Nomenclature is Important

[Cairdeas]

This is not a slam at SE. In actuality I applaud them for doing things differently. But FFXIV has proven one thing to me, Nomenclature is Important.

Right now a huge majority of the Fanbase for FFXIV who speak English as a first language do not understand the Nomenclatures being used. Or they confuse them with Nomenclature from other games. Or try and force Nomenclature from other games into FFXIV.

These practices just do not work.

I'll go through the biggest ones I have noticed that people confuse. I'll add more as I see fit.


1. Auction House Vs Market Ward

An Auction House is just that, A Place where an AUCTION happens. This either the presence of a Blind Bidding System (FFXI) or a Timed Bidding System (Some MMO's). If the feature does not have either of those two features it is NOT AN AUCTION HOUSE. It is simply a Market System.

In FFXIV We currently have the Market Wards. This is a collection of shops that NPC's operate for the player to sell and buy items for the player. The transactions are all exact, there is no bidding and no illusionary "Haggling" it is What You See Is What You Get.

The Major Complaint AGAINST the Market Ward is convenience. And the most Common requested fix is the ability to purchase a item directly from the Market Ward Search Interface. But implementing this feature does not make anything a Auction House. And as is there are a few ways to implement this feature.

The Direct Way - Just buy the item right off. This seems a bit unfair to the Retainers and Vendors. Because when you go and view a Retainers inventory for a specific item you might see they sell an item you might buy if the price is right. So instead of you just buying one item you buy 2. This benefits both players and I feel is lost with the Direct way.

The Taxed Delivery - Implement the Direct Way but include a Tax to get it delivered to either your Retainer or yourself personally. The tax would allow for players to get the item instantly if they are in a hurry, but if they have the time and want to save the money they can go pick the item up themselves. As a result there is still the invitation to a Player to impulse buy from the Retainer they visit when they go pick up their item.
You can include a system where the item is purchased but not delivered but marks the ward and retainer where you go and pick up the item.

Again neither of these fixes that would resolve the major complaints of the Market Wards, turn it into a Auction House.

Request of the Playerbase: Stop using the Blanket Term Auction House when all you are asking for is Convenience updates to the current Market System. As without Bidding Blind or Timed it is not an Auction. Even if everything is done from a central point and linked cross world.


2. Class Vs Job
I've made a major post about this back when the forums first started, I even got it posted as an Opinion Piece on the Eorzeapedia Fan Site. http://www.eorzeapedia.com/2011/04/0...ditional-jobs/

The term CLASS used for FFXIV is not the same as the term JOB used in Final Fantasy XI, or any of the past Final Fantasy's. It also is not the same as Class from other MMO's.

In those instances the term Class is used to refer to a specific archetype of character and the roles they can perform.

In other MMO's the term Hunter is often used for a ranged DD specialist. Thats their role to deal as much damage as possible from far away. They can use Bows, Crossbows, Guns, Throwing Weapons. They tend to have other mechanics like Traps, Pets, or other features.

In FFXIV an Archer uses a Bow. Thats the only classification Archer gives a character.

In Final Fantasy XIV Class as it is used is supposed to mean "Weapon Class" as in a grouping of similar weapons. A user of this class of weapon is simply a specialist for that weapon. Gladiator is a Sword User. That is all the nomenclature in XIV is used for. Gladiator is not a Role, It is not a Tank, a Subversive Fighter, or a Damage Dealer. But It can be, but in reality right now It is simply a Sword User.

SE have realized they had an issue with this and have proposed implementing the classic FF Job System in a new way ontop of the current Armoury (Weapon Class) System.

In Final Fantasy XIV the term Job will be used to help a character define a Specific Role.
Paladin - Tank
Thief/Ranger/Dark Knight - Subversive Fighter
Warrior/Fighter/Monk/Dragoon/ - DD
White Mage - Healer
Black Mage/Blue Mage/Ninja/ - Magic DD
Red Mage/Scholar - Hybrid Heal/Elemental
Bard/Gambler/Dancer - Buffs
Etc.

So in result the Job should define the role, the Weapon should defines how the role is Performed.
Paladin/Gladiator-Sentinel : Tanks through pure Defense
Paladin/Lancer : Tanks through maintaining hate through dealing damage.
Paladin/Thaumaturge: Tanks through self-healing damage taken.
Etc.

No choice should be locked from use, because you will never know what a potential combination might do for a specific fight. it might not be the best for casual play or playing in a group just to XP, but there might be a chance where any combination can be useful.

