Defiance still lacking in comparison to Shield Oath

[Derza]

You just said that a skill that causes you to heal for anywhere from 70-100 hp every 2.5 seconds for 30 seconds is enough to offset 20% damage mitigation. Think about that for a second.

I said nothing of the sort... I said the combination of the warrior healing skills as well as keeping bloodbath up every time its off cooldown will offset it. Sure if you ignore EVERYTHING I typed before that line i could see how that could be confusing for you.

see this line i wrote "... they compare the damage reductions that paladins have to the ones warriors have and totally ignore all the self heals warriors have?" you just did that... again. I assumed by saying ALL the warrior self heals that i wouldn't have to list them all... guess i was wrong... so here you go... If you use Bloodbath, secondwind, thrill of battle, storms path, and inner beast you can easily offset the damage mitigation that paladins get.

[Faction]

I said nothing of the sort... I said the combination of the warrior healing skills as well as keeping bloodbath up every time its off cooldown will offset it. Sure if you ignore EVERYTHING I typed before that line i could see how that could be confusing for you.

see this line i wrote "they compare the damage reductions that paladins have to the ones warriors have and totally ignore all the self heals warriors have?" you just did that... again.

The combination of warrior healing skills. Hmm, let's think about this for a second.

With an ideal rotation you can use inner beast every 20 seconds.

So every 20 seconds you heal yourself for like 800-1000 at my current gear level. That's 1 cure. It's not even worth it to use inner beast without infuriate from a pure tanking standpoint except in absolute emergencies (in said emergencies, btw, a paladin can actually pop cooldowns WITH MITIGATION. 3 of them.)

Meanwhile bloodbath might heal you for like 1000 across it's entire 30 second duration, and you think this is on the same level as paladin mitigation?

I'd gladly trade all of this inconsequential healing for rampart alone.

[HollowEarth]

use beserk with inner beast. your crappy 800 heal is not cracking 2000 NON crit. oh look we can get an ability to make your crit higher..weird :P

plus maim and the combo after that that heals you (forget its name)

side note if you have bloodbath up and you are using inner beast or all that jazz you are getting double heals. (heals from BB and inner beast plus whatever else damage your doing)

warrior is much harder play, this isnt wow where tanking is a faceroll. warrior are just as viable as pallys. granted there are going to be fights where you want a pally for whatever reason, but i highly doubt the reasonw ill be survivablity or because they take less damage.

[Faction]

use beserk with inner beast. your crappy 800 heal is not cracking 2000 NON crit. oh look we can get an ability to make your crit higher..weird :P

If you pop 2 damage cooldowns, waiting through 2 seconds of animation time, you can then use inner beast to heal yourself for 2000 instead of 800, IF it crits. Then you need to pop infuriate to get your stacks back, or build them up again. During this time you're being healed for 15% less.

...

Yeah, that's still completely insignificant compared to gladiator cooldowns.

plus maim and the combo after that that heals you (forget its name)

You should never be using Storm's Path, the heal does next to nothing. Storm's Eye is way better. Higher potency and an actual useful combo effect.

granted there are going to be fights where you want a pally for whatever reason, but i highly doubt the reasonw ill be survivablity or because they take less damage.

That's exactly the reason why you want a paladin main tanking... and this is already happening. The first time we did HM Garuda with a paladin main tanking the very first thing the healers said was "oh my god this is so much easier to heal." But you haven't even done fucken Ampador yet so what do I know?

This is an old interview, but I'm pretty sure they have kept this in mind moving forward.

"JPGAMES.DE: The marauder is a very good damage dealer and also, for example in the Ifrit fights, a really good tank, even a better one than the gladiator. What are your plans for the marauder and its job warrior? How can the paladin/gladiator keep up?

Yoshida Naoki: We are going to make sure to do everything to get the balance right and then we are going to make adjustments to that. For example, the marauder is going to be a really strong attacker, but we don’t want to spoil all the gladiator’s tank positional skills.

http://www.bluegartr.com/archive/ind.../t-107491.html

the marauder is going to be a really strong attacker, but we don’t want to spoil all the gladiator’s tank positional skills.

Literally nothing in this quote implies either "paladins will be main tanks" or "warriors will be off tanks"

[Sephirah]

Literally nothing in this quote implies either "paladins will be main tanks" or "warriors will be off tanks"

If you're waiting for someone to say "pld is main tank and war is off" you won't find it, but it's also naive of you to think that without saying that, they're both intended to fill the exact same role, they aren't going to let you deal more damage and have better/equal tanking. How would that be fair, why would anyone be a PLD if that was the case? Even on their main website, the description of the paladin says "To be a paladin is to protect, and those who choose to walk this path will become the iron foundation upon which the party's defense is built." (http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/pr/game/#!/jobs/content)

It seems clear to me they intend for WAR to deal more dmg/aoe for offtanking and pld to be main. /shrug

[Faction]

If you're waiting for someone to say "pld is main tank and war is off" you won't find it, but it's also naive of you to think that without saying that, they're both intended to fill the exact same role, they aren't going to let you deal more damage and have better/equal tanking. How would that be fair, why would anyone be a PLD if that was the case? Even on their main website, the description of the paladin says "To be a paladin is to protect, and those who choose to walk this path will become the iron foundation upon which the party's defense is built." (http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/pr/game/#!/jobs/content)

It seems clear to me they intend for WAR to deal more dmg/aoe for offtanking and pld to be main. /shrug

Uhh yeah, you're making your own assumptions and then presenting them as absolute "gotcha" facts. Sorry but that doesn't really work