silly.

I'm not forcing anything on other people. I run my dungeons my way, everybody else runs it their way - however, if you look closely it's actually YOU who wants to force their views on us. You don't like the timer, because you want to wipe and fail? Okay then, do the dungeons with a group of like minded people, if there's so many of you that shouldn't be a problem, am I right?
You're arguing that removing the timer doesn't affect us, but you're wrong. I like having a challenge, I like to try and beat our fastest time with my friends.
Removing the time limit does take this away from us, because there's no challenge involved.

90 minutes is plenty of time to finish a dungeon.

Your real problem isn't the timer, it's random groups. Stop running random, if you can't deal with the consequences that brings with it.
I have run out of time before, I'm not whining about it. I queued again, I did the dungeon again and I completed the dungeon with other people. I queued random, and I had the bad luck to get a group that couldn't complete the dungeon in time. So what?
That's not the timer's fault. That's the group's fault.
Get rid of the cause, not the effect, you won't change anything.

I'm against removal, I'm not against change. As I said, suspending the timer if you lose someone or even extending if people want to watch the cut scenes, fine with me. The clock shouldn't be ticking if you're not in control. I agree with that.

Yes, we all paid for the game. That doesn't make you anymore entitled to your opinion than it does me. You get to play the game however you want. You should, however, keep in mind that this is a mmo. It's not a singleplayer game, you may play however you want, that simply doesn't mean that I or anyone else who wants to run their dungeon quickly need to agree with that.

And last but not least - learning the fight on one's own is simply not the same as wiping several times because people are too dumb to react to mechanics. If you camp in red zones and die, you're not learning, you're bad. That's all there is to it.
A couple of tries to learn a fight (which, generally shouldn't be more than twice because most bosses simply don't have more than a couple mechanics), is well within the time limit, five wipes because a baddie camps in red zones and dies or ooms the healer or screws up the worked out tactic is not.

And interestingly, you don't see me degrading to personal insults or anything like that, I'm just arguing my point. You don't like my point, I get it. Doesn't make it invalid or wrong. The moment you need to insult people to defend your point of view you lose credibility.