Request of the Playerbase: Please stop confusing Weapon Classes from FFXIV, Jobs from XI/XIV(When they get implemented), and Classes from other MMOs.


3. Every Final Fantasy ever, has had a RAID.

That is right, EVERY SINGLE ONE. Except. and this is a big exception. FFT.

What is a Raid? A Raid is simply a long expanse of exploration and monster fighting in an area where there is little to no safe spots between long bouts of exploration. Yoshi simply uses a modern MMO Terminology for a Dungeon.

Examples?
Chaos Shrine
Palamecia
Crystal Tower
Giant of Babil
Castle Exdeath
The Cultists Tower
Northern Cave
Tomb of the unknown King
Pandemonium
Every Promyvion and Dynamis
Draklor Laboratory
Faultwarrens

[zaviermhigo]

At max he had two WoW references get over it, it was a good post, I see what you mean by not limiting the class/job combinations because some new job style could be found. I don't know if all will be useful, and I could see the playerbase only doing those which are the best, but not limiting what we can do does fit along with the theme for this game.

[Cairdeas]

At max he had two WoW references get over it, it was a good post, I see what you mean by not limiting the class/job combinations because some new job style could be found. I don't know if all will be useful, and I could see the playerbase only doing those which are the best, but not limiting what we can do does fit along with the theme for this game.

That wasn't really the point of the thread, just opinion XD but yeah thanks.

[Sigmakan]

The world wants to know:
Fatigue or surplus?

[Cairdeas]

The world wants to know:
Fatigue or surplus?

Fatigue was a completely screw up from SE and they are removing it, Though I do see where they were coming from. Its the same system as Rested XP from other MMO's its just backwards.

Instead of it being "Your Rested for XP" Earn xp "Your normal XP" it becomes "Your normal XP" earn xp "Your under detrimental XP"

The Same Effect happens The math is exactly the same. The terms are just inverted. The major problem that came from Fatigue was eventually it would hit 5% or lower which was too severe. But as I said, its going away so its no longer an issue.

[zaviermhigo]

Sorry I guess I just took this part the most than the other parts, and probably did ignore the rest haha
So in result the Job should define the role, the Weapon should defines how the role is Performed.
Paladin/Gladiator-Sentinel : Tanks through pure Defense
Paladin/Lancer : Tanks through maintaining hate through dealing damage.
Paladin/Thaumaturge: Tanks through self-healing damage taken.
Etc.

I meant these combinations, and how the job system would work with the armoury system. I was just saying how those of us probably wouldn't use the pld/lnc option as much maybe due to how people think "this is the best build and we should copy it cookie cutter", a lot people are afraid of pigeonholing but I kind of welcome some pigeonholing if it brings identity, and I thought your system could bring multiple identities to one weapon class. I do get how the job defines what you do, and the weapon defines how you do it, that what this is right?

[Ava]

I don't like people trying to force the community to conform to their opinion of a fundamental game system that only the devs have the proper definition to. You might be right, you might not be. I don't care. But speculation is, in my opinion, one of the few things keeping this game alive. Embrace the different ideas people have.

Personally, I wish they'd get rid of wards entirely, turn retainers into stationary storage facilities, and give us an Auction House. Clearly you're not open to this idea, but who are you to tell me I should think otherwise?

The "classes" or "jobs" or whatevertheheckyouwanttocallthem are obviously tied directly to specific weapon types, which correlates with your opinion; however, the early datamined extended job list also correlated with that idea. Which kind of leans towards "jobs" never existing in the first place. It has always been what you call "classes". Arcanist being a "user of Arcanima", a Mystic being a "user of Mysticism", a Bard being a "user of Music", etc.

SE only mentioned the term jobs at all in the recent letter, and nobody knows what they're going to be, including you.

[Cairdeas]

SE only mentioned the term jobs at all in the recent letter, and nobody knows what they're going to be, including you.

Thats why I used terms like "This is how it should work" and not "This is how it will work."

[Thsscks]

I read it, i repeat plz stop, too much WoW

I'll even quote...


This isnt WoW...

And you.... will hate beastmaster (for its name obviously)

You have made some really stupid replies in this thread. If you are too lazy or don't feel like thinking then just don't post at all.

Nice thread btw. I made the same mistake before with the armory system and jobs. But I definitely like this system. I just hope the job system implementation will add some more content to it.
And for the AH discussion, I have never really understood the fuss about disadvantages of a market warden while I use it myself. I like the systems as it is now. There are more important things to change at the moment.

[Cairdeas]

im sure "Stereotype" would be more appropriate

Also I removed "WoW" from the first post. Happy